JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA AMTS

[DallasConehead]

How will cc seniority work in the future?

Use your amt seniority
Or
Start with a new cc seniority

LAA and LUS employees working in premium classifications (i.e. lead/crew chief or inspector) first placed in order of Occupational Seniority dates and Basic Classification Seniority dates. Then LUS employees slotted into integrated list in pre-merger order of Premium Classification dates. Report at 34-39

http://www.usaamerger.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Javits20Summary20Memo20and20Chart2012-27-16.pdf

 

[MetalMover]

How will cc seniority work in the future?

Use your amt seniority
Or
Start with a new cc seniority

Unless I didn't read the report entirely or correctly, he left this issue up the association in negotiations.

 

[Duke787]

LAA and LUS employees working in premium classifications (i.e. lead/crew chief or inspector) first placed in order of Occupational Seniority dates and Basic Classification Seniority dates. Then LUS employees slotted into integrated list in pre-merger order of Premium Classification dates. Report at 34-39

http://www.usaamerger.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Javits20Summary20Memo20and20Chart2012-27-16.pdf

I think this is just for the integration of the seniority lists for the merger, not for how future CCs seniority will work.

Thanks just the same.

 

[DallasConehead]

I think this is just for the integration of the seniority lists for the merger, not for how future CCs seniority will work.

Thanks just the same.

Oh, ok, I guess the sentence "employees working in premium classifications (i.e. lead/crew chief or inspector) first placed in order of Occupational Seniority dates"
has some kind of different meaning I'm not aware of.

 

[Vortilon]

I think this is just for the integration of the seniority lists for the merger, not for how future CCs seniority will work.

Thanks just the same.

Looks like the method Javitz used was to slot the LUS Leads in the combined seniority list using the equivalent of their occupational seniority. Then the LUS Leads were rearranged amongst themselves according to their Lead seniority rank - without gaining an advantage on the LAA Leads. I guess it seems fair enough from what I see.

The alarming yet not surprising thing I read, is how many people were attempting to convince this guy to rewrite the rules for their own benefit.

 

[MetalMover]

Looks like the method Javitz used was to slot the LUS Leads in the combined seniority list using the equivalent of their occupational seniority. Then the LUS Leads were rearranged amongst themselves according to their Lead seniority rank - without gaining an advantage on the LAA Leads. I guess it seems fair enough from what I see.

The alarming yet not surprising thing I read, is how many people were attempting to convince this guy to rewrite the rules for their own benefit.

Yea, I first thought the LUS were mainly given their basic classification time ala the LAA way. I too think this is very fair the way he explained it.
And I agree that many people wanted decisions tailored to their personal situation.
He also addressed the TWA seniority methodology quite extensively. He also explained that Kasher's ruling was binding and he would not and could not alter that ruling.
I do not see anything majorly unfair in his ruling except for the tie breaker...some people may have wanted age to be the tie breaker rather than one's ssn.

 

[WeAAsles]

TWU hits another home run. Way to go TWU.

http://www.twu.org/blog/tabid/84/vw/1/itemid/928/default.aspx

 

[AANOTOK]

TWU hits another home run. Way to go TWU.

http://www.twu.org/blog/tabid/84/vw/1/itemid/928/default.aspx

Now, now, lets give credit where credit is due. This was a victory fought and won by all three unions and others. Lets not pat the TWU on the back too hard W!

http://docket_pdfs.gcg.net/aam/11-15463/12825_15463.pdf

 

[WeAAsles]

Now, now, lets give credit where credit is due. This was a victory fought and won by all three unions and others. Lets not pat the TWU on the back too hard W!

http://docket_pdfs.gcg.net/aam/11-15463/12825_15463.pdf

Well we'll give the thumbs up to all three then. It's spectacular when I see those institutional Unions all coming together for our common causes.

 

[swamt]

Thanks for posting WeAAsles.

Looks like Javits went with the AA seniority method. Where the LAA Crew chiefs neither lost or gained, the LUS Lead Mechanics gained.

