Chip, I appreciate your understanding, however im not frustrated.... Im merely pointing out that there has been nothing said anywhere that we no longer qualify for the atsb loan. Is the 7% profit margin a must for qualification?.... possibly.. However i think that all points of the atsb qualification list will all be up and down through out this process as far as US meeting the requirements. Im not trying to argue again just asked a simple question. I think your response that the reason the company doesnt say this outright is a fear of running off passengers isnt a valid one. Before in past management and currently this team has shown it will do what it has to do not withstanding what passengers think. My point is i appreciate fullness and accuracy.. You seem to be intelligent and informed somewhat, and i like to pride myself as well as being some what informed. I however dont do much of speculating or quoting simply because no one on this board knows whats going on .. We can all speculate, repeat articles, or quote a friend or person who is close to someones mom .. I tend to listen, wonder and use somewhat some commonsense. Again i do appreciate your efforts and your concern for our company. I enjoy reading some of your post and frankly agree at least 50% of the time with some of your post ... Thanks