Food For Thought: Lower Pay Or No Job?

JAMAKE1

Veteran
Feb 15, 2003
637
16
SFO to DAB
Hello Everyone:

I just wanted to share my story. I am a former USAir employee from many years ago and most recently I was working as a flight attendant for United. Last September I opted to take a voluntary furlough for four years so that I could continue my education. Unfortunately, my unemployment benefits in California ran out after the federal government denied the state funds for continued benefits. When I took my leave from United, I think I sort of romanticized about how effortless it would be to find another job. When the semester ended, I embarked on finding full time work over the summer. I was applying mostly for restaurant jobs hoping to make fast cash and thought that my 12 years experience of being a flight attendant would qualify me to be a waiter in a fine-dining restaurant. I have to tell you, it hasn't been easy finding work. I even expanded my options to being a food runner or a busser and it has still been difficult finding employment. I am competing along side former dot-comer's all vying for ONE position. I have worked for four airlines in my career and the difference between then and now is that at the time, the airlines were hiring hundreds, if not thousands of people. Hence, hundreds or thousands of positions. In this economy, everyone is vying for the same ONE position. While I do not regret my choices of having left United, I have become very humbled by the marketplace realities. I have exhausted my savings and have come perilously close to having to dip into my 401K.

Having said that, I just want you all to consider the consequences of USAirways going into Chapter 7 liquidation. For you flight attendants, is it less painful to have to take a 23% pay cut, while maintaining the ability to have up to 15 days off per month and some schedule flexibility or is it better to risk it all and then hope that you can land an equivelant paying job, with only 8 days off per month? In this economy, there are very highly educated people working in restaurants or Starbucks to get by. I am not trying to preach and tell you how you should think. I fully undertand wanting to stand by one's principles and convictions in order to put a stop to the further erosion of this profession. I just want to point, that there will be consequences either way. By sharing my experience over the past year, hopefully it can assist you in making fully informed and conscious decision as to whether to suck it up and take the bad dose of medicine or to exercise your right to self help.

As an employee of a legacy carrier also in bankruptcy, I can understand your collective rage at the way this industry has transformed. I can also empathize with your collective betrayal toward senior management. It sucks for everybody who had grown accustomed to a certain standard of living and lifestyle. As bad as it will get, which will be the lesser of two evils. Food for thought...
 
Out of the mouth of someone who is out there, living the REAL world. Of course, they will only say your preaching to the choir out here. In a few months their writings will contain the words "hindsight"!

Good luck and stay persistant.
 
Yes I wonder how long it's going to take before we start hearing about Siegel and Wolf's salaray in this thread and how management has screwed up USAirways.

So I'll state it now:

All of that is totally and completely irrelevant. I would think that the smartest goal would be to keep this company afloat as long as possible and if you can't live with it then voluntarily look for a job ASAP.
 
Your mistake is assuming the employees can keep this company afloat.

We cannot. Nor can any judge. The incompentence that runs this airline will sink it. Regardless of what we do or don't do.

mr
 
JAMAKE1 said:
Hello Everyone:

I just wanted to share my story. I am a former USAir employee from many years ago and most recently I was working as a flight attendant for United. Last September I opted to take a voluntary furlough for four years so that I could continue my education. Unfortunately, my unemployment benefits in California ran out after the federal government denied the state funds for continued benefits. When I took my leave from United, I think I sort of romanticized about how effortless it would be to find another job. When the semester ended, I embarked on finding full time work over the summer. I was applying mostly for restaurant jobs hoping to make fast cash and thought that my 12 years experience of being a flight attendant would qualify me to be a waiter in a fine-dining restaurant. I have to tell you, it hasn't been easy finding work. I even expanded my options to being a food runner or a busser and it has still been difficult finding employment. I am competing along side former dot-comer's all vying for ONE position. I have worked for four airlines in my career and the difference between then and now is that at the time, the airlines were hiring hundreds, if not thousands of people. Hence, hundreds or thousands of positions. In this economy, everyone is vying for the same ONE position. While I do not regret my choices of having left United, I have become very humbled by the marketplace realities. I have exhausted my savings and have come perilously close to having to dip into my 401K.

Having said that, I just want you all to consider the consequences of USAirways going into Chapter 7 liquidation. For you flight attendants, is it less painful to have to take a 23% pay cut, while maintaining the ability to have up to 15 days off per month and some schedule flexibility or is it better to risk it all and then hope that you can land an equivelant paying job, with only 8 days off per month? In this economy, there are very highly educated people working in restaurants or Starbucks to get by. I am not trying to preach and tell you how you should think. I fully undertand wanting to stand by one's principles and convictions in order to put a stop to the further erosion of this profession. I just want to point, that there will be consequences either way. By sharing my experience over the past year, hopefully it can assist you in making fully informed and conscious decision as to whether to suck it up and take the bad dose of medicine or to exercise your right to self help.

As an employee of a legacy carrier also in bankruptcy, I can understand your collective rage at the way this industry has transformed. I can also empathize with your collective betrayal toward senior management. It sucks for everybody who had grown accustomed to a certain standard of living and lifestyle. As bad as it will get, which will be the lesser of two evils. Food for thought...
[post="185319"][/post]​

So wonderfully said, Thanks you for your insight and much needed reality check for many of our "same pay to the last day" employees. I just finished a post graduate degree that took 4 long years to complete. And although im still employeed, I am actively looking for a job. My field is not overcrowded, but i'll tell ya, ITS DAMN DIFFICULT finding employment. There are lots of others who have lost jobs becuase of the economy and post 911. If everyone HERE would stop blaming past mgmt decisions and take a "real" look at the world, they would have a reality check as to whats really waiting for them in the unemployment line.

