Amr Results Falling Short Of Estimate

[jimntx]

They can thank two bankruptcies for having had much lower labor costs to begin with.

People keep saying that, but it's just not true; at least as far as the flight attendants. They made about the same as the f/as at AA--maybe a little less prior to 9/11. Within the past year they make more. At top of scale, it is several dollars/hour more. I know because I have several friends who fly for Continental.

Remember, in the case of AA's allegedly "industry-leading" contract for flight attendants. It wasn't approved until Sept., 2001 and the concessions went into effect May, 2003; so, we didn't get to "lead" the industry all that long. And, the joke among flight attendants from other airlines was that our work rules were so outdated that even though we had the highest hourly pay, f/as from other airlines took home more pay for the same amount of flying.

One of my new hire classmates now flies for Frontier. I saw her end of June paycheck today. After 3 months at Frontier, she is taking home more than I was taking home when I was furloughed after almost 3 years of flying.

 

[PRINCESS KIDAGAKASH]

What's the matter orwell? Did I strike a nerve? I'm sorry if I'm blunt with my posts, but being in the airline industry for 20 yrs working for two carriers made what I am. You see I worked for BRANIFF,before I came to AA. I have seen people who will work for nothing just so they can "save their job". Guess what? It didn't save anybody's job! There are many ex-TWA,EASTERN,PAN-AM,TEXAS AIR, employees who will probably testify to that effect. Orwell if you want to work for nothing in the airline industry,go ahead and be happy. I heard CHEAPO airlines is hiring people for minimum wage. CHEAPO is going to fly the new pilotless 200 seat regional jets coast to coast for $50.00 roundtrip per person. Don't laugh! After what I witnessed two months ago at the airport in Mineral Wells,TX., it will probably be reality! For those folks who don't know: Mineral Wells is the headquarters of S-tec and Century autopilot. It is also the home of an outfit called DRS technologies-unmanned systems.

 

[mweiss]

Princess,

If there's one thing I know really well, it's computers. I know it well enough to know that we do not produce software that is both sophisticated enough to handle all of the possible permutations of what can occur six miles up and reliable enough to do the right thing often enough to replace humans.

Can it be done today? Yes. However, the cost required to do it is far too high. Pilots are expensive, but they're not that expensive. We may see pilotless aircraft in the lifetime of some of the people reading this board, but it'll be late in that lifetime.

 

[PRINCESS KIDAGAKASH]

mweiss, I hate to tell you this, but reliable computer software has existed for many years capable of handling not only basic aircraft operation and navigation, but also inflight emergencies as well. You just can't buy it at Best Buy right now.

 

[mweiss]

Compared to what is necessary to completely remove the human from the cockpit, the systems in today's commercial aircraft are primitive.

In particular, I find it hard to believe that a computer would have saved anyone at all on UA232.

 

[Wretched Wrench]

Do you not think wage inflation obtained at "gunpoint" (through the threat of shutdowns) has had SOME effect on the current health of the "legacy" carriers?

What wage inflation are you talking about? I am making much less in constant dollars than I was 20 years ago. You can check this for yourself. I believe you have access to this information, and should know better. And, I have fewer benefits and pay more for them.

During our short-lived AMFA-Lite contract, my pay was just even with my 1984 wages, but my benefits were, for the most part, inferior and more costly. Additionally, the TWU gave away a whole list of concessions from 1984 on. I believe there is a list around. Many of those concessions drove us backward economically, offsetting any gains. Those same concessions all benefited the company, offsetting your purported wage inflation.

So, I would posit that, at least in maintenance, there has been wage DEFLATION in the last 20 years.