AMFA & NW resume talks after 360 day strike
- Thread starter Necrophilias
- Start date
local 12 proud
Veteran
- Mar 5, 2004
- 4,265
- 4
CSAR, would/could you give a brief synopsis of your A&P experience in regards to commercial aviation?
Have you ever applied at a major carrier, excluding NWA as a SCAB and if so what was the outcome?
You claim to support the rights of the AMFA strikers on one hand, but then you have no hesitation in circumventing a legal labor dispute in order to help assure their demise. Thats a contradiction would'nt you agree?
You did not have to cross a picket line to put food on the table, there are plenty of third party MRO's hiring mechanics who either can't or choose not to work at the majors. By assisting NWA to break a strike you not only helped destroy many families live's but you are in fact aiding and abetting in the decline of our craft by sending the message that we are over compensated, Is this what you truly believe?
I am not trying to bait, I would just really like to understand what would posses a man who claims to have so much pride as an ex-marine to abandon his brotherhood (craft) in exchange for what seems to me nothing more than an easy way to make a fast buck, In my view you have committed an act of treason against (OUR) chosen craft by selling it out. I know this is not the creed of a U.S. Marine, What caused your slide into such a reprehensible downfall that in your mind justifies your actions?
Regards, Local 12
777 fixer
Veteran
- Jul 21, 2004
- 4,792
- 900
Well despite all his bravado when asked simple questions Jet Tech seems to do a disapearing act ala PTO.
CSAR GYRENE
Veteran
I started in civil aviation around '96, working at Santa Barbara aerospace, assigned to the DC-10 line. I had never worked civil, or fixed wing, until that time. The project manager took a chance, and gave me a shot. I like to think we both profitted from that decision.
I Moved back home to west Michigan, and got a job at a Mom And Pop commuter service working on Jetstream 3100's, and Saab 340's. I acquired my A and P while working for them. I left that company after the DOM ordered me to perform substandard maintenence. The following few years I spent contracting around the US, working on everything from oh-58's to 747's. I very much loved the variety and opportunity to work around the US that contracting gave me.
My first aviation union shop was in Dothan, starting around the fall of 2003, I believe. While I had no problem at all with any of the IAM guys there, the innefficiency of the work rules drove me nuts! When thier union contract was set to expire, many directs asked me what my intentions were. As A contractor, I didnt feel it was my place to get involved one way or another. I was there strictly to fix airplanes, and wanted nothing to do with the politics. In hindsight, I PROBABLY would not have crossed the picket line for 2 reasons: First, the mechanics there were indeed locked out..they had no choice in the matter. Secondly, I felt that what the IAM was asking for was not unreasonable at all. The fact that they were only paying a fifty cent premium for BOTH tickets in my mind was an insult to all the A and P's there. Ft Rucker was right next door in Ozark Al, and they were taking unticketed wrenches from PemCo left and right. (and yes, I kick myself to this day for not taking a QC position at Rucker.)
I have never applied for any position in any major carrier for a couple of reasons. First and foremost, more often than not the starting pay was WAY lower than my minimums. Also, I knew just enough about the seniority system to know that with the industry in such a tailspin, there was NO WAY as a relative new hire I would escape the layoffs that were so cyclical in the Major carriers. Finally, what little experience I had with unions left a sour taste so that I tried to steer clear of them whenever possible. I have listed other reason in other posts, so look them up if you wish.
I have stated, and I CONTINUE to state, that I support your RIGHT to legally strike one hundred percent. I also believe, however, I have the right to cross that picket line. I believe it was Voltaire who stated "While I disagree vehemently with what you say, I will defend to the death your right to say it."
My opinion regarding claims that my actions are destroying the "craft" are thus: While I admit that higher pay USUALLY attracts higher quality, I dont neccesarily believe pay is the be-al and end-all. In my career, I have petitioned several times for more stringent controls regarding the issuance of airmans certificates. I am VERY concerned about heavy maintenence being shipped overseas, both as a quality, and a national security issue. I have tried to convince the FAA to mandate that you MUST be certificated to work on US flagged aircraft. I would like to see much tighter controls placed on A and P schools regarding the same teachers who you just had for 3 semesters administer your orals and practicals. To me, that is a major conflict of interest, and leads to "teaching to the test". I have lobbied for reform of the "Whistleblowers" procedures at various companies so a mech doesnt have to fear being 8-balled out of his career for reporting a serious safety issue. To me, these efforts do more to ensure the quality of our craft than do any "industry leading pay scale".
I admit fully that I knew next to nothing about what a picket line meant to most of the good members of unions out there. I mean "good" as in "damn good man", not as a shot or in sarcasm. I will close by saying this: I firmly believe that there are alot of outstanding mechs out there across the picket line. Most are probably hardworking, good family men, who I would otherwise have enjoyed the hell out of watching the ball game with, tossing back a few cold ones with while talking shop, and in general be proud to know. My biggest regret in all this is that the ramifications of this issue are such that that is unlikely to ever happen. Please understand that I hold this against none of you. You are doing what you truely feel is right, and I find no fault in that.
