Dallas Love Field's Traffic Greatly Increases

[FWAAA]

It would be be interesting to read about the methodology of this "survey," but here is the entire post on airfarewatchdog.com

http://www.airfarewatchdog.com/blog/22823911/poll-results-which-domestic-airline-has-the-best-frequent-flyer-program/

Don't know how they conducted the poll, who was asked, etc. For all we know, it might be a self-selecting survey of airfarewatchdog.com users. Until just now, I've never been to that website. I'd heard of it, but never accessed the site.

Clearly, it's strong evidence that WN and DL are winning and that AA and UA are screwed. Why? Because WT says so.

Over at Flyertalk, AA's AAdvantage program recently won best rewards program for the fourth year in a row:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/todayinthesky/2015/03/03/2015-flyertalk-awards-the-top-loyalty-programs-are-/24307089/

Does that mean that AA has a huge competitive advantage over everyone else? Of course not. Just like this two-bit survey by a website does not mean that DL has any strategic advantage over AA.

swamt: I'm not trying to crap and piss all over your airline like WT recently did when WN won that cargo award - I'm pointing out WT's irrational conclusions which he has drawn from reading the dubious results of this "poll." It's great that WN did so well, but sometimes you display a large amount of exuberance over the most trivial things, like when you post the same article over and over again because the same basic content (sometimes an AP product) was published in yet another newspaper. A little pragmatism would serve you well. Read things like this and say to yourself "at least my employer did well and didn't finish in last place."

 

[eolesen]

Looks like FWAAA and I came to the same conclusions at the same time...
 

What a moron. It has absolutely nothing to do with major players in Texas.  It has to do with WHO was voted the best frequent-flier program-PERIOD.  Good god this is really getting old.  What a dumb-a$$...

All deflections aside, I don't think I'd be quoting a survey of 1500 visitors to a third rate website as indicative of who has the best program.

The real indicator of who has the best program is the Freddie Awards, which saw over 3 million votes cast last year.

WN won one of the five categories for 2013, while AA won four. Neither DL or UA have done very well since switching to the revenue based system, but hey, that could change when the awards for 2014 are announced towards the end of April.

http://freddieawards.wpengine.com/winners-circle/

That or what happens on FlyerTalk are far better indicators to be trumpeted.

 

[WorldTraveler]

of course any survey is rife with bias.

but if you want to toss a survey out because AA and UA ended up below WN and DL, then let's be honest that none of them have value.

you can't tout how well AA or UA do in some surveys and not accept that DL and WN beat them in others.

Marketing is designed to meet the needs of some people some of the time ... but never all of the people all of the time.

 

[swamt]

Getting back on topic;  Here is a good article explaining some future growth in DAL, DCA and LGA as well as more international.  Most of the 2015 growth will be at DAL with direct competition with AA out of DFW:
 
Southwest Airlines Is Becoming Disruptive Again

 

[WorldTraveler]

looks like WN is going to get some competition on MDW-SLC from the carrier that has a hub on the other end of the route.

yet another market with DL service from a DL hub to two airports in a city with a WN hub.

 

[swamt]

A good article about the New Love Field...
 
The Love Evolution | AviationPros.com

 

[WorldTraveler]

this is notable from the article

Does that mean additional gates for the Big-D airports near future?

“No,” says Duebner. He explains the legislation assigns Love Field, which sits on 1,300 acres and is virtually landlocked on all sides, a 20-gate maximum. “We are prohibited from adding more gates,” he says. “Once we get to 10 or 11 flights per day, per gate, that’s as much as the airport is really going to be able to handle.

“It may be the limiting factor of Love Field as we move into the future; that 20 gates is all we have and we have to get the most value possible out of those 20 gates,” he adds.

 

[swamt]

GK very confident on fully utilizing all 18 gates their fullest.  We've heard some rumblings at Love Field that Virgin is going to adjust it's schedule towards their unprofitable flights and this might open a window for Delta to work out another extension to stay.  Looks like Delta will have to work something out with Virgin and the COD, but it will be up to the COD to make that happen NOT any other airline.  Just like GK said in this interview, he will leave up to the COD to accommodate (or not) Delta...
 
