lpbrian
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- Mar 7, 2004
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This all reads like a North Central/ Southern Air Timetable. A sign of the times. Perhaps Virgin America will step in and fill void.
Delta to Adjust Service to Smaller, Underperforming Markets
- Thread starter 700UW
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This all reads like a North Central/ Southern Air Timetable. A sign of the times. Perhaps Virgin America will step in and fill void.
lpbrian
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WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
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no WT will not come along and blame anyone nor will he defend the cuts that are taking place.
The simple fact is that with fuel at $3 gal and likely to stay that way - and peak even higher at times as OPEC continues to push prices higher without stalling the global economy - capacity has to be cut if prices cannot be raised high enough to cover the costs. It is a simple law of economics and it applies to all carriers.... the ones that act quickly and decisively will be able to keep the losses from affecting the bottom line - and employee paychecks.
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As America learns to live with the new reality of higher fuel prices, there will be things cut across the board... food and other goods which are highly dependent on transportation will cost more.... America's love affair with the car if not controlled will require even bigger and bigger parts of the budget.... and the notion that everyone can fly for next to nothing from any airport where they want will come to an end - as it should have about the first day after deregulation.
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Given the budget crisis in Washington it is doubtful there will be much ability to increase EAS money - and thus the number of cities with air service will fall.
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Earnings reports will start coming out this week... so far, most airlines have been able to cover fuel costs through hedges and fare increases but that will come to an end shortly after labor day. No airline has large amounts of low priced hedges as WN had 5-7 years ago that gave them a distinct advantage; the industry has consolidated and will continue to do so.
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The laws of economics will be better able to work and airlines will be better able to price their product and remove unprofitable capacity than has been the case for decades in the airline industry.
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Thus there is a greater chance that airline employees and their companies' balance sheets will be lessed harmed by high fuel prices in the past.
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The only losers will be consumers who will have to pay for the services they actually use... wha a concept.
The simple fact is that with fuel at $3 gal and likely to stay that way - and peak even higher at times as OPEC continues to push prices higher without stalling the global economy - capacity has to be cut if prices cannot be raised high enough to cover the costs. It is a simple law of economics and it applies to all carriers.... the ones that act quickly and decisively will be able to keep the losses from affecting the bottom line - and employee paychecks.
.
As America learns to live with the new reality of higher fuel prices, there will be things cut across the board... food and other goods which are highly dependent on transportation will cost more.... America's love affair with the car if not controlled will require even bigger and bigger parts of the budget.... and the notion that everyone can fly for next to nothing from any airport where they want will come to an end - as it should have about the first day after deregulation.
.
Given the budget crisis in Washington it is doubtful there will be much ability to increase EAS money - and thus the number of cities with air service will fall.
.
Earnings reports will start coming out this week... so far, most airlines have been able to cover fuel costs through hedges and fare increases but that will come to an end shortly after labor day. No airline has large amounts of low priced hedges as WN had 5-7 years ago that gave them a distinct advantage; the industry has consolidated and will continue to do so.
.
The laws of economics will be better able to work and airlines will be better able to price their product and remove unprofitable capacity than has been the case for decades in the airline industry.
.
Thus there is a greater chance that airline employees and their companies' balance sheets will be lessed harmed by high fuel prices in the past.
.
The only losers will be consumers who will have to pay for the services they actually use... wha a concept.
"People choose to live out there, it isn't the government's job to bring commercial opportunities closer to them."
Are you are wavering
eolesen
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- Jul 23, 2003
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Nope. If there's a road, you don't need air service. If there's no surface transport, be it road, rail, or water, then air service is truly essential; not for business, but for everyday life.
The argument behind most EAS routes developed in thenLower 48 has been to allow small town businesses to survive. Totally wrong in my opinion.
The argument behind most EAS routes developed in thenLower 48 has been to allow small town businesses to survive. Totally wrong in my opinion.
southwind
Veteran
- Jan 22, 2008
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Hmm................. Never saw the words, " How many jobs will be lost ?", in the article you linked to , yet you want to play pitiful-me, I'm being attacked .
Maybe next time post the actual link:
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Delta-to-Adjust-Service-to-prnews-1037600123.html?x=0&.v=1
since your so sensitive, instead of changing the words in the link !
Kev3188
Veteran
I believe the article said another airline would be chosen to fill the gap to the cities Delta leaves. Who on earth could that be? Another reason for a renaissance of regionals. Regionals that are not contractors to the big boys, but with old time interline agreements. Herman come back!
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
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if the markets don't make sense for one airline, the only way they will make sense for another is if they have lower costs - and given that the same airplanes can be used by other carriers, burning the same priced fuel, the only real variable comes down to labor costs.... I don't think any of these markets are served by airlines that have labor costs so high that another carrier can make a difference.
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Given the load factors that DL has published, a regional jet wouldn't work... most of the markets are already served by low frequency turboprops... you could only maintain or reduce the number of seats by using larger aircraft if you operate fewer flights - which makes the schedule less viable.
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The likely outcome is that these INDIVIDUAL communities - not the federal government will decide that air service is valuable enough to them or they will lose the service.
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There are plenty of other communities that subsidize air service... and they are not talking about the difference between the last flight out.
The federal gov't has no choice but to cut expenses deeply... adding/increasing expenses to something that benefits a relatively small constituent group is highly unlikely.
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Market forces need to be allowed to work... if the cities cannot support air service using aircraft/costs which airlines operate TODAY, the service needs to be dropped.
