I Have An Idea

[hammerhead]

No they did not,

CAL is the reason why the bankrutpcy laws were changed.

What do you know about losing a job to bankruptcy?

 

[700UW]

What do you know? I know plenty!

 

[hammerhead]

And found out it didn't work, it took Gordon Bethune to finally turn around the mess that Lorenzo made out of Continental. Now Continental is one of the best paid, best run Legacy Carriers in the industry.

because the employees took it in the pills with concessions....and management(bethune) had almost full control.

 

[Dizel8]

I am curious Mr USAPilot, when do you draw the line, when is enough enough?

The company has shown, that even though they sign a contract, they have no intent of honoring it. This they have done time and time again. At the same time, they told the Mechs that they would not outsource, the ink was drying on the contract with their new HVY MX provider."

Or how about the shut down in MCO? What a nice gesture that was and perfect timing to boot.

Dave was going to be different, but he was not. It was the same old shenigans, but with a younger face. Not to worry though, he got his money, even though he truly did little to deserve it.

I think what you fail to understand, or perhaps wish not to, is that people are tired of empty promises, threats and intimidation. "Take this or I shut it down".

There is unity within the mech and related unions. They stand tall and refuse to vote on something that will see between half and tow thirds their friends furloughed. The pilots have been all to happy, to give whatever was "needed", they ate their young and those whos hard work made U, the retirees.

While I can understand, that you wish to continue receiving a paycheck, I must ask, if you realize the many who will suffer for your actions and that the execs will be laughing all the way to the bank.

So I ask again, when do you personally think enough is enough?

 

[hammerhead]

What do you know? I know plenty!

oh, you know plenty? does that mean you know how to prevent all this bankruptcy stuff? liquidation?

 

[700UW]

It means I know how it transpires. No way to prevent it, it is too late and too far gone.

The damage is beyond repair. Thank Jerry Glass.

 

[700UW]

more from our favorite poster:

USAirBoyA330:

USAirBoyA330 said: "Then why bother responding? Unless your free to discuss it...then why post something?"
a320 pilot answers: Legal, company, and union plans are usually confidential, but to suggest there is no plan of attack is wrong. ALPA has a plan and according to legal and financial experts, outside of the union, it presents a very compelling argument. Siegel is playing with a "time bomb" here and there is a very good ALPA plan in place - it will be interesting to see how this plays out.

I think you and others will be surprised.

a320pilot

 

[hammerhead]

It means I know how it transpires. No way to prevent it, it is too late and too far gone.

The damage is beyond repair. Thank Jerry Glass.

I guess I better study up on this jerry glass dude.

 

[WorldTraveler]

Phoenix,
not sure you were referring to about coming out of the closet but let me clarify for the benefit of all. I believe I can accurately see the airline industry from both a labor and management perspective.

I am in a management type job and not labor. However, it is management's responsibility to manage labor relations along with all of the other things they do. There are very rare situations where I believe labor causes the downfall of a company. It is management's job to see the trends that are taking place in an industry and in their company and work with labor to ensure success. There are many examples of extraordinary labor-mgmt relations in large American businesses, including a few airlines (historically, Delta, Piedmont, and more recently Continental along w/ several LCCs more recently). CO's turnaround was because Mr. Bethune was dead honest w/ the employees about what it took to turn that company around, made the employees fully a part of the turnaround process, and rewarded them for their contributions with far more connection between pay and performance than is typically seen in the industry.

CO employees are not the highest paid in the industry but they are some of the most productive in the legacy industry. At the same time, their management has made some very good moves such as turning EWR into a gold mine, 757s over the Atlantic etc.

It takes a shrewd management team and cooperative labor relations to make an airine work. Sadly, I think US has been missing both for a good long time and I don't think the lack of either can be blamed on labor.

 

[700UW]

I can go on for days:

Posted: Feb 20 2003, 07:12 AM
Lou:

There are jobs available for US pilots with international carriers, within the U.S. military, and the federal government. These international jobs pay more than the current US Airways ALPA contract and in my case I would begin flying for an international carrier as a Captain, if I elect to take a position outside the U.S.

