More On 9/28 Alpa Proposal

[ITRADE]

What happend?

 

[NeedForSpeedNFS]

What happend?

[post="186189"][/post]​

Alpa close to a T/A

 

[RowUnderDCA]

The ATSB and the creditors are calling the shots.

Bronner is not.

Bronner is a convenient target for those that want to stir up victimhood and resentment. Bronner has had more patience with labor than TexPac Group would have had.

 

[ITRADE]

Pilots, US Airways near $300 million deal
Airline needs cost-cutting pact to exit bankruptcy
Thursday, September 30, 2004

By Dan Fitzpatrick, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette



US Airways and its pilots union are close to a $300 million cost-cutting agreement that would be crucial for the airline's efforts to exit bankruptcy.


The pact would reduce pilots' pay by at least 17.5 percent, eliminate retiree medical coverage and reduce the airline's retirement plan contributions. "We hit the company's target for the first time ever," Charlotte, N.C., union representative Lance Svendsen said.

Pilots, US Airways near $300 million deal

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Man, the Retiree Health Care hit does seem pretty harsh. Won't that mean continued employment for lots of 60 to 65 retired pilots? Well, that's already happening to former U pilots that have the health benefits. It might be an interesting valuation problem. As the retirement benefits are reduced, more and more pilots will have health benefits in a post 60 career and won't be taking U's benefits anyway.

 

[Winglet]

I think the other employee groups have hit rock bottom on their bottom lines, but it looks like there's plenty more to be harvested from the pilots.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Man, the Retiree Health Care hit does seem pretty harsh. Won't that mean continued employment for lots of 60 to 65 retired pilots? Well, that's already happening to former U pilots that have the health benefits. It might be an interesting valuation problem. As the retirement benefits are reduced, more and more pilots will have health benefits in a post 60 career and won't be taking U's benefits anyway.

[post="186232"][/post]​

This will also prove to be an incentive for pilots to find a job that provides benefits past 60 and jump ship early. A big plus for the company. The company is salivating at the thought of any pilot leaving early and getting some 25 year old with zero longevity to replace him/her.

 

[fatburger]

UAIRQ ALPA......a loser group with no morals to stand on. What a great way to tell a 35 year recently retired pilot that sorry for your mutiple furloughs in your career, your sacrifices you made for the good of the company but we can't afford to give you health care!

What a pathetic bunch of................


-fatburger-

 

[PITbull]

320:


I haven't decided whether to leave U yet. A lot depends on our working conditions after the judge figures all this out. But I tell you I am tempted to stay just to allow you the opportunity to fly as my First Officer. I could teach you a thing or two about being a Captain. And what it means to stand up for the employees of a company that WE built and THEY have torn apart.

mr

[post="186145"][/post]​

Mr,

And I will be your "A" flght attendant...bringing in the Visine if someone should get "dry eyes" with that coffee!

 

[USA320Pilot]

Mwereplanes:

You're not angry are you? How come the RC4 directed NC gave up the DC Plan? Did ALPA cause the bankruptcy? No, of course not. But from a labor perspective the lead it and could have helped prevent the filing.

It's clear you're in denial about the marketplace and who is calling the shots. Staggering LCC growth and Internet booking have depressed revenue and increased security costs, government taxation, and fuel prices are increasing costs.

Get your head out of the sand. It's not my fault that there are people willing to work for LCC and RJ operator pay and benefits, which is the true pressure behind US Airways seeking new labor contracts.

Nor is it my fault that Defined Benefit pension plans have seen unprecedented market value declines due to stock market declines and rising bond market prices that depressed yields.

ALPA's advisors repeatedly told the RC4 that if the union cut a deal last summer the pilot's would have given up 80 to 85 percent of the "ask", at bankruptcy 100% of the "ask", and now more than the "ask". The RC4 was told over-and-over they would give more with their failed strategy. Guess what? The advisors were right and the RC4 wrong. If you're mad, be mad at the RC4 who gave you a worse contract than was otherwise necessary.

With all due respect, you and every other employee have a choice: either accept the pending TA or face "imposition". There are no alternatives.

Best regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[mwereplanes]

There are plenty of alternatives for those of us who do other things beside fly jets.

Problem with most pilots, including you, are that you are willing to work for these types of wages and work rules. That's what has me angry. That and the incompetent management who you so dearly support. Were I not so senior I would have been gone long ago. Depending on MY working conditions I will likely leave by the end of December unless I can get it down to a reasonable number of days. I have prepared for this and am ready to go. As I have pointed out many times. I have no fear because I am ready. That is what separates me from you. That preparation allows me to have a backbone. And stand with the brave men.

You don't get it. If you, and the other pilots, had something to fall back on you would not have to accept ridiculous work rules and downgrading. You would not have to accept (apparently from your posts gleefully) what is happening with this profession. But you and your cohorts have not prepared. Pure foolishness. And now you all will pay the price. That is sad.

This compnay is taking advantage of their incompetence and your fear by taking much more than they need for longer than they need. You know it but you won't admit it. You just roll over and allow it to happen. The 4 tried to fight it but they ended up fighting their own fellow pilots because of your fear and inability to stand for this profession. They're taking more than they need with your consent. They don't need our DC plan. They know it. And you know it. But take it they will. You also don't understand negotiations. Read you posts about giving up the DC plan. That's how I know you have no business skills.

A management who could not forsee the paradigm shift in the business. Who continued hoping against hope the LCC's were a mirage. And did nothing about it. Coupled with the fear you have because you have not prepared or chose to ingore the perils of what happened to Braniff in the early 80's. Add it together and now you will be a copilot once again. And you will accept it. And then you lecture all of us how it was all inevitable. You just don't get it. You never will.

mr

 

[Dizel8]

"It's not my fault that there are people willing to work for LCC and RJ operator pay and benefits."

At least go for the high end, not Eagle!

 

[luvn737s]

When would now be a good time for a strike vote ?( to paraphrase our resident __________[fill in the blank])

 

[WorldTraveler]

I salute you, mwereplanes.

 

[scot]

Lets please stick to discussing the topic of the Thread ALPA Proposal. Thanks.