Hmmmm, get displaced to the A319 and take $3000/mth paycut or accept a job offer for another company and take home $7000/mth more than I do now.
American Airline Pilots' Slowdown Wins a Victory, Despite What You Read in the DMN
- Thread starter Super FLUF
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Hmmmm, get displaced to the A319 and take $3000/mth paycut or accept a job offer for another company and take home $7000/mth more than I do now.
There would be life after AA, how much lower are you willing to go before you say enough is enough, go ahead and close the doors?
As it is right now mechanics at AA are on average around $20,000 a year less than our peers at most other major airlines. If AA were so shut down the other carriers would expand and in five years or less mechanics who left AA would be back at top pay making a lot more than they would at AA, but if AA stays in business and we give to AA what other mechanics give to their employers, but for $20k less, then those carriers more than likely would not expand, AA would, and it would help drive everyones wage down because those carriers would seek the same concessions. So, if AA chooses to continue on this path, the worse they do the better it is for the profession, and if they fail the sooner the better.
cubs_in_2012
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"So, if AA chooses to continue on this path, the worse they do the better it is for the profession, and if they fail the sooner the better."
I would just like to say how proud I am of my wife, a FA for 20+ years. She gets up, puts on that dress that hasn't been updated in years, goes to work, and just does her job. Probably 90-95% of all other AA employees fall into this same category. She doesn't agree with the way the company has been run, was\is furious over concessions and management compensation, voted 'no' on the last contract, and believe me, b*tches to no end about it all, in the privacy of our own home. But, she still goes out and DOES HER JOB, in a professional and courteous manner. She wears the union lanyard and pin every work day.
She does *not* willfully try to harm the company because she feels she has been wronged. I am a regular reader of this forum, but I categorically do not understand how undermining the operation of the company and purposely causing economic harm helps *any* work group in the long term. Or how postulating that the company's outright failure can be a good thing.
I'm not looking for a renewed dialog on things that have been already covered - just a newbie here voicing an opinion, waiting for his wife to come home....
I would just like to say how proud I am of my wife, a FA for 20+ years. She gets up, puts on that dress that hasn't been updated in years, goes to work, and just does her job. Probably 90-95% of all other AA employees fall into this same category. She doesn't agree with the way the company has been run, was\is furious over concessions and management compensation, voted 'no' on the last contract, and believe me, b*tches to no end about it all, in the privacy of our own home. But, she still goes out and DOES HER JOB, in a professional and courteous manner. She wears the union lanyard and pin every work day.
She does *not* willfully try to harm the company because she feels she has been wronged. I am a regular reader of this forum, but I categorically do not understand how undermining the operation of the company and purposely causing economic harm helps *any* work group in the long term. Or how postulating that the company's outright failure can be a good thing.
I'm not looking for a renewed dialog on things that have been already covered - just a newbie here voicing an opinion, waiting for his wife to come home....
20+ years?
Did your wife go on strike in 1993?
http://www.nytimes.com/1993/11/19/business/a-strike-at-american-airlines-disrupts-travel-of-thousands.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm
xUT
Veteran
Good luck to you and yours. BK brings out the worst in people.
The problem is over capacity in the industry "for decent paying jobs".
We have been in a whipsaw over wages for decades as one airline reduces wages (either through BK or consensual) puts pressure on the competition.
As one carrier lowers employee costs, the next will match or exceed concessions, then comes the round robin and the race for the bottom.
All the while the executives, BOD and Uber class will receive exorbitant 'incentives' while screwing everyone else.
Plan for the worst, hope for the best.
Been There, Done That, No T-Shirt
Regards,
B) xUT
cubs_in_2012
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Did she participate in a legal, union supported work stoppage that the flying public was well aware of in advance? Yes. Why do you ask?
MCI transplant
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Oh really!----- And where would she go? Back to Mama?
So the question isnt whether or not she was willing to hurt the company, its whether or not it was legal to do so? Do you feel that the public is unaware of what the company is trying to do to the pilots? Have you ever read the Railway Labor Act? Are you familiar with the history of it? Strikes were all illegal at one time, they became legal because the law could not stop it.
OP
Super FLUF
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Work elsewhere. We have 31 widebody captains leaving shortly for foreign carriers. Hundreds of others interviewing or on their way out. Our jobs are in demand by companies that pay better. Demand is only going to increase - especially later this decade when the legacies start shedding THOUSANDS per year to retirement.
