More Facts and Less Emotion
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- Feb 10, 2004
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Did you change your Avitar? Where is Chucky?
Handbilling
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BoeingBoy
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- Nov 9, 2003
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- #32
PineyBob,
I can't answer about the IAM contract, but the pilot's contract has a house purchase provision (at least it did - who knows anymore). Don't remember all the specifics off the top of my head, but there was a time limit, the company would buy as last resort (had to be on the market so long), and the price was set by appraisal (and the company's appraisers were notorious for low-balling back when many of the pilot crew bases were being closed in the early 90's).
Jim
I can't answer about the IAM contract, but the pilot's contract has a house purchase provision (at least it did - who knows anymore). Don't remember all the specifics off the top of my head, but there was a time limit, the company would buy as last resort (had to be on the market so long), and the price was set by appraisal (and the company's appraisers were notorious for low-balling back when many of the pilot crew bases were being closed in the early 90's).
Jim
Bob,
Bit and pieces of the home sale allowance in the current contract. It is one of the now famous letters of agreement and would have to be amended since it only mentions GSO,IND,EWR and RDU. "will cover 8% of the sellers costs (6& brokers commission,2% closing costs). The Allowance will be based on the actual sales price of the home and will not exceed $50000.00. The marketing and selling of the home will be the responsiblity of the eligible employee. Usairways will not purchase the home under any circumstance". So it is not as good as everybody thinks and will not apply to closeure of any of the current bases as written.
Bit and pieces of the home sale allowance in the current contract. It is one of the now famous letters of agreement and would have to be amended since it only mentions GSO,IND,EWR and RDU. "will cover 8% of the sellers costs (6& brokers commission,2% closing costs). The Allowance will be based on the actual sales price of the home and will not exceed $50000.00. The marketing and selling of the home will be the responsiblity of the eligible employee. Usairways will not purchase the home under any circumstance". So it is not as good as everybody thinks and will not apply to closeure of any of the current bases as written.
Tim Nelson
Veteran
True the flying public cares about low fares but there is an element of sympathy for workers. The question is always, 'who does the IAM intend to see this." Or who is this directed to, not necessarily the passengers I might add.USA320Pilot said:
Passengers are involved by the handbilling but it may be a tool that the union is using to let its members see a certain perception. Of course, in the end, handbilling, and other manufactuizations are just tools that in themselves don't point to a particular labor outcome.
To put another way, who do you think your management 'intends' its newsclippings to be read by. I mean even though passengers read the USA Today, etc and see all these statements by your management, IMO I believe your management really intends their public statements [carefully manufactured and then brilliantly facilitated] to be read by its employees.
I think the handbilling is for the IAM members to 'see'. And handbilling is a good tool to boost worker solidarity, regardless what % of passengers sympathize with it. But what the labor organization does with that increased solidarity/activity is always subject. Will they use any potential solidarity generated to serve the organizations interest, the members, or both? Let's hope to serve its members.
Regards
28yearsnojob
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- Jan 2, 2004
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Hey TIM when is the iam going to help all the layed off employees in the small cities that they let get contracted out and the guys in pit that lost there jobs on the ramp.colorado_cowboy
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- Dec 20, 2003
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Bob if you listen very closely you can actually hear the doors at US Airways closing .... forever!
Than it'll be the Unions fault for not giving in to the company's demands for more concessions.
Damned if you do and damned if you dont.
Tim Nelson
Veteran
Look, I am no IAM advocate for sure [a member in bad standing], but clearly the IAM has to take some responsibility.PineyBob said:
Ironically though, several of the smaller stations voted in favor of being reclassifed and as you say 'sold out' as opposed to 2 of the 3 biggest hubs CLT and PIT who voted against the last contract.
But let's give the IAM some credit if they finally follow through with their wise talking words this time. Will they ultimately force Bronner to reconsider his horse? Unless I'm reading things wrong, it appears to me that the IAM is willing to negotiate and give concessions, just not to the current management team who they have labeled 'inept'. So it may be up to Bronner to do what he wishes. Such is an insecure position for any employee, but to be sure, the fate of this company is certainly not up to the IAM members no matter how much your Corporate spin doctors and media try to manufacture consent otherwise.
colorado_cowboy
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- Dec 20, 2003
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Bob your all over these boards one minute your for the union the next your against it.
Under the topic IAM News your quoted as saying "Hopefully it will end in a profitable, growing and expanding company with opportunites for employees to grow and ultimately prosper" because of the rumor of outsourcing catering and Central Load Planning but yet on this matter your taking a completely different stance on the loss of jobs because the company decided to farm out work and layoff a U employee. Its hard to have a debate with someone when they themselves are constantly changing their agenda.
