Final Descent For Us Airways?
- Thread starter USA320Pilot
- Start date
- Banned
- #17
I know I will get attacked for this but here are some of my thoughts:
1. Piney Bob's and his merry band of cockroaches don't give a darn about any of us employees.
2. They only care about getting cheaper ticket prices and better service.
3. The real reason they met with the company is they want to save their frequent flier mileage.
4. If us pesky unionized workers did not have CBAs US could cut their operating expenses overnight and give them what they want.
1. Piney Bob's and his merry band of cockroaches don't give a darn about any of us employees.
2. They only care about getting cheaper ticket prices and better service.
3. The real reason they met with the company is they want to save their frequent flier mileage.
4. If us pesky unionized workers did not have CBAs US could cut their operating expenses overnight and give them what they want.
700UW said:
Well when looking at it from an enlightened position, can you really blame them? I mean what do they owe us, the U employees? If we make $25 an hour or $5 why would they or anyone care?
Personally I am downgrading my life and becoming the sacrificial lamb for all of the U customers and U's top executives. Hawk really made me see the light with his PM's. I found it hard to sleep and kept tossing and turning and when the morning came, I saw a light and thought it was the sunshine, but it was still dark out so I knew it was a very special light, sort of like an artificial light except it wasn't, it was a real light that only I could see. This special light told me a story, of course I can't tell it here because it was a secret between the captain the Hawk and myself. But after seeing this light, I now know the path I was on was a path full of fatuous folly leading to self destruction. I know for sure that we all must give whatever is asked of us, it’s our destiny, it’s why we were born. It’s amazing how screwed up my thinking was being so self centered and not seeing the entire picture, all I can do is thank my special light for literally enlightening me!
700UW said:
700,
It is not just PineyBob and his merry band of cockroaches as you put it. It is the entire marketplace. They no longer want to pay what it takes to keep salaries where they used to be, to fund overdue pension obligations (especially since so many of our customers do not have DB pension plans), or pay what it takes to subsize service from Fuzzy Nut, NE to some hub 6 times a day. That is a cold hard reality and it is the truth.
If it were simply a miles issue, Bob and the gang would not go through what they do. I am sure someone like AA, DL, or UA would step in and by the DM program for pennies on the dollar to add those Elites to their base and not someone else's.
Keep in mind, your job is to serve them. There is no entitlement to your job. If it worked like a true free market, you would have been out the streets long ago.
- Banned
- #20
N628AU said:
I take offense to that statement, I do my job and I do it very well. And it is a free market place, the company has to be kept in check, that is why there are unions.
If I remember correctly you did not have much time with US before you got laidoff.
If you really want to know how U thinks about its employees ask our Fleet or Customer Service employees how they were treated in 1992 as Employees at Will.
PITbull
Veteran
- Dec 29, 2002
- 7,784
- 456
N6,
That is a pretty blanket statment "true free market system, you'd be out on the street long ago."
The "true capitalistic free market system" could eventually cease to exist, as there would be no "true balance" in the market place.
You have to have a balance of have's and have-nots. Otherwise, the Have's would be the only ones that would be able to purchase and consume...how many do you think that would be with a "self contained" wealthy group of consumers?
Wouldn't make for a "robust economy" now would it?
The "system" allows for Checks and balances. This way there are vehicles built into the "framework", so that the economy keeps on truck'in.
Unions are one element of balance in this "system"...like it friend, or lump it. It is what it is. If that would shift off kilter...you have what many in history would call...
ANARCHY!
That is a pretty blanket statment "true free market system, you'd be out on the street long ago."
The "true capitalistic free market system" could eventually cease to exist, as there would be no "true balance" in the market place.
You have to have a balance of have's and have-nots. Otherwise, the Have's would be the only ones that would be able to purchase and consume...how many do you think that would be with a "self contained" wealthy group of consumers?
Wouldn't make for a "robust economy" now would it?
