I have a question... Does everyone on this board that is negative really not give a crap about this airline? Sure management sucks but does everyone not see the need to actually post a profit?! This airline is dying and we're on a timeline now and all of you who say that the concession stand is closed, quit. Some of us would like to keep our jobs, some of us would love to see the benefits of kicking Southwest, jetBlue, and Airtran in the butt, some of us would love to see this airline actually post a profit and then move on from the past and GROW. Grow to cities we've never been before. Grow and compete against the LCC's so they are actually the one's struggling. The LCC's employees make us look like we are spoiled, ungrateful people. This world has changed and for those who haven't seen it, open your eyes. US Airways can't make a profit without a sacrafice from everyone. It's impossible. For all of you that have shares in this company that are only worth $5, just think... if US Airways went from a "$0.10" company to a "$0.06" company just think of the profit we would make and how all of the sudden the price of the stock goes from 5 to 40 dollars. Just think of all of the jobs we'll actually be able to bring back. I'm sure there are pleanty of furloughs that would love to take the job of some of the ungrateful people that post here. Face it, the economy sucks and there aren't many jobs out there so PLEASE be thankful that you actually have a job and food on the table when you get home.
Should The Unions Open Up The Contracts ?
- Thread starter Harry Callahan
- Start date
Jon,
I suspect that this "full pay till the last day/concession stand is closed" crowd is really shaking in their boots. Why do they spend day after day on these message boards if their not concerned?
PitGuy states:
While I guess this is possible, have you checked the unemployment rates lately? I mean, it ain't like the airlines are begging for help after massive rounds of layoffs throughout the industry. Truth is, hardly anyone is hiring for anything close to what Airways is offering, even after another cut! If they are, they're not hiring many, and they have a gigantic pool to pick from! Also, if this is the case, why not leave now? Why be miserable when you are positive that you have a better job waiting for you? B)
I know this sucks, but what alternative do we have? The way I see it is simple. Do nothing, and die a slow death while the LCC's eat away at our market share. Then get laid off after asset sales or during liquidation, or go along with Siegel's plan and hope we can turn this ship around before it's too late!
It's simple economics. You can't spend more than you make. It doesn't matter how we got here, or who's fault it is. The fact is "We are here." You can either suck it up and try to give these LCC's a run for their money, or (if you're fortunate enough) look forward to starting over at the bottom of the payscale somewhere else.
John Mellencamp "The only helping hand you're gonna get in this life is when they lower you in the grave."
I suspect that this "full pay till the last day/concession stand is closed" crowd is really shaking in their boots. Why do they spend day after day on these message boards if their not concerned?
PitGuy states:
While I guess this is possible, have you checked the unemployment rates lately? I mean, it ain't like the airlines are begging for help after massive rounds of layoffs throughout the industry. Truth is, hardly anyone is hiring for anything close to what Airways is offering, even after another cut! If they are, they're not hiring many, and they have a gigantic pool to pick from! Also, if this is the case, why not leave now? Why be miserable when you are positive that you have a better job waiting for you? B)
I know this sucks, but what alternative do we have? The way I see it is simple. Do nothing, and die a slow death while the LCC's eat away at our market share. Then get laid off after asset sales or during liquidation, or go along with Siegel's plan and hope we can turn this ship around before it's too late!
It's simple economics. You can't spend more than you make. It doesn't matter how we got here, or who's fault it is. The fact is "We are here." You can either suck it up and try to give these LCC's a run for their money, or (if you're fortunate enough) look forward to starting over at the bottom of the payscale somewhere else.
John Mellencamp "The only helping hand you're gonna get in this life is when they lower you in the grave."
CLT-Douglas
Advanced
- Feb 12, 2003
- 179
- 2
It's been an interesting night reading these threads after watching the webcast. I did not part take in this poll since I am not an employee. Although, I am interested in the results. As a passenger, I can relate to what Dave had to say. Passengers now have options when flying today. I am not afraid to say I don't look at all my options and in most cases choose my flight based on it's price. Doesn't everyone do this for things they buy? However, I can understand the frustration and the feeling of neglect broadcasted through this site from it's employees. This pole clearly reflects that.
