"...avoid Bankruptcy At All Costs"

[luv2fly]

Luv-

Are you a captain? If not, then don't compare yourself to one? In addition, so what? Is your job that much different??? Are you truly doing something so different that it warrant s a huge premium? Lastly, nobosy cares about the higher level of education/training you may or may not have...the customer certainly doesn't.

fly,

I thought you knew something about how pilots are paid. I guess not.
Normally, the more the seats, the more the pay. Are you arguing that a 777 captain should make what an RJ captain makes?
Is my job different? Only that I hold the responsibility of 200 more lives when I take off.
Nobody cares about the level of education/training I DO have. Really? Why does DL require a 4 yr degree? Why does the FAA require type ratings for larger aircraft? I disgree with your opinion that the customer doesn't care, but you are certainly entitled to your opinion. Higher education is a typical requirment for higher paying jobs. If you have a problem with that, you either have a problem with reality, or you are just too lazy to do something about it.

 

[luv2fly]

Delta pilots make $300/hr and work 80 hours a month. There are many who work that amount of hours in a week. Are pilots having a difficult time putting food on the tables? They are making over $100 per hour more than American Airlines, should those AA pilots be applying for food stamps? There is no question the pilots at Comair and the other RJ's deserve their pay, but what is most appauling is that Delta pilots are making their hefty pay increases at the expense of their lower paid union brethren.

So you can tell us that your selfish and that you don't want to give any money back even though Delta just reported a $2 billion quarterly loss (one time charge was most of it) and you make $100 more than any other pilot in the industry we will believe you. But you can't give us the laughable argument above.

Delta pilots make $300/hr and work 80 hours a month.

No I don't. I make $134 an hour. That 80 hours is flight time. Average duty day is between 9 and 14 hours.

Are pilots having a difficult time putting food on the tables?

No.

They are making over $100 per hour more than American Airlines

An American pilot is making $34 an hour. WOW. Didn't know that. Thanks for the info.

but what is most appauling is that Delta pilots are making their hefty pay increases at the expense of their lower paid union brethren.

Sorry, but you are going to have to explain your reasoning on that one. :blink:

and you make $100 more than any other pilot in the industry

Perhaps you shouldn't make generalizations.

 

[goingboeing]

Luv-

Are you a captain? If not, then don't compare yourself to one? In addition, so what? Is your job that much different??? Are you truly doing something so different that it warrant s a huge premium? Lastly, nobosy cares about the higher level of education/training you may or may not have...the customer certainly doesn't.

A few years back a I was on a widebody flight from DFW to PHX.We encountered some severe thunderstorms around ELP and the A/C was being bounced all over the sky.The pilot had to climb,descend,turn,add power,remove power to manauver around the storms.
I DID NOT HEAR 1 PASSENGER ON THE FLIGHT COMPLAIN ABOUT HOW MUCH THE PILOTS WERE BEING PAYED.

So their education and specialized training does matter.If not hire some illegals for $10,000 per year to fly the airplanes.

 

[LiveInAHotel]

An American pilot is making $34 an hour. WOW. Didn't know that. Thanks for the info.

Please do tell what your source is for this misinformation! This is what an American Eagle pilot is making to fly RJ's and prop jets. I'm a f/a for AA and I make more then $34 and hour and no pilot on AA mainline property makes less them me.

AA pilots (APA represented) and AE pilots (ALPA represented) are two different pilot groups at two different airlines. Yes, both airlines are under the AMR umbrella, but the AA pilots make more. Get your facts correct!

Do you work for a non-union pilot group? It sounds like you do and probably work for JetBlue. You sound like the typical DL employee who is anti-union and non-union who doesn't want their paycut, if the pilots don't give an inch.

 

[luv2fly]

Please do tell what your source is for this misinformation! This is what an American Eagle pilot is making to fly RJ's and prop jets. I'm a f/a for AA and I make more then $34 and hour and no pilot on AA mainline property makes less them me.

AA pilots (APA represented) and AE pilots (ALPA represented) are two different pilot groups at two different airlines. Yes, both airlines are under the AMR umbrella, but the AA pilots make more. Get your facts correct!

Do you work for a non-union pilot group? It sounds like you do and probably work for JetBlue. You sound like the typical DL employee who is anti-union and non-union who doesn't want their paycut, if the pilots don't give an inch.

Uh live,

I was responding to a poster that stated I made $100 more an hour than my counterparts at AA. Needless to say, I was being sarcastic. My hourly pay is roughly $134 an hour and my point was that his generalizations are just that. AA pilots are making far more than $34 an hour. I am proud to say that I am a member of ALPA and a DL pilot. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

 

[mweiss]

I make $134 an hour.

No you don't. You make $300 an hour. You just don't get paid for all of the hours that you're on duty. And for the hours that you do get paid, you make $100 more than your counterpart at AA.