The "system" allows for Checks and balances. This way there are vehicles built into the "framework", so that the economy keeps on truck'in.
Unions are one element of balance in this "system"...like it friend, or lump it. It is what it is. If that would shift off kilter...you have what many in history would call...
ANARCHY!
PITbull said:
So how does the non union employee exist? I personally am heading to a union free zone and yet I will make a living, on my merits of course. The checks and balances here are simple: you do you job well and are paid accordingly, you do your job bad, same thing and if too badly out the door making room for the next guy who can carry his weight. The benefits are even better than what U offers with unionization, how come? Yes we can agree to disagree pit, but the world does not require unions, believe it or not.
How old are unions? How did anyone survive before they were here?
I absolutely respect you opinions, they are very strong and for the most part right on target, but as per your own words and with this post: here is some of that balance you speak of.
FYI__I AM STILL VOTING [NO] if it even gets that far.
PITbull
Veteran
- Dec 29, 2002
- 7,784
- 456
Cav,
Broaden your thoughts in a "global" sense.
The market place allows for you to change jobs using all the skills and talent you were afforded to learn at U....perhaps get a better job or not, depending on your needs and how much is necessary for you to exist.
The unions have afforded the non-union sector affordable medical, decent salaries, and in many instances, better wages and benefits than union workers.
Think why?
Many employers offer employees better wages and benefits in order to keep unions off the property. Delta, for instance...their f/as are non-union and were the highest paid in the industry. There was a reason that their management conceded to higher wages, and the gauge for that wage was unionized wages.
Yes, indeed, "balance in work place and balance in the market place".
Broaden your thoughts in a "global" sense.
The market place allows for you to change jobs using all the skills and talent you were afforded to learn at U....perhaps get a better job or not, depending on your needs and how much is necessary for you to exist.
The unions have afforded the non-union sector affordable medical, decent salaries, and in many instances, better wages and benefits than union workers.
Think why?
Many employers offer employees better wages and benefits in order to keep unions off the property. Delta, for instance...their f/as are non-union and were the highest paid in the industry. There was a reason that their management conceded to higher wages, and the gauge for that wage was unionized wages.
Yes, indeed, "balance in work place and balance in the market place".
- Banned
- #24
Unions have been around for 100s if not 1,000s of years. Go back to colonial times and there were guilds, a guild is another name for a union.
Unions keep the non-union marketplace's wages and benefits higher.
Union's have done many good things for workers union and non-union alike.
Child labor laws, labor laws in general and safety laws.
Ask yourself why union-busting and prevention of unionizations is a billion dollar business.
It is because management does not want a level playing field in the workplace.
Unions keep the non-union marketplace's wages and benefits higher.
Union's have done many good things for workers union and non-union alike.
Child labor laws, labor laws in general and safety laws.
Ask yourself why union-busting and prevention of unionizations is a billion dollar business.
It is because management does not want a level playing field in the workplace.
Well, let's think about the marketplace, as currently experienced.
First, companies in the marketplace contract among themselves all the time. And if one feels the other is in breach, they'll use nasty, ambulance chasing attorneys to litigate matters straight. So, you'd think the concept of contract would be respected. And it is, unless labor has the gall to have a contract, and dare to dream of it being honored - then the hissing starts. Hypocritical?
If the marketplace is so holy, and so self-correcting, why do its practitioners spend so much corporate time and money lobbying DC? This on the one hand, while on the other, Welch and Barrett bloviate about less government. C'mon, fellas, there would be a lot less of the beast if you'd quit feeding it! Read this li'l tidbit, and see if Barrett sounds like a socialist to you
http://money.cnn.com/2003/10/03/technology/barrett/
Down home, this is called bulls%%t.
And, the last I checked, I was a citizen with a First Amendment right of peaceful assembly (such as at my union hall) well before I knew what a marketplace was.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/co...llofrights.html
Those rights are something the marketplace would like you to forget. The marketplace would like you to view yourself solely as a consumer.