Gary Kelly: We’ll be ‘fully utilizing’ our Dallas...

 

[eolesen]

Yep, it wouldn't surprise me in the least to see DL accommodated on the VX leasehold. DL might have to re-time a few departures, but since they don't compete head to head, I suspect something will get worked out.

What's not clear is if DL would be subleasing from VX or from AA, since AA is still the signatory carrier as far as the airport is concerned. Wouldn't that be irony?..

 

[WorldTraveler]

and it is also possible that DAL will tell both VX and WN - neither of which want to give anything to DL - that they have to proportionately divide DL's accommodation between them - which would mean that WN might have to do 4/5s and VX would have to do 1/5 of DL's flights.

and of course DL might have enough data from the latest DOT revenue and share stats to make a case that WN is violating antitrust laws by acquisition of the UA gates and ask that transaction be overturned.

 

[swamt]

Yep, it wouldn't surprise me in the least to see DL accommodated on the VX leasehold. DL might have to re-time a few departures, but since they don't compete head to head, I suspect something will get worked out.

What's not clear is if DL would be subleasing from VX or from AA, since AA is still the signatory carrier as far as the airport is concerned. Wouldn't that be irony?..

Wouldn't it become a sub-lease at that point? When a third party is accommodated for their flights I would think it would be a sub-lease, but what do I know?

 

[WorldTraveler]

the legalities of who has to sign off on what doesn't matter.

The DOT has apparently made it clear that DAL does have the responsibility to accommodate DL who has operated service at DAL for a number of years now while AA and UA have bailed out.

 

[700UW]

If the DOT made it clear, the issue wouldnt be in court.

And no one knows yet if it was a suggestion or an order, once again, that is why its in court.

 

[WorldTraveler]

actually, the PUBLIC doesn't know.

if it was really more than just a suggestion, then WN would have notified DL that it wasn't going to renew the lease and DL would have stopped selling seats.

the fact that hasn't happened is precisely why it is certain that the DOT did in fact not tell WN what it wants to hear and why WN is basically telling DAL to figure the problem out.

And given that Virgin is saying they don't want to give up their gates for DL, it will be up to DAL to come up with some sort of formula where WN will likely have to provide at least the majority of the space for DL"s accommodation.

Virgin has the benefit of the DOJ's order for the use of its gates.

WN has no legal protection for operating the extra two gates and in fact could face an antitrust complaint for the use of those two gates which are further expanding WN's size in a market where they already had more than 90% of the seats - far higher than in any other large airport.

WN will keep trying to kick the can. DL's strategy is undoubtedly to force WN to accommodate it, wait for VX to fail at DAL - VX' flights from DAL to AUS will undoubtedly help speed up the process - and then DL will move into VX' gates.

DL isn't going anywhere from DAL and WN will have to either figure out how to work with the 16 gates that it gained protection for in the 5 party agreement or face a n antitrust suit for controlling more of the airport than for which it has protection at a time when its size at DAL is well above where the DOJ required divestitures at other airports.

WN might also find that it needs to raise its fares from DAL in order to match its capacity with the demand and stop trying to create demand which it cannot accommodate.

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

the fact that hasn't happened is precisely why it is certain that the DOT did in fact not tell WN what it wants to hear and why WN is basically telling DAL to figure the problem out.

Given that it is allegedly an established practice at DL to lie to the DOT (your words not mine - see below) I wonder if perhaps the DOT is returning the favor to DL - you know, telling them what they want to hear which is at odds with reality ... ... ...
 

Airlines say what they need to say to the DOT. What happens in real life is considerable different.

 

DL's strategy is undoubtedly to force WN to accommodate it, wait for VX to fail at DAL - VX' flights from DAL to AUS will undoubtedly help speed up the process - and then DL will move into VX' gates.

Disagree with you about WN, more-or-less agree with you with respect to VX.

I am however curious what could happen when VX fails at DAL and if another LCC/ULCC requests the gates.