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Subsidizing an airport shuttle between these cities and the next closest city with air service might make a lot more sense.... subsidies of ground transportation can be a whole lot less than for air service. If the issue is really being connected to the outside world, then taking a bus/van the last couple hours is a viable option...
skysamurai
Newbie
- Jul 21, 2011
- 2
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It would be smarter if they only flew fights when they knew they could break even. That's kinda what NW did. The thing we really need to get rid of is the money hungry CEOs.
We need management who know how to leave within their means and are okay not being paid a bunch because everyone would be paid as they should be. Why is it that the more money people have, the less they seem to care about other people?
We need management who know how to leave within their means and are okay not being paid a bunch because everyone would be paid as they should be. Why is it that the more money people have, the less they seem to care about other people?
dapoes
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- May 17, 2008
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Who are you to dictate what people should or shouldn't make? Sounds more like you are merely suffering from envy.
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
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You do realize that most of the cities are PMNW being served by PMNW aircraft and carriers?
NW also made more than a few tough decisions about cutting service when they couldn't make money - just as is necessary for DL to do based on fuel prices.
Dont call me Shirley
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- Aug 20, 2002
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http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/05/us/from-hibbing-minn-a-plea-for-planes-to-keep-flying.html?_r=1
From Hibbing, Minn., a Plea for Planes to Keep Flying
By TIMOTHY WILLIAMS
Published: October 4, 2011
Delta Airlines recently announced that it would probably drop or reduce commercial air service to 24 smaller cities in the United States because the flights are often half-full — or even less — and lose millions of dollars a year. Delta, under an agreement with the federal government, is the only carrier to serve the cities, which rely on the flights to stay connected to the rest of the country. Without the service, they fear isolation, and in some cases, economic calamity. Butte, Mont.; Muscle Shoals, Ala.; Waterloo, Iowa; Pierre, S.D.; Greenville and Tupelo, Miss.; Sault Sainte Marie, Mich.; and Hibbing, Minn., are among the cities where the flights are threatened. Residents of Hibbing, population 16,000, and the heart of Minnesota’s Iron Range — where iron-ore mining is the predominant industry — are particularly concerned. The city’s mayor, Rick Cannata, and Patty Shafer, a city councilor, discuss:...
While the article is about the reaction of the town to the pullout of air service, I did get a chuckle out of this line "Hibbing is a beautiful town. Hibbing has the largest open-pit mine in the world. It’s beautiful. " How proud they must be.
From Hibbing, Minn., a Plea for Planes to Keep Flying
By TIMOTHY WILLIAMS
Published: October 4, 2011
Delta Airlines recently announced that it would probably drop or reduce commercial air service to 24 smaller cities in the United States because the flights are often half-full — or even less — and lose millions of dollars a year. Delta, under an agreement with the federal government, is the only carrier to serve the cities, which rely on the flights to stay connected to the rest of the country. Without the service, they fear isolation, and in some cases, economic calamity. Butte, Mont.; Muscle Shoals, Ala.; Waterloo, Iowa; Pierre, S.D.; Greenville and Tupelo, Miss.; Sault Sainte Marie, Mich.; and Hibbing, Minn., are among the cities where the flights are threatened. Residents of Hibbing, population 16,000, and the heart of Minnesota’s Iron Range — where iron-ore mining is the predominant industry — are particularly concerned. The city’s mayor, Rick Cannata, and Patty Shafer, a city councilor, discuss:...
While the article is about the reaction of the town to the pullout of air service, I did get a chuckle out of this line "Hibbing is a beautiful town. Hibbing has the largest open-pit mine in the world. It’s beautiful. " How proud they must be.
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
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This is my favorite from one of the esteemed members of the city council
Q. Delta says the flights are not nearly full, and that it is losing money. Why should they keep flying to Hibbing?
Ms. Shafer: “A lot of these big companies don’t care about the people. They just don’t care about the needs of people anymore. They only care about their bottom line. If that isn’t greed, what is it? It’s crazy.”
Perhaps if DL said that the way most cost cuts in the airline industry happen is on the backs of employees, the obviously informed Ms. Shafer might be highly shocked if DL suggested that one way to help provide the funding to provide the air service could be to shut down DL's res operations there... but then since she appears to think that the world revolves around her, perhaps as long as someone else gives for her benefit, it wouldn't matter.
Q. Delta says the flights are not nearly full, and that it is losing money. Why should they keep flying to Hibbing?
Ms. Shafer: “A lot of these big companies don’t care about the people. They just don’t care about the needs of people anymore. They only care about their bottom line. If that isn’t greed, what is it? It’s crazy.”
Perhaps if DL said that the way most cost cuts in the airline industry happen is on the backs of employees, the obviously informed Ms. Shafer might be highly shocked if DL suggested that one way to help provide the funding to provide the air service could be to shut down DL's res operations there... but then since she appears to think that the world revolves around her, perhaps as long as someone else gives for her benefit, it wouldn't matter.
eolesen
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- Jul 23, 2003
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I've been to Hibbing. It's a nice place to leave. Looking at the pit is not quite the same as looking at the Grand Canyon or the Tetons...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44-YhnxlDck
When did air service become a public utility?...
The one thing the mayor is right about is that the mines in Northern Minneesoda are making a bit of a comeback. And if they do, there may be demand again.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44-YhnxlDck
When did air service become a public utility?...
The one thing the mayor is right about is that the mines in Northern Minneesoda are making a bit of a comeback. And if they do, there may be demand again.