I wish u the best , dont give up! Something good will happen, and it will be worth the wait. Education is never for naught. Best of luck and thanks for your honesty, and reality check! PEACE
 
I honestly believe that all of CWA feels this way.... im ready willing and able to walk away with my 20 yrs, nowing full well that I have given my all and I am confident that I can and will carry on when this company goes under knowing that those greedy bast***s in CCY, ya know Bronner and Kremlin (oops Crelin) and all the other a**holes that have taken and taken over and over again... to them I say go to H*** ... I will be sad that this once good company will be history, but I will have satisfaction for my self, that they will go down with me...

Sorry to be so harsh and or self centered, but I watch and listen to the boards, I listen to our Paxs and of course I have a conscience (although I cannot spell that good, hehehe) and I know and have known that CCY head honchos do not have a clue and cannot even buy one.

As you can tell from my profile I have been a member of this board for a long time and I don't post alot but the blood pressure has risen and the tempetures have also risen as well, I just had to let it out....I can go one and blast individual posters from my standpoint but I will not do that (not yet at least but I reserve my right to do that a future date) just remember that as my "mother" has told me all my life, "what goes around ,, comes around"..

With the temporary pay cuts that most likely will be imposed upon us, it makes me angrier and most resolved to shut the F***ker down

NOW, anyone and everyone can blast off now....
 
I have been out for 2 yrs and its hard to replace something that you love to do.As a mech most of us do the work because like everbody else its in the blood. but it comes a time when you have to look out and see that you are nobody but a number and the way this company has been ran for yrs all the pay cuts are not going to help, you can work for free and they will still loose money. Look out and see whats going on we in the US are going the worng way more people are taking pay cuts and the rich are getting richer. Bush talks about the new jobs that he has made but what he not telling is that that person was making $20.00 now theyare making $6.50.
I have turn down a couple of airline jobs because I feel that someone with 25 yrs should make more than $9.00 /hr as a mech .

as big E sang THE END IS NEAR ....... :rolleyes:
 
usairrwe said:
I honestly believe that all of CWA feels this way.... im ready willing and able to walk away with my 20 yrs, ........


Then why don't you? Let the rest of the dedicated, willing and wanting employees stay and try to save the company if they can. Let them choose if the paycuts are worth it.
 
usairrwe

Your emphatic comments are exactly correct in regards to CWA members. You speak for the majority. This department has been beaten down with vigor over the last couple of years. During the last round of concessions a lot of the junior agents had the "shut it down" attitude without any hope of backup from the senior agents. Now, along with yourself, the majority of senior agents are on the same bandwagon. That goes to show how bad it is in that dept.

Everyone just drags a** to work everyday and hopes that when they get there someone will tell them it's their last day. Moral is down the tubes. Their attitude is if management is planning to outsource Res., then just get on with it already.

Res. used to be a great place to work but, management has screwed it up royally with their "prison" like atmosphere, horrendous fare rules, benefit and pay cuts, ridiculous call transfer policy which equates to a "no customer service" policy. They have our passengers so p***ed off that the agents have no idea why we even have passengers at this point.

It's a real shame that it has come to this but, unfortunately it has. The most senior loyal agents have finally been broken too and just want out.
 
mwereplanes said:
Your mistake is assuming the employees can keep this company afloat.

We cannot. Nor can any judge. The incompentence that runs this airline will sink it. Regardless of what we do or don't do.

mr
[post="185340"][/post]​

Mwereplanes-

Isn't it management that is trying to cut costs? They cannot cut fuel costs and cutting remedial costs will have no significant effect. So if they are unable to get concessions, I don't think you can blame them. They ARE trying. Now it's your turn.

Everyone else-

This is a refreshing thread...so far. I think the majority opinion is finally being heard in at least one thread! While management may not be the best, it is crisis mode and I'm glad that there may be some hope. I hope the best for everyone in these tough times.
 
planejane

If you are a member of the CWA you better open your eyes. You are definately in the minority. Paycuts will be forced upon this group as with all others and this will just anger everyone even more. Can't imagine this group ever voting "yes" to any more concessions. Res. is doomed anyway so why cut your throats when management will do it for you soon anyway. It's just most hope it will be sooner than later.
 
planejane said:
Then why don't you? Let the rest of the dedicated, willing and wanting employees stay and try to save the company if they can. Let them choose if the paycuts are worth it.
[post="185348"][/post]​


I will walk away when I am good and ready and also when I vote NO... got it...now get over it
 
Yea, they are in crisis mode to save their butt! They could care less about the lazy, unproductive, burdensome, greedy, unappreciative, no-good-for-nothing employees!!!!!! They have not one bit of integrity!!!!
 
bobcat said:
Yea, they are in crisis mode to save their butt! They could care less about the lazy, unproductive, burdensome, greedy, unappreciative, no-good-for-nothing employees!!!!!! They have not one bit of integrity!!!!
[post="185354"][/post]​

They are always in crisis mode....I think poster Mark My Words send in another thread... What has stopped them from implementing the other 700 million in cuts...Rolling a hub in PHL...effectivly using the airplanes and crews effiently... why is it that Employees have to carry the burden...in reality with the cuts that will be imposed we now become the Dip financers, does that mean we can deciede who in managements stays and who can go?..... can the employees then vote on what managements pay will be?...

This management team needs to understand that its the employees and their dedication over the years that has carried this airline, and its only the mangement deceisons that have gotten us in this situation due to there lack of hindsight.... or lack of planning....
 
Maybe instead of trying to reach contractual agreements and having unions vote on them, management should just put out a vote to all employees. It would be short and to the point...1. Close the joint. Yes or No 2. Try to keep this ship afloat no matter what it takes. Yes or No. With the promise that they would go with what ever the majority votes. Now that would be very interesting to see.
 

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