I must be immune to the kool-aid, 'cause that just seems so bassackwards to me!
First, companies in the marketplace contract among themselves all the time. And if one feels the other is in breach, they'll use nasty, ambulance chasing attorneys to litigate matters straight. So, you'd think the concept of contract would be respected. And it is, unless labor has the gall to have a contract, and dare to dream of it being honored - then the hissing starts. Hypocritical?
If the marketplace is so holy, and so self-correcting, why do its practitioners spend so much corporate time and money lobbying DC? This on the one hand, while on the other, Welch and Barrett bloviate about less government. C'mon, fellas, there would be a lot less of the beast if you'd quit feeding it! Read this li'l tidbit, and see if Barrett sounds like a socialist to you
http://money.cnn.com/2003/10/03/technology/barrett/
Down home, this is called bulls%%t.
And, the last I checked, I was a citizen with a First Amendment right of peaceful assembly (such as at my union hall) well before I knew what a marketplace was.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/co...llofrights.html
Those rights are something the marketplace would like you to forget. The marketplace would like you to view yourself solely as a consumer.
I must be immune to the kool-aid, 'cause that just seems so bassackwards to me!
I'm giving the US economy the same treatment I'm getting. Selling a house? Real estate agent wants 6% commission? . . no way, you'll take 2 or I'll do it myself. New car. Forget it, won't pay those prices unless you take 25% off, then we start bargaining. Below your cost you say? Tough, no deal. Need to have the car fixed? Nope sorry, $45 an hour is way more than I'm willing to pay. Do it myself. Buy something and it's not perfect or isn't up to what was advertised. . . take it back in whatever condition and #### till they give you your money back. Minor medical problem? Screw it go to the doc anyway, insurance will pay. Unemployement insurance. You bet, incompetent grossly overpaid management can't make the company work and layed me off and I want every dime I'm entitiled to. A government that can bumble into an unnecessary war and spend hundreds of billions of dollars and a 1,000 of the finest young American lives for people that don't want or don't deserve representative government? Vote 'em out and make room for the next set of clowns. Political party affiliation? Not any more. Just registered independent. Dimwit robotlike campaign workers that knock on my door don't get to do much talking, but leave with an earful. Whenever I see an American corporate officer or senior manager, I think "thief" and "overrated."
- Banned
- #28
Please show me how Mr Roach makes $500,000 a year?
Lets see Mr Roach's department represents over 125,000 members and his salary was for 2003 was $175,207.
The International President who overseas 400,00 active and 300,000 retired members only made $200,000 last year.
Dave Siegel made $750,000 salary for 27,000 employees.
But Bob you all ready know this, sounds like bitter grapes to me.
http://union-reports.dol.gov/olmsWeb/docs/..._20031231_0.pdf
See unlike corporations unions by law have to report to the DOL every single penny they spend and it is on the web for public viewing.
Lets see Mr Roach's department represents over 125,000 members and his salary was for 2003 was $175,207.
The International President who overseas 400,00 active and 300,000 retired members only made $200,000 last year.
Dave Siegel made $750,000 salary for 27,000 employees.
But Bob you all ready know this, sounds like bitter grapes to me.
http://union-reports.dol.gov/olmsWeb/docs/..._20031231_0.pdf
See unlike corporations unions by law have to report to the DOL every single penny they spend and it is on the web for public viewing.
Dilligas
Veteran
PineyBob said:
Wow, bobby, I bet you got all tingly in your jublies when he shook your hand and stroked your ego.
I suspect most IAM members have more important things to do than attend an organized (deleted by moderator), which is all you accomplished.
And when it does turn to feces, most likely you will be stranded in some crappy airport and will have to rent a car to get home, I don't think Bruce will send a jet just to make sure you are the "last one off the last flight."
Get over yourself, bobby. You are insignificant and a joke, and a tool.
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