Probably a good move. Now it's time to move onward.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

That is one thing I never liked about the TWU culture. Members speak of brotherhood and fighting as one but when it comes to layoff time senior people see junior people as nothing more than sacrificial lambs.

I can see how in some ways seniority is a good thing (such as guarding against age, race and sex discrimination). On the other hand it is disgraceful to see lazy, worthless employees keep their job only by the "merits" of their seniority date while hard working junior people hit the street.

We all know it's true.

3 disagrees..... people really do hate the truth.

I mean doesn't this post from the forums self appointed UNION cheerleader just sum it up?

I have a cushion of almost 1000 FT below me and around 800 (almost all) PT.

Modern UNION culture in one sentence.

Coworkers summed up as a number relevant to his personal security.

That is what modern UNION culture is. It is not about how can we work together to meet a common goal. It is now about how YOU can benefit ME.

Cushions, B scales and buyout packages.

The IAM pension.... more like the IGM pension.

The Association, the perfect trifecta of propaganda, socialism, and social engineering.

 

[paul1]

With the combined list for title one is it safe to say usair only has about 2300 a/c mechanics. There was a usair seniority list for 2013 that show 3559 total mechanics but that was to include auto shop gse etc.

 

[Matt1200]

The true up pay is confusing. I still feel that the employees and the company would have been better off receiving their new wages as of August 5th. To figure out how many hours that were due to employees is confusing. The union should have had their entire contract complete and told the company that if they wanted and needed mechanics to work on each other's aircraft that we want our contract signed. The company since has dragged their feet to get this contract done. The LUS current contract is up in 2018 and that is when we will get a new contract.

 

[bigjets]

3 disagrees..... people really do hate the truth.

I mean doesn't this post from the forums self appointed UNION cheerleader just sum it up?

Modern UNION culture in one sentence.

Coworkers summed up as a number relevant to his personal security.

That is what modern UNION culture is. It is not about how can we work together to meet a common goal. It is now about how YOU can benefit ME.

Cushions, B scales and buyout packages.

The IAM pension.... more like the IGM pension.

The Association, the perfect trifecta of propaganda, socialism, and social engineering.

[/ can look at the TUL mech wanting AA to take money spent on rent it PIT and have that money invested in TULE, then the other mechs in the bay all clapping.

You can look at DFW not getting along with management and losing all sorts of work mainly to Miami. MIA has 3 hgr bays and 2 phase insp. (Meaning hundreds of mechs) DFW has 15 plus hangar bays and NO phase insp but does have over 300 guys on transfer list to dfw, it's funny how coincidentally there are hundreds of mechs commuting to Dallas to go HOME for the weekend, but the IGM can't be bothered since there is so much OT for themselves.

3 disagrees..... people really do hate the truth.

I mean doesn't this post from the forums self appointed UNION cheerleader just sum it up?

Modern UNION culture in one sentence.

Coworkers summed up as a number relevant to his personal security.

That is what modern UNION culture is. It is not about how can we work together to meet a common goal. It is now about how YOU can benefit ME.

Cushions, B scales and buyout packages.

The IAM pension.... more like the IGM pension.

The Association, the perfect trifecta of propaganda, socialism, and social engineering.

You can look at the TULE mech who said the money used for rent on PIT base, should be used on upgrades for tule and then all the mechs cheered, or you look at the dfw mechs with their current campaign. Over 300 mechs on transfers to dfw but not to worry dfw mechs are getting OT.

Look around how many guys would stab you in back for a 4 over or solicit manager for job continence. Look at ORD engine change crew, so many guys complain and file grievances against the crews OT but nobody bids the crew. So many willing to take from other union members.

But that's the culture, look at the retirees sueing to take our equity, remember when a junior mech would get wronged, the old union guy would say there's no fence between here and united. Closing our locals or the unions not taking a vote, forming the association.

I am optimistic about the future though with today's management and the association. We have seemed to move away from old style of union guys.

 

[DallasConehead]

Over 300 mechs on transfers to dfw but not to worry dfw mechs are getting OT.

Dude, don't you think that axe you been sharpening all this time is there yet?