Besides that, most guys have non-flying side gigs that either already pay more, or can be parlayed into a full time job that pays as much and they will be at home every night and not have to put up with AA's ####.
MCI transplant
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There's an old saying!---- "Sometime people can't see the forest for the trees!" There's a whole big world out there, and AA is a vary,vary, small part of it!---- Hey! there's more than one hammock on that beach in the carib!
cubs_in_2012
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Bob, I need to learn how to do those in-lines quotes at some point, bear with me.... but to your questions:
Do you feel that the public is unaware of what the company is trying to do to the pilots?
Do I think that a good way to 'educate' the public is to purposely create situations that (for example) cause a customer to miss a life long friend's funeral, or a daughter's playoff soccer game, or a business conference that their company had paid thousands of dollars to exhibit at? Not so much...
Have you ever read the Railway Labor Act? Are you familiar with the history of it?
No and yes. I have not read the RLA, but I am aware as to why it was passed and why it was\is very much needed. I love history.
Look, I feel like most employees are on the same page when it comes to their feelings towards management. The point of my initial post was that a very small number of employees are potentially jeopardizing the long term viability of the company through what, in my opinion, are senseless and selfish (and we will probably now see if illegal...) acts that *really* impact a *lot* of other people. And to what end? We have to destroy the village to save it?
The other 90-95% of employees, many of whom are likely just as p*ssed off, such as my wife, continue to do their jobs in a professional and non-vindictive manner.
So the question isnt whether or not she was willing to hurt the company, its whether or not it was legal to do so?
Well... yeah. Her union called for a strike, and she went on strike. That was (is) part of the recognized process, when it gets to that point. In 1993 it apparently got to that point.Do you feel that the public is unaware of what the company is trying to do to the pilots?
Awkward wording but yes - I feel that the public is unaware of what the company is 'trying to do' to the pilots. I would not have singled out the pilots though, I would have included all work groups.
Do I think the public *would* be sympathetic towards the pilots (and other work groups) if they fully understood what the company was subjecting the work groups to? Possibly. That being said, I felt Crandall's recent letter was well written and compelling. Does the AA work force have a spokesperson or representative who can frame a discussion and present labor viewpoints and counter arguments as well as Crandall did for the company? Please send me a link if so...Do I think that a good way to 'educate' the public is to purposely create situations that (for example) cause a customer to miss a life long friend's funeral, or a daughter's playoff soccer game, or a business conference that their company had paid thousands of dollars to exhibit at? Not so much...
Have you ever read the Railway Labor Act? Are you familiar with the history of it?
No and yes. I have not read the RLA, but I am aware as to why it was passed and why it was\is very much needed. I love history.
Strikes were all illegal at one time, they became legal because the law could not stop it.
I think I understand the sentiment....Look, I feel like most employees are on the same page when it comes to their feelings towards management. The point of my initial post was that a very small number of employees are potentially jeopardizing the long term viability of the company through what, in my opinion, are senseless and selfish (and we will probably now see if illegal...) acts that *really* impact a *lot* of other people. And to what end? We have to destroy the village to save it?
The other 90-95% of employees, many of whom are likely just as p*ssed off, such as my wife, continue to do their jobs in a professional and non-vindictive manner.
Glenn Quagmire
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Phoenix
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Its really not uncommon. Lawyer, doctor, Real estate Broker ie. not agent, CPA firm, Military Reserve (Majors, Lt COls, even a Maj Gen), family business with thirty five yes 35 Subways, family farm with over 1,000 acres, luxury boat dealership, etc, etc.
Not sure if its "most" pilots, but you would be shocked at how many have multiple streams of income.
Frankly the real issue is the majority of the AA pilots aren't too concerned about threats of what will happen if they reject management's offers. The pilots that have outside streams of income really have nothing to lose.
If I were management, I'ld be a lot more worried about the ambivalence of the pilots with a single income. They jumpseat with US all the time and I am shocked at how resolute ALL the AA pilots are about hating Horton. Its uncanny. A beautiful sight. In my opinion there is nothing Horton can do. Either the solution has him exiting or things get worse and worse.
luvthe9
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Wow, I to have been flying some AMR boys in and out of MIA and FLL they are really pissed and ready to burn the place down, however they will not like Parker at all if this deal goes. Parker is way worse than Horton. Hang tough guys !!!
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