I don't have a lot of time for this right now, so I'll be (mercifully) brief.
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On 1/30/2003 4:31:40 PM Busdrvr wrote:
Back in 1985, that was the rationale a few folks used at UAL. they got $75k first year pay, but you're ALPA, you know the rest of the story. It does not matter how long you've been there, you should make a certain amount to pilot an A320, PERIOD, otherwise, you are providing downward pressure on industry wages. If 2 years ago, AMR, DAL, and UAL paid it's capt $110 an hour, what do you think your messiah would be paying you?[/blockquote]
Ah, yes, standard tactic. If you can't answer a direct question or offer your own solution, compare them to scabs. Nice. Furthermore, you as much as anyone should know by know that this industry is cyclical. Three years ago you were king of the world. Now you're lucky to have a job. Again, what do YOU think JetBlue and its pilots should have done? Leading pay among national carriers isn't bad.
[blockquote]Somebody has to be the highest paid. do you think it will ever be you? If everybody else undercut you, what do you think will happen at Jet Blue? what do you think AMR and NWA are telling it's pilots as we speak? I'll give you a hint. "We must match the wages at UAL to survive, and to thrive we must match JBlues wages" Is that what you want? Jet Blue wages for the rest of the industry? What happens to growth at jetblu then? Two year Capts? 10 year capts? You've been around long enough to know your big smile isn't what brings in the pax, it's the PRICE and the TV's.[/blockquote]
I don't care if I'm ever the highest paid. There's the concept of "enough" that you seem to be lacking. I am paid "enough". "Enough" changes over time, but for now "enough" is enough. Clear enough? 🙂
Standard tactic #2: If you can't answer with a clear argument, throw out the worst case and hope it sticks. Corollary: Throw in some bad economics.
I know darn well that price is the biggest draw, but you see, JetBlue isn't trying more of your "mine is bigger than yours" games against other airlines. JetBlue makes "enough" money. Even if everyone else in the industry paid JetBlue wages, JetBlue would make money, and it is "enough". It doesn't have to make more than everyone else to be happy. The fact is that the product is better than at most other airlines, so competition on price would not be fatal to the airline. That's why simply matching prices, which has already been tried, isn't working.
So yeah, it's not my smiling face that gets them in the door, but it might bring someone back next time. Actually, I probably scare them off, but you get the idea. Repeat business depends on quality of service, not price alone.
[blockquote]Even after distressed termination of the pension at U, they will STILL have a biger defined benefit pension plan. Are you really that proud that your three year old company has NO plan to offer you a defined benefit plan of ANY type?[/blockquote]
Again, I don't care, I have enough. Besides, I would look at a pension the same way I look at Social Security: it would be nice to have but I can't count on it being there when I retire. I have every intention of retiring VERY comfortably, and all that money will be in my own name. Haven't multiple big airline bankruptcies been enough to drive that point home? Don't be another victim.
[blockquote]What else do they do? enlighten me please? Does Mr ADD give you backrubs at work? Under severe wage pressure from the bottom feeders, we are negotiatin new rates and benefits, please, so that we may negotiate all those wonderful perks you guys have trouble quantifying, please tell me what they are so that we may get them in exchange for 100K in W-2 pay. Is jetblue a better deal than an RJ outfit? absolutely, but I don't think you've ever experienced the way it is at DAL, AMR and yes even UAL.[/blockquote]
I'm kind of out of time here, but let's just say that truly enjoying your work, your work environment, your coworkers, and a trustworthy management has value. BTW, I don't particularly care what I'm missing at DAL, AMR and yes even UAL, because there was little besides the paycheck that ever impressed me about those companies. I was truly torn before I came here as to where I wanted to be. I applied to everyone of course, because you always cover your bases, but nothing stood out for me as THE place I wanted to go (LUV was very close to the ideal, though). Then I came here, and it was an answered prayer, if you like. This whole message is probably completely foreign to you, but I'm very happy to be where I am and no matter what was offered at DAL, AMR and yes even UAL, I wouldn't have it any other way.