Straddling the fence is easy especially when you have nothing to lose but ff miles.
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- #41
Bob, let me enlighten you.
28 is not telling you all the facts, from his posts I gather he worked in STL, STL was expressed before the Fleet or Customer Service contracts were amended to include mainline express.
When a station is closed or expressed the employees (if their seniority permits) have the right to transfer to another mainline station to keep their job, wages and benefits or now under the new contracts they can become mainline express employees with a substantial paycut.
He chose not to transfer with his job and chose to take the layoff.
Each CBA has its own procedure for displacement and layoffs.
Another thing is that this company has eliminated over 20,000 jobs since 9/11 and there are not enough jobs to cover 20,000 gone.
And for the mechanic and related the IAM just got all the employees who were laid off without 10 days notice, paid their 10 days or they can have extra vacation if and when they come back to work.
28 is not telling you all the facts, from his posts I gather he worked in STL, STL was expressed before the Fleet or Customer Service contracts were amended to include mainline express.
When a station is closed or expressed the employees (if their seniority permits) have the right to transfer to another mainline station to keep their job, wages and benefits or now under the new contracts they can become mainline express employees with a substantial paycut.
He chose not to transfer with his job and chose to take the layoff.
Each CBA has its own procedure for displacement and layoffs.
Another thing is that this company has eliminated over 20,000 jobs since 9/11 and there are not enough jobs to cover 20,000 gone.
And for the mechanic and related the IAM just got all the employees who were laid off without 10 days notice, paid their 10 days or they can have extra vacation if and when they come back to work.
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- #42
STL was mainline only with the past year and a half or two years ago I believe it went to all RJs.
As for 28, ask him why he chose to take the layoff instead of transfering?
He made that choice, not the union and not the company.
And the last time I checked unions don't layoff people, companies do.
As for 28, ask him why he chose to take the layoff instead of transfering?
He made that choice, not the union and not the company.
And the last time I checked unions don't layoff people, companies do.
colorado_cowboy
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- Dec 20, 2003
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IF this were a perfect world we wouldnt have the problems were facing now Bob. Please, lets stick to reality.
Fact is this isnt a perfect world and for me to sit here and ponder the idea of U turning the corner to such a degree they would have consecutive profit making quarters is IMO a waste of time and energy.
We can sit here and debate all day long but IMO this ship is going down Bob. I worked for a company that went bankrupt in the late 80's and although that company had nothing to do with the airline industry it was Union and it did all the same things that U's management is doing now and no matter how hard I worked and how much I gave the end result was the same. So please dont talk to me about IF
28yearsnojob
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- Jan 2, 2004
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:down: Bob 700 dead wrong STL DAY BTV AVP and MEM mainline stations until
union sold them out in dec of 2002. ALL inside agents protected by CWA on the inside with mainline express status. They had choice stay with mainline in a express classification which means new pay wage but keep all company time and vacation time ,health benifits, and pension, or transfer to another mainline city. Iam agents on outside (FSA) did not get that choice ,THere only choice was to bid another mainline city,there work was contracted out,any other mainline city that
goes express the Fleet service agents have a choice whether to stay and work the ramp as mainline express or bid another mainline city. Example CLE MKE ABE are
mainline express inside and outside.THe agents in these cities have a choice and the rest of any mainline cities that go express that are now mainline. IN other words the IAM did not proctect these cities like the CWA did .
union sold them out in dec of 2002. ALL inside agents protected by CWA on the inside with mainline express status. They had choice stay with mainline in a express classification which means new pay wage but keep all company time and vacation time ,health benifits, and pension, or transfer to another mainline city. Iam agents on outside (FSA) did not get that choice ,THere only choice was to bid another mainline city,there work was contracted out,any other mainline city that
goes express the Fleet service agents have a choice whether to stay and work the ramp as mainline express or bid another mainline city. Example CLE MKE ABE are
mainline express inside and outside.THe agents in these cities have a choice and the rest of any mainline cities that go express that are now mainline. IN other words the IAM did not proctect these cities like the CWA did .
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- #45
How did the union sell them out? If it was in 12/02 the Fleet Contract had mainline express language all ready.
And did you not have the CHOICE to go to another station and choose not to?
And who ratified YOUR contract?
Not the negotiatiors, it was the rank and file fleet service workers, so look in the mirror for once and accept responsibility for your own actions instead of blaming others.
And did you not have the CHOICE to go to another station and choose not to?
And who ratified YOUR contract?
Not the negotiatiors, it was the rank and file fleet service workers, so look in the mirror for once and accept responsibility for your own actions instead of blaming others.
