After the pilot''s pension...then what?

[simfixer]

pinger,
When you asked "Did any of you ever take Economics or a business class?" it made me wonder, if you have been working in this business for 30 years, of what value is your advice about business if you have not been able to retire after thirty years of airline pay combined with your advanced knowledge of economics and business?

 

[wings396]

[blockquote]
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On 1/28/2003 11:07:28 PM Slam&Click wrote:

[blockquote]
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On 1/28/2003 925 PM chipmunn wrote:

Diogenes:

If you believe "it's fun to kick Chip in the a$$", would you care to identify yourself and show your courage? Instead of insults, why don't you identify yourself?

Chip
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[/blockquote]


Chip-

Please cease and desist with the cyber chest pounding and nose snorting "identify yourself" nonsense. This, as well as all other bulletin boards on the internet, have traditionally been useful to exchange thoughts and ideas through the use of a chosen moniker. Just because you've decided to use your nick and surnames, you cannot chastise others that have chosen not to do so. Well informed internet users are advised never to divulge their given name, location, or other personal information. It has also been stressed that we teach our children the same rules. There are dangerous, evil people in cyberland, Chip. There is an overwhelming concern regarding identity theft now. So, I highly doubt that anyone is going to be foolish enough to rush right up to their keyboards and agree to bare all their personal data. It has absolutely nothing to do with courage, rather, its a matter of common sense.

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[/blockquote]
Well said. Not everyone is in a position to identify themselves due to their position in the company and possible repercussions for what they say here. If Chip feels it is OK for him that is great, but not all of us are protected under the ALPA blanket.

 

[diogenes]

Wings396, SnH, and SnC,

Thank you, gentlemen.

Chip,

First, at this point, I don't give a damn what you think.

Second, I am not protected from retaliation from the company as you so obviously are. The proof of that was your article in the CLT Observer. A blatant violation of company policy that went unchecked. A move that would have gotten 99% of the employees of the company terminated. Note that when most union sources who are also company employees are quoted in the media, they are very careful to restrict their comments to union positions about company activities. I am forced to conclude you had the company's consent for your activities.

Third, your emotions are clouding your judgement. Go back and read the post carefully. I called for a cease to the pilot baiting, and for support of ALPA with regards to your pension issue - positions you have to admit you agree with.

Fourth, your posts appear to have a divisive, rather than a unifying, effect. I think the majority of the pilot bashing on this board is a result of your posts. And I am human enough to admit I have enjoyed watching your posts 'repeet'ed back to you. At the same time, I am constantly aware that damage to ALPA's pension is damage to us all, so ALPA has my support in this matter regardless of you. Two thoughts should flow from this, Chip. When your back is against the wall, take support where you can find it. You may think the support of the other labor groups is insignificant; I tell you it is not. Second, do you realize the division shown on this board plays into management's hands? Teamwork must begin somewhere, Chip, or we all are doomed. You tell me when and where this teamwork should begin.

Lastly, professionals understand they do not have to like one another to work together. We obviously do not like one another. But I am prepared to work with you in our common interests.

Are you?

Or, if this is simply unacceptable to you, you may challenge me to a duel

 

[PITbull]

Dio,


You are the BEST!

 

[PITbull]

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On 1/28/2003 10:31:42 PM autofixer wrote:

[blockquote]
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On 1/28/2003 1019 PM pinger wrote:

Did any of you ever take Economics or a business class? There is no revenue to "GET". The industry is imploding in on itself and you folks still can see beyond your next car payment! Do any of you have a better employment opportunity? Is there some great demand for airline employees that I have missed in my last 30 years in this business? Get real,if not US Airways what Home Depot or Best Buy.