Best wishes,
Al Clark
jenny@nw
Veteran
Nice note Mr. Clark,
But unfortunatley and ultimately a scab symbolizes the demise of the blue collar middle class.
But unfortunatley and ultimately a scab symbolizes the demise of the blue collar middle class.
I also applaud your post, however, you also left out that because of the union workers willing to put their careers and family finances on the line for a principle, you have been able to enjoy the "fruits" of their convictions and years of collective bargaining. You sound like a very nice person but bottom line is you will always be a scab. That is a character flaw that few are able to overcome. In the airline industry, it is a well known fact that most mangt. would prefer the workers to pay the company not vice versa. I agree that many work rules are archaic and do not benefit either side but that is what happens when mangt. does not want to give no cost or cost neutral, quality of life enhancements without major give backs. The games people play!
U
UAL_TECH
Guest
)
U
UAL_TECH
Guest
Reasonable enough, so when I turn my water hose on you, you should come up and give me a hug. Let me know and I will try to arrange a like scenario for you.
Think about it. Without vance, would some of you and your scabbutties been as vocal as you crossed a picket line?
Or was it just the beer talking?
I am vehemently oppossed to violence, and will stomp anyone into a puddle who makes me use it
just kidding guys, just kidding.
Give us a story on the 'special bus' rides, that would be a hoot!
<Still no FU smilies!!>
Kev3188
Veteran
No one was hurt, but there were definite threats (if nothing else, his kids definitely were not shy about hurling invective at the picketers).
For some reason, I seem to remember a dog being brought out to try and intimidate the strikers as well, though I may be mistaken....
www.the-mechanic.com used to have a link to footage of the incident.
No matter how you slice it, his kids' behavior was living testament to the consequences of poor parenting.
OP
Necrophilias
Senior
- Mar 7, 2006
- 298
- 0
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #145
True but understated Jenny. The SCABS at NW are pretty much "the bottom of the barrel". I'm sure you have seen some of SCABS in the terminal. The group of SCABS who I saw when walking to a gate on the blue concourse in MSP last week was: A. A rag tag looking bunch who looked like leftovers from the original Deliverance casting call. B. Loud and rude. C. In dire need of a good dentist. D. Spilling food allover the terminal floor. E. Odd appearing at a glance.
You know my story and that I don't fly NW. Today I'm really glad that I don't fly NW. BTW, how many airplanes are actually in service these days?
jenny@nw
Veteran
Yeah, I remember last year someone accused me of being racist because I didn't know what the heck this guy was saying. You would think NW would help them buy some teeth.
How many airplanes? You know which one I do miss? The classic of all classics- the "trash 10". Gotta love that cutie. (being serious) Gas guzzler for sure but I liked it.
slothman2000
Member
I have to say that I DO NOT applaud your post gyrene but the responder here has more or less hit the nail right on the head. Whatever reason you give for justifying your acts, the bottom line is that you have underminded all the just people who had convictions about northwest's treatment of them and deciced they had enough and decided to walk away. History shows that people like you do not have a guiding principle in mind but only think of one thing, your lowly self-preservation. You say that you have fought for certain aspects of the aviation profession (i.e. outsourcing, stringent controls of issuing certificates, etc.),but you will find out that the fight can not be waged by one person with hopes of any gain. By rebelling against the union's principles by crossing the picket line on one hand, and then fighting for the rights of certifyed technicians on the other, you just prove your self-riteous hypocritical pompousness. If you study the history of the technicians union on the northwest property, you will find that it is not all about money and benefits, but more importantly, work rules and quality of life. These hard fought goals were won with not one voice, but the voices of many. Slavery was abolished in this country over a 140 years ago but people like you continue to help the coorperations of the world quietly reinstate certain aspects of it.
In closing, I would like to quote the famous American Statesman Benjamin Franklin at the signing of the Declaration of Independance, "We must indeed all hang together, or, most assuredly, we shall all hang separately." The majority of us have held to this quote, scabs like you done nothing but help the companies vanquish it.
The intent of the slavemaster and many of todays corporate leaders are one in the same.
I remember reading a statement made by a Southern politition in response to a Northen politition who had assumed an abolititionist position and criticized the Slavery of the South.
While I disagree with the Southerners motive the fact is he made an excellent point and exposed the Northern hypocrisy when it came to the issue of human rights.
The Southern Pol brought up the issue of "wage Slavery" that existed in the North. The deplorable working conditions, poor health and high mortality of workers toiling away in factories whose only real choice was accept what the corporate master was offering or starve, in some cases it was really more like accept the offer and still starve or reject it and starve quicker.
These conditions did not improve much from the pre civil war era when the Southern politition cited them until the rise of labor unions in the 1930s. With the collapse of unionism here (and the inability to hold US based Global corporations accountable for their actions overseas) we are seeing waged slavery on the rise again.
What these scabs dont seem to realize is that their actions make them agents in behalf of those who seek to spead wage slavery, one small step at a time.
Kev3188
Veteran
(bump)
I thought I had a link to this somewhere....Not sure if the video clip still works or not, but here you go.
jenny@nw
Veteran
Have to send your kids out to do the job. Now that's priceless.
