Pit Transatlantic Flights Going To Bos?

[Revolutions]

Could they reconfigure the 757's to serve PIT-FRA like CO does? (Assuming that the 757's we have are ETOPS capable?)

 

[ClueByFour]

Heres what I'm wondering though- it seems the reason for a focus city is to serve the busy local market, which PIT doesnt have.

It's O&D is greater than CLT.

If you get the half a million boardings back that are estimated lost to CLE and CAK every year, it's probably well into the top 30 markets. What more does US want, considering they have a virtual lock on the place?

For similar sized cities, one need not look any further than RDU and BNA to see exactly what can happen to local O&D numbers once a monopoly hub (and, to be more accurate, monopoly hub pricing) goes away.

 

[ITRADE]

It's O&D is greater than CLT.

If you get the half a million boardings back that are estimated lost to CLE and CAK every year, it's probably well into the top 30 markets. What more does US want, considering they have a virtual lock on the place?

Remember also that CLT loses a fair amount of boarded passengers to RDU and GSO.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

I think this all depends on just what US is going to figure as a "focus city" in regards to PIT. It does seem pretty wasteful to have transatlantic flights to PIT while the European gateway is down the road in PHL. The corporate contracts make sense, but in all honesty, most of those customers would put up with the quick hop to PHL- they'll have to connect anyway.

They have barely enough widebodies to cover the international service they have, and transatlantic is a strength for US. If its more profitable to have those A330s doing PHL-MXP or ATH or what have you then they should be doing that instead of providing redundant service to a former hub.

As for BOS, this would be the best option if they were looking outside of PHL. The potential is there, the traffic is there, but the competition is also. US doesnt have direct competition on too many of its Atlantic routes, and none at all from other US carriers. If they were to have flights from Boston they would have to be serious about gearing it up as a real focus city. There are no perimeter rules there and US has plenty of gates and space. Its time for them to stop wasting space with ERJs to places like RIC and start stuff like west coast and carribbean.

When they built the new US Airways Shuttle terminal at Logan (which is beautiful) a couple years ago, I remember hearing that there are customs facilities underneath. Anyone know if thats true?

I actually kind of hope this rumour is true.

I heard that too.... but we may be in a rumour feedback loop.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Thanks BB.

Heres what I'm wondering though- it seems the reason for a focus city is to serve the busy local market, which PIT doesnt have. It makes me think that PIT can really only serve as a spoke if its not to be used as a hub. I'm unclear as to what PIT will end up looking like- I just dont see much service being supported without connecting traffic.

Its PIT or get off the pot, sort of. Forgive my lame joke.

I disagree.... with a system as large as Star alliance, I think that PIT could be a significant focus city.

All you have to do is serve PIT from other hubs and focus cities of partners, but schedule some of those flights to meet the schedule demand of PIT originators

Then add 5 to 10 high traffic destinations and you've got a pretty effective focus on PIT.

Also, I'd think that PIT would be a good candidate for the LH 737 business service.

 

[USFlyer]

Also, I'd think that PIT would be a good candidate for the LH 737 business service.

I couldn't disagree more. Those flights are designed for business travelers willing to pay for business class service and not making connections on either end. PIT would hardly fit this model.

 

[SVQLBA]

I couldn't disagree more. Those flights are designed for business travelers willing to pay for business class service and not making connections on either end. PIT would hardly fit this model.

I think that's exactly why DCA is suggesting the LH biz class only type service. PIT does have some key international Fortune 500 companies based there (Alcoa, Heinz off the top of my head) who presumably generated plenty of biz class international traffic. That was exactly why LH started the 737 Privat Air service. Dusseldorf (a city very similar to PIT in terms of the industrial region in which it's located) didn't have enough tourist traffic to fill up an A340, but did have enough biz class traffic to fill a 40-seat BBJ. Plus, I don't know why you say no connections at either end. The LH BBJs and ACJs fly to ORD and EWR with plenty of connecting opportunities at both end, and now MUC, LH's 2nd hub. LH chose to have the flights operate from regular terminals rather than FBOs and GA terminals at least partly for that reason also.

Now, whether US would have the imagination or the execution skills to pull something like that off is another matter.

 

[ClueByFour]

I couldn't disagree more. Those flights are designed for business travelers willing to pay for business class service and not making connections on either end. PIT would hardly fit this model.

Bayer, Demag, Seimens. It's perfect for the model.

PIT-FRA can be a nightmare to upgrade, just like PHL-MAN.

 

[MerlinMagician]

I don't actually know the long term schedule in terms of PIT to FRA, but remember one company that has a lot of influence when it comes to this route. BAYER!

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Hey, I'm only going by what you guys say on these boards. I know next to nothing about the Pittsburgh economy.

 

[SVQLBA]

Could they reconfigure the 757's to serve PIT-FRA like CO does? (Assuming that the 757's we have are ETOPS capable?)

IIRC, the 757s that US has can't do transatlantic. Again, IIRC, it's not a range issue but lack of liferafts and other overwater equipment. It was discussed on these boards 6-12 months ago maybe longer, so you can search back for the discussion back then.

I'm sure the board members will quickly clue us back in.

 

[USFlyer]

Bayer, Demag, Seimens. It's perfect for the model.

PIT-FRA can be a nightmare to upgrade, just like PHL-MAN.

How many passengers do these companies generate per day, each day?

 

[WorldTraveler]

It really doesn't make a whole lot of sense for US to try to enter a new international market at this time. Developing new international markets is very costly and you don't do it in the Northern Hemisphere (to Europe or Asia) in the winter.
Given that the US and the EU just failed in another attempt to develop open skies, US's best plan is probably to hunker down for the winter in PHL and develop new routes in the spring. If you absolutely have to fly some international routes, there are unused routes to Brazil since UA just reduced its Brazil service by 1 more daily roundtrip.

 

[ClueByFour]

How many passengers do these companies generate per day, each day?

I don't know the exact numbers, but I do have two nuggets of evidence:

1. On at least two occasions, I did not clear until the gate (as a CP) PIT-FRA, and on each occasion there were at least 5 or 6 folks from Bayer in the cabin.

2. A friend who formerly worked for US in a revenue/inventory analyst position was really bemoaning the loss of PIT-FRA during the CRAF shuffle, due to envoy traffic and cargo revenue lossage.

 

[700UW]

IIRC, the 757s that US has can't do transatlantic. Again, IIRC, it's not a range issue but lack of liferafts and other overwater equipment. It was discussed on these boards 6-12 months ago maybe longer, so you can search back for the discussion back then.

I'm sure the board members will quickly clue us back in.

The 757s all have life rafts and are overwater, there use to be some that were not, but they all are overwater now.