I think everyone has their own reasons for saying no, and I respect that, but it's hard to figure out if the logical solution to doing this if it risks closing down the company for good. Is it because many are willing to gamble with their careers because they think Dave is bluffing? If you think the company can survive and be competitive with out any further pay cuts, then I think that is wonderful news, more power to you. It's a dangerous game to play in such a competitive environment, but I know everyone knows this, or do they?
I think most feel they have given twice and still don't see results. Well, just today I stepped outside and looked up and saw US Airways flying over head. Most would have predicted that sighting a thing of the past by now. Hopefully everyone at US Airways will continue to prove the critics wrong, and find this airline the bright future it desirves. Good luck to you all.
I think everyone has their own reasons for saying no, and I respect that, but it's hard to figure out if the logical solution to doing this if it risks closing down the company for good. Is it because many are willing to gamble with their careers because they think Dave is bluffing? If you think the company can survive and be competitive with out any further pay cuts, then I think that is wonderful news, more power to you. It's a dangerous game to play in such a competitive environment, but I know everyone knows this, or do they?
I think most feel they have given twice and still don't see results. Well, just today I stepped outside and looked up and saw US Airways flying over head. Most would have predicted that sighting a thing of the past by now. Hopefully everyone at US Airways will continue to prove the critics wrong, and find this airline the bright future it desirves. Good luck to you all.
JAMAKE1
Veteran
The decision being put before the rank and file at USAirways is a difficult one. It is not black and white. The skeptics on this board have some valid points. As an outside observer, I can understand their reluctance to conceed further. If there was a leader at USAirways that had a concrete plan for a successful turn-around and communicated that vision to the rank and file, I believe that the rank and file would be willing to get on board. The problem as I see it, is that Dave Siegal hasn't provided a vision or concrete plan that would instill some hope and optimism among the ranks. His speech was unmotivating, he deminished labor, and he appeared very weak. His performance today was very uninspiring. He did not exude the qualities of a confident, competent, or visionary leader. The rank and file has lost complete confidence in his ability to turn USAirways around. The decision before every union employee is a personal one. One has to act according to one's own convictions and that doesn't make a person selfish. I am not a union cheerleader, but I can understand their reluctance to conceed further to DAVE. He has lost credibility amongst the rank and file. After two rounds of concessions and USAirways still badly bleeding, his strategy for reviving USAirways isn't believable. USAirways is in a very unfortunate position because time is running out. Even if the BOD ousted Mr Seigal, it would be a very time-consuming process to find someone who would be willing to get on board a sinking ship. I personally do not feel that David Siegal has the finesse and leadership qualities to execute a successful turn-around. For radical change to occur...and it needs to, fast, you have to get people on board. Unfortunately, Mr. Seigal sqashed that opportunity.
You hit the head on the nail, what has Dave been doing for the past year? He hasn't shown that there is a plan at all, besides to take more from the employees. I would guess this may be his last assignment at UAir. Afterwards, if he gets concessions, they bring in a new CEO that doesn't have to ask for more (right away) so everyone works with him.
As far as all the people out there that say "If you don't like it, quit" Be real, if you quit the company gets what they want anyway.. Anyone that works here knows that they could care less about the employees, except to keep figuring new ways to harass them (Occurences, Doctors notes, etc) As far as Sick time goes, everyone else knows that if morale is good, productivity is good, but they always want to use the heavy handed approach.
As far as all the management type here pushing for a YES vote, they are the only ones that really have anything to lose, where else are they going to find a company that doesn't hold management accountable. Oh yeah, does this mean they won't get there raise in April? Or will they just have to take that as their giveback and break even?
As far as all the people out there that say "If you don't like it, quit" Be real, if you quit the company gets what they want anyway.. Anyone that works here knows that they could care less about the employees, except to keep figuring new ways to harass them (Occurences, Doctors notes, etc) As far as Sick time goes, everyone else knows that if morale is good, productivity is good, but they always want to use the heavy handed approach.