I agree that there are only a few U.S. airline jobs for pilots available at places like Southwest and JetBlue for those inclined to start over, but there are options out there and I am not afraid of the shut down of US Airways.

What's interesting is I believe Siegel understands the majority of the pilot group understands this point as well.

a320pilot

Time will tell what occurs for all those arm chair quarterbacks and message board posters, who lack the courage to identify them self, but I believe the pilot pension issue can be worked out to ALPA's satisfaction.

Siegel has come to far to let the restructuring fail, but stranger things have happened.

Nonetheless, nobody should underestimate the ALPA or rank-and-file union resolve, to take whatever action is necessary to keep the DB retirement plan in place.

By the way, it has just come to my attention a former "old" Piedmont senior executive believes there will be a settlement reached between the parties to keep the pilot DB plan in place...we'll see.

a320pilot

 

[OldGuyinPA]

A second AMEN....320JetJockey

It's over. Some realize it, others don't. The sign from the freeway said....the last person leaving ....Please turn out the light. Game, Set, and Match.

 

[funguy2]

LCCs, RJs contracts, 911, security costs, alternate ground trasnportation, fuel prices, and internet booking is not the problem. It's management and those CCY lairs.

LCC's: a problem before 9/11/01:
Southwest: born 1971. (BWI invasion began in 1992).
America West: born 1983.
AirTran: born as ValuJet around 1994.
JetBlue: born Feb 2000.
Frontier: born July 1994.
Midway: born 1979. (PHL hub 1991-1992.) Died 1992.
PEOPLExpress: born 1981, died 1987.

Alternate Ground Transportation - a problem before 9/11/01:
1804: First haul by a steam locomotive
Dec 2000: Acela debuted
Interstate system developed 1950's-1990
1962: AT&T introduces satellite communications

Fuel prices:
Adjusted for Inflation, the oil/fuel prices were higher in 1980-1981.

Internet booking:
Priceline.com: born Feb 1998
Cheaptickets.com: Website launched 1997

So what has management been doing from 1978 until 2001 to ensure long term success, and specifically to combat the threats you have outlined? Apparently not much. Maybe these things are the problems... Or maybe the problem is that management failed to recognize this for years, and in the process has bankrupt the company and almost ensured failure?

You see, the issue is that US Airways management has created long-term expectations of thousands of employees. These people now have to adjust to their new situation, which in many cases, such as the IAM, is a lose-lose situation... They lose if they vote themselves out of a job and they lose if they refuse to vote themselves out of a job... So why should they do management a favor when management could have begun planning in 1978, or say 1989, for long-term success? After all, Southwest is still using many tenets of its planning developed in the 1970's, with some tweaks to encompass today's reality.

 

[Phoenix]

Phoenix,
not sure you were referring to about coming out of the closet ...

It was just a joke. US320pilot is very pro-company. He started throwing out all kinds of fanatical posts that he views as "pro-labor". Thus the joke, He is really a "closet" pro-labor kind of guy.

But I guess if one has to explain the joke then it sort loses its humor... I'll keep my day job.

 

[PITbull]

World Traveler,

Personally, I believe senior managment brought in the wrong folks in labor relations. These were not experts in the business of "labor relations", but rather in the business of "busting unions and breaking employee spirit", as a means to an end. consequentely, ALL of labor has absolutely NO RELATIONSHIP with management.

We on the "inside" know this all too well. This is the stark difference between companies who succeed and those who do not. Its all in who you hire, and what caliber of person and back ground expertise in the business of labor relations. Keep in mind, U brought in two labor relations VPs in spring of 2002, and literally pushed aside the existing VP and stuck him in employee relations with non-labor employees. That VP had been on the property for eons and knew the psyche of labor. U didn't care.

They brought in their own hinchmen. Though one of those VPs has resigned, he is back on the property as a "consultant", no less.

Evil is as evil does....

 

[pitguy]

Close the doors if Mechanics 'need' to give any $$$, work rules or benefits.