Southwest vs US Question #1

[OldGuyinPA]

Uh...Duh...
PSA {The original low cost carrier} did the same thing...
Teams of 3
Parked, Loaded, Unloaded, Biffyed, Watered, Helped clean, Did pushbacks..etc...Sound familiar...

USAIR had a better way...[:blackeye:]

 

[haveaLITTLEFAITH]

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On 8/22/2002 10:43:22 AM

Possible answer to part of your question is (why nobody ever say's this????)They are not a very senior company!!!!!Think about ALL the majors....(U,UA,AA,NW,DL,)WE ARE ALL TOP HEAVY...as far as senior employees.....Top pay...top vaca....top benifits...Their turn is coming very fast since most or all of the current employees start staying around to get to the next level....question????

Of all 40000 U employees....How many have less the 5 years?????(maybe 2000)..... Offer early out's...The company can hire Two newby's for what it cost to have 1 senior agent....Then the cost would start to go down... []
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Excellent point! I might also add that the aircraft SW flies is not as old as ours either. very soon all of the aircraft will age at the same time requiring alot of heavy maintenance for SW at the same time. They will then experience growing pains.

 

[KeepMyJob]

US went head to head with WN at BWI and tried to beat them at their own game - remember - METROJET?
We lost - why - you can't compete with a low cost carrier with a low overhead when your costs are so high - can you say US Airways? We tried to improve on WN's product as to win the passengers over - they could afford to fly a 737 from BWI to CLE at $29.00 a pop....we just could not do that.....and here we are today.......
WN works their employees hard....not too many senior folks there, but they all seem to feel good about their company and they all pitch in to get the job done...Most of them feel like what they do matters....

 

[Get Over It Already]

very soon all of the aircraft will age at the same time requiring alot of heavy maintenance for SW at the same time. They will then experience growing pains.

U assume that SWA operates just like U do. SWA outsources all of their heavy maintenance.

Got 10 aircraft with C checks due? Bid it out. Got 20 due? Bid it out. No growing pains whatsoever, and no leftover baggage to contend with like furloughs if the workload goes down temporarily, which it does as fleets are replaced.

 

[WNjetdoc]

Good post KC, I read the post and figured this person doesn't know much about commercial aviation, thats for sure. I just smiled as I read, "all of their a/c will age at the same time and required a lot of heavy maint. at the same time" I won't even bother...ha,ha.

 

[N513AU]

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On 8/22/2002 10:43:22 AM

Possible answer to part of your question is (why nobody ever say's this????)They are not a very senior company!!!!!Think about ALL the majors....(U,UA,AA,NW,DL,)WE ARE ALL TOP HEAVY...as far as senior employees.....Top pay...top vaca....top benifits...Their turn is coming very fast since most or all of the current employees start staying around to get to the next level....question????
Of all 40000 U employees....How many have less the 5 years?????(maybe 2000)..... Offer early out's...The company can hire Two newby's for what it cost to have 1 senior agent....Then the cost would start to go down... []
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You are exactly right...one problem with the company cutting jobs is that they usually are the junior people, who are the cheapest and most productive. As you shrink your airline, you also drive your labor costs up on a percentage basis. Eventually the whole thing implodes. You can't shrink an airline into profitability. You need to grow it and Dave's pretty clear that he has no intention of doing that.

 

[WNjetdoc]

Get over it...no,no,no. You're only partially correct in your post. We farm out our Full "D" and GE does our CFM overhaul. We do our own 1/2, 1/4 "D" and "C" and on down the line. We have our own shops and do our own overhaul. We have engine build up and hangars in MDW, HOU, DAL, PHX for all of our hangar work. Our AMTs in those areas work thier butts off and do a excellent job. And of course those of us AMTs that work the line do a equally fine job in keeping those a/c flying.

 

[insp89]

N513AU... I have to agree with you,, All Dave is doing is continuing the same old game plan that his predessors had. Set this airline up to sell it. When he gets done whittling away at the mainline operation, and gets MDA rolling, U will fit very nicely into a certain other airline's operation. [Even Ray Charles can see this..]

 

[diogenes]

In many of the out stations, the IAM/CWA contracts specifically allows cross utilization. We have fleet folks working c/s all the time. That's mostly shift trades, and the manager has never effectively utilized this resource, but the point is, it's doable. We ramp rats park, push back, deice, air start, maintain ground equipment and I've got a couple that could fly the thing in a pinch.

 

[StillFishing]

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On 8/22/2002 12:25:21 PM

Yup, lots of old lazy farts sitting around complaining about how things suck. Saying, "that aint my job," ha,ha,ha. As KC said, we have been around for over 30 years and while we do have lots of senior people we also have lots of junior people. But what makes WN a success isn't something you can just copy. It goes deeper than having senior or junior people. It goes beyond coming out of bankruptcy thinking just having lower costs will make you a great airline. Look at CAL, they have done it twice and they still are losing money, but they are a good company to me. I wish you guys luck at U, I really do.
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PLEASE DO NOT COME TO THIS BOARD AND INSULT OR TRASH ANY USAIRWAY'S EMPLOYEE,S.If you have read my post I said it is part of the answer.....You can not sit there and tell me that having 40,000 employee's and out of them maybe 2,000 have less then 5 years time,that this has nothing to do with COST....PLEASE>>>>>>

 

[StillFishing]

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WNJETDOC........


LOOK UP....

 

[UNC HUSKER]

WILL SOMEONE ANSWER THE ORIGINAL QUESTION PLEASE!!!Look at the first post people.[8)]

 

[Oliver Twist]

Thanks UNC for bringing up that point. The ORIGINAL question was pilot wages/productivity between SW and US. Let's take it a step further and specify apples to apples.

What is the number of hours flown per month and the pay rates for both seats of a 737-300 (which we both have)? Can anyone point us in the right direction with some hard numbers and facts??

Chip- any info here?

Thanks again and please stay on the subject.[:bigsmile:]

 

[Oliver Twist]

Surely there is a person in the know as to wage rates and hours flown for a 737-300 Capt/FO who posts here. Change your name if you must before you post- but please do post!

[:bigsmile:]

 

[Oliver Twist]

Autofixer- Thanks for your response about SW being paid by the mile.

Your comments about Metrojet are not what this thread is all about. It is only about pilot pay and hours flown per month for the 737-300 aircraft. If paid by the mile or trip or time flown, it's still pay. What is it? Apples to apples- same aircraft type for both carriers. How many hours are flown per month on average and how much is each paid per month?

Simple question I think- it's amazingly difficult to get an answer for it though.