As far as all the management type here pushing for a YES vote, they are the only ones that really have anything to lose, where else are they going to find a company that doesn't hold management accountable. Oh yeah, does this mean they won't get there raise in April? Or will they just have to take that as their giveback and break even?
don't mean to mess up anyones wheaties...but where i work tonite the mood was not really different than any other day...
in fact the general consensus as to the tv broadcast segments of the webcast were:
screw it,i've had enough and i don't really care anymore.
i know some will jump in here..but its what i heard......
i'm talkin' IAM baby......don't expect any saving grace from our side....just what i'm hearing and it ain't on this board...its from the floor.
in fact the general consensus as to the tv broadcast segments of the webcast were:
screw it,i've had enough and i don't really care anymore.
i know some will jump in here..but its what i heard......
i'm talkin' IAM baby......don't expect any saving grace from our side....just what i'm hearing and it ain't on this board...its from the floor.
PCM78- you're right. the "management type" are the one's to lose. They have no union leaders backing them up. And I'm not talking about senior management, i'm talking about the people who work in the little cubicles who are represented by anyone. The people who are the first to take paycuts and the first to get layed off. They are also the people that have NO say in anything because they don't have a union. They are also the lowest payed in the industry.
pitguy
Veteran
- Aug 21, 2002
- 1,509
- 0
I can tell you one thing and that is if you do not work for 'U' it is very difficult to understand why folks feel the way they do. Another note is I only know of one guy that watched more than 5 minutes of the web cast. No one else seemed to care much.
--There are jobs out there for the prudent, skilled, and worthy person who knows how to get them.
mweiss-I have never collected unemployment before, but that is what it is there for. Would you vote for a 25% paycut (and possible vote yourself out of a job) if you were in my shoes?
--There are jobs out there for the prudent, skilled, and worthy person who knows how to get them.
mweiss-I have never collected unemployment before, but that is what it is there for. Would you vote for a 25% paycut (and possible vote yourself out of a job) if you were in my shoes?
It's there as a safety net, but that doesn't excuse you for letting go of the trapeze on purpose.pitguy said:
Depends on the alternative. If the alternative is a 100% paycut and definite voting myself out of a job, then yes.
Meanwhile, I'd have my resume going to everyone I can find.
GadgetFreak
Advanced
Seems to me that the question isnt should the contracts be opened, but rather, what should be demanded in exchange for doing it. Prior changes in management, a more specific business plan, profit sharing, all of the above?
networking
Advanced
- Sep 1, 2002
- 120
- 0
It seems to me other than a few productivity moves (rolling hubs), timeclocks, scheduling, there is nothing left to give. It almost seems that to come back to labor for the umpteenth time they WANT us to say no so WE are the scapegoats. "Well labor wouldn't give so we have to sell assets". What is the REAL plan? As far as the majority of the employees salaries....you know the old saying "You can't get blood out of a turnip"
robbedagain
Veteran
- Oct 13, 2003
- 11,125
- 2,676
I hope siegel doesnt ask those employees in the expressed outsourced mainline cities for a 10% pay that would reduce us in those cities to about walmart wages
but i have afeeling this will occur anyway as our union will probably cave in
but i have afeeling this will occur anyway as our union will probably cave in
PITGuy:SpinDoc said:
Don't forget after voting "NO" to do the following:
1. Get in line at the unemployment office
2. Sell all of your assets to keep out of bankruptcy
3. Hope you have the skills that some other company can use
4. Pay for your next flight to visit family, friends, and to go on vacation
5. Pay for your own health benefits
6. Wait 6 months to 2 years to receive your pension (if you have one) while it is tied up in BK court
7. Change your phone number so that your fellow co-workers who don't want to be on the street won't hound you about your poor judgement
Should I continue, or do you get it yet? [/quote]
:blink: PitGuy are you kidding me??? All those things are going to happen regardless!! Part-time hours are already being cut in many cities. He has been handed the resources over and over and over again. When is he going to start running an airline!!!!!! VOTE NO!!!!!
colorado_cowboy
Advanced
- Dec 20, 2003
- 151
- 0
Spin Doc:
Don't forget after voting "YES" to do the following:
Don't forget after voting "YES" to do the following:
