La Li Lu Le Lo said:
I can say I have been promoted 3 times since I started and gotten several dollars in pay raises based on merit? Can you?
Didn't think so.
Kev3188 said:
Not in a UNION based shop you didn't.
Because in that environment knowledge, ability, and productivity matter not.
The only thing that matters is your start date.
No matter how much you learn or how hard you work your whole career is going to be ruled by your start date.
ChockJockey said:
As can I. I'd been on a corporate fast-track once before and literally started at the bottom (of a warehouse floor) and worked my way into my own office, with a cute title, on the other side of the country in a relatively short time and at a young age. I got there because I busted my a**, never said no, and did whatever it took to get the job done. (Never saw necessary to hold it over anyone else though...)
I mean, as long as they actually are merit based, because what I've noticed from my past and present employers is that oftentimes promotions go to the most conniving and well-connected instead of to the most capable or deserving.
So you got your promotions by working hard but other people (
oftentimes) got theirs from conniving and being well connected.
Well I am about to say something that is going to shock you...... your right. I agree that does happen.
I don't think it happens nearly as often as you imply (
oftentimes).
In my 23 years of employment I have only seen that happen 3 times. Two of those times were in family owned businesses.
ChockJockey said:
I really like this job, and I derive all kinds of value out of it that has nothing to do with "merit-based promotions and raises"; it's given me many opportunities to grow as a person and develop skills that don't include me immediately whoring them out to an employer for a raise or title change as you seem to imply any good American should.
So you don't feel you have an obligation to leverage your skill and experience (gained on the job) for your employers benefit?
What do you think they are
PAYING you for?
ChockJockey said:
I will sincerely say I'm glad it's worked out for you, but what I don't understand why it's so important for you to come here and try to guilt trip people for getting paid more and try to shame them for their relationship with labor,
I am not trying to guilt anyone.
I simply don't understand how an employee feels justified demanding more and more when they have invested
NOTHING to increase their value over decades of employment.
I know many on here won't comprehend this but (in my opinion) you don't deserve a raise simply because you exist and happen to belong to a UNION.
ChockJockey said:
the only logical explanation I can think of is the distress it's causing you that so many thousands of people have been so undeservedly placed closer to the pay scale you'd picked yourself up by your bootstraps to attain.
Distress?
Hardly.
I left that environment of my own free will.
The only distress I ever felt was putting up with people that showed up for a "free check". The very same people who believe they are entitled to do so simply because they exist and have a seniority date. Usually while spewing UNION propaganda.
I might change my perspective if you can explain why you feel an employee who took a non skilled entry level job with no real qualification requirements and a short training period, made a career out of it, is paid mid 20's per hour with full benefits, is entitled to demand more pay and benefits.
I mean when you get down to it that is really what this whole thread is about. You have a group of people that feel entitled to better pay and benefits simply because they exist and have UNION membership.