If you want to talk duty hours, that's fine. You make 30% more than your counterpart at AA, regardless of how you measure it.

 

[luv2fly]

No you don't. You make $300 an hour. You just don't get paid for all of the hours that you're on duty. And for the hours that you do get paid, you make $100 more than your counterpart at AA.

How do you figure?

 

[AirplaneFan]

Two points

1) The basis for the information is airlinepilotpay.com. Based upon that information it appears that AA is $100 under DAL at near the top rate.

2) Delta is dying. It announced a $2 billion loss for the quarter. Granted most of that money was a one-time charge, however the legacy carriers always seem to have these one-time charges. The rationale for Delta to get the big raise was that the company was turning a sizeable profit and they should share the money with the pilots. Now DAL is turning 3 years of monsterous losses, but the pilots now don't use the same rationale. AA is undercutting DAL by up to $100 and they still can't make money. So offering to forego a 4.5% raise and give back under 10% shows a bizarre detachment to the current plight of DAL.

 

[mweiss]

How do you figure?

See AirplaneFan's #1 point.

 

[LaBradford22]

I'd like to interject with a couple of points:

1. The highest pay rate for a DL pilot is for a B777 Captain at max (which every single B777 Captain is). That rate is approximately $320 per hour. The lowest pay rate for a DL pilot is hard to say for sure, but I'll take a wild guess and say that DL hasn't hired pilots since 9/11. That would mean the most junior B737-300 First Officer has almost three years of seniority and makes $134 per hour. So, luv2fly is right to point out that not all pilots makes $320 per hour, in fact, it's a pretty small handful that do, and the ones that do have been with the company for 25 to 30 years.

2. Assuming 75 paid hours per month, $320 per hour works out to $288,000 per year while $134 per hour works out to about $120,000 per year. This doesn't include retirement or medical benefits. I agree with AirplaneFan that LiveInAHotel's assertion that a salary of $120,000 per year translates into difficulty putting food on the table and keeping the lights on is, quite frankly, laughable. In fact, I did laugh. Hard.

3. Mweiss is also correct to point out that the 75 hours is paid time. For a line pilot, that may translate into 60 or 65 hours of block time (on average). For a reserve pilot, block time is probably closer to 40 or so hours per month, although in fairness the reserve doesn't know where he's flying (or even if he's flying) on his duty days, and the reserve is only paid guarantee which I believe at Delta is 65 hours per month. So, let me restate point #2: there may be a Delta pilot on property that makes $134 per hour at 65 hours per month, which works out to about $104,000 per year. Quick, somebody call the Welfare office so these guys don't starve to death!

 

[goingboeing]

Many airline pilots work other jobs or other flying jobs such as the Guard or Reserve.
Some of them also fly airshows,teach aerobatics,or are a CFII.

This should not matter on how much they earn at the airline but just points out they don't have to get in the Food Stamp line.

 

[luv2fly]

I'd like to interject with a couple of points:

So, let me restate point #2: there may be a Delta pilot on property that makes $134 per hour at 65 hours per month, which works out to about $104,000 per year. Quick, somebody call the Welfare office so these guys don't starve to death!

LA,
Thanks for the clarification on those points. I think your observations were right on.
Your figures are fairly accurate. I would point out there are numerous pilots at DL making that $134/hr which you have equated to $104,000/yr. I agree, not a bad salary at all... now subtract an additional 30-40%.
My point was simply that there are too many people like mweiss out there that honestly believe every DL pilot is making $300 an hour. As you stated, that couldn't be further from the truth.

 

[luv2fly]

Some of them also fly airshows,teach aerobatics,or are a CFII.

This should not matter on how much they earn at the airline but just points out they don't have to get in the Food Stamp line.

CFI's?????
If you have been one, you would know that any income from that is laughable.

 

[mweiss]

...people like mweiss out there that honestly believe every DL pilot is making $300 an hour

Whoa there, nelly. I do not believe that every DL pilot is making $300 an hour. I know a few of them personally. So don't lump me in that bucket. I was only pointing out how the pay is calculcated, and why saying $300 an hour is not completely unreasonable.

 

[flyhigh]

ok...still not feeling sorry at $70k/yr. maybe your spouse will have to go and get a job.

as for your point that all pilots are paid based on size of a/c, it's true, but not necessary. That has nothing to do with anything. it's an old system that has continued, but is not based on need. As a matter of fact if you look at CO, they group their fleet into two or three types so that a 753 and 777 pilot make the same rate. This is probably the smartest thing as it removes a lot of training cost incurred when pilots move up to get more $$$. If there was no advantage to moving up, they would more than likely stay where they are.

As for the experience...I've been on RJ flights that had turbulence. nobody cared about that pilots pay either...they did however care about their ticket price when they bought it. Not sure what the point of that story was. Nobody cared about executive pay when we were making money, so we shouldn't care about it now either???