I'm sure Delta, American or Northwest would love to have us all...RIGHT!
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[/blockquote]
Why is it that everyone thinks airline employees are not employable? I heard a carpenter on a radio show yesterday say he made $100,000 last year. As has been stated on these boards before, "there is life outside the airlines!" I guarantee the mechanics can make around $100,000 working on something. The pilots can start businesses or fly corporate. The agents, flight attendants and customer service reps, can find jobs in the service sector, or even better, start their own businesses. I have had it with people implying airline employees can not do anything else, so you better give, give, give or else! JMHO
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[/blockquote]

Autofixer,

You are so right! Many of us are degreed, and have other skills outside this airline business. Most Mechanics have more than enough skills to go out here and work on anything...hell, if you open up a garage and work on automobiles, and hire your own employees. I have a good friend who works in utility and is a capender on the side and makes up much of the difference he is presently losing here at U. Most folks continue to stay because of the investment of time they have put in this company, WHICH MAKES THEM INVESTORS, and obviously all the labor groups combined have given well OVER a billion dollars a year in concesions to this company. You know, folks to are hairdressers can make over $45,000 a year right here in Pittsburgh working for someone,and if you own you own shop, you can make as much as a chiropracter. I know this for a fact.

So, there you go.


What this management wants us to believe when we were in negotiations and are ballots were pending is that we are so worthless, that we could never make more out there in the open market. Once the vote was in, they now say, "if you don't like it, take your attitude and leave" as quoted by one senior executive in the crystal palace.Conversely, they want you to believe that the senior executives of this company are so underpaid and could make much much more in the open market for their "so called" talents.




[img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/14.gif'] [img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/14.gif']

 

[pinger]

Dear Simfixer: I'm only 50 years old. As you know, we can't draw from our old frozen pension plan until we turn 55 and then it is at a very reduced rate. To tap into the 401k and IRA's (you have been doing Roth's haven't you?) you must be 59 1/2 to withdraw without a penalty. I also hope you are taking advantage of the new after-tax provision now offered in the 401k. Last year, I was in DCA to discuss the 401k issues with H/R. I mentioned that we needed to implement the "catch-up" provisions and a brokerage account option. The brokerage account would give us more fund diversity and allow us to start a bond-ladder. As you know, if interest rates rise by 1 percent bond fund principle will drop by the corresponding duration of the bonds held.

By the way, how are you doing?

 

[repeet]

Hey Dio and Group,

Yes I have resisted from further tormenting the Pilots group. I realize from their posts and tone, that they are where us mechanics were just a few weeks ago.

I also realize that union posturing requires unity of resolve. The Pilots must be uniformly militant, if they are going to negotiate with any strength. I just couldn't resist feeding back a bit of the rhetoric.

Oh, and by the way Chip, I do post under my own name; R. E. Peet. You can find me in the Charlotte Aviionics Shop, on second shift. Just ask for Rob.

Well it's time for Dave to pull a rabbit out of his hat. I hope it's a big, fat one for the Pilots sake.

Let's keep 'em flying!

REPeet

 

[diogenes]

Hi Rob,

I still get a chuckle thinking about your posts - it was a thing of beauty. And it was certainly timely and appropriate, given the history. At no time did I interpret your posts as anti-pilot, just reminding one person where he came from.

Again, you are the master of repeet!

 

[PITbull]

[blockquote]
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On 1/28/2003 259 PM W:EXCH:INVOL wrote:

My prediction: Dave comes back and says, "Sorry guys, but that 5% cut just ain't gonna cut it. Needs to be at least 10% or chapter 7 here we come."

INVOL

p.s. Has anyone else noticed that there's no wording about the end of the 5% when the war actually ends? All I see is, up to (which really means every day of) 18 months. Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.
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[/blockquote]

Invol,

You are correct. This so called deferral/paycut will run 18 months consequtively and after that commence being returned to the emloyee on a monthly basis for the following 18 months. Only way this process stops is when there is a profit reported...then the next month they start to pay it back. But, then again, it's not that management honors provisions in contracts. They have been known to change them in a heart beat to suit that minute.

 

[PITbull]

[blockquote]
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On 1/28/2003 1019 PM pinger wrote:

Did any of you ever take Economics or a business class? There is no revenue to "GET". The industry is imploding in on itself and you folks still can see beyond your next car payment! Do any of you have a better employment opportunity? Is there some great demand for airline employees that I have missed in my last 30 years in this business? Get real,if not US Airways what Home Depot or Best Buy.
I'm sure Delta, American or Northwest would love to have us all...RIGHT!
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[/blockquote]

Pinger,

SouthWest does not share your sentiment. Airlines are going have to use their Harvard/Brown/Yale/MIT brains and market this airline, otherwise, it won't matter how much cost savings they got.