US Airways to go after Uniteds assets?

[real world]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 1/15/2003 9:51:34 PM UnitedChicago wrote:

You got to be joking. Why would UA sell DEN? It's right smack dab in the middle of their route structure!

If and the keyword is IF they were to sell off an operation operation...they'd start with something that had the least impact. The first thing to go in my would be MIA and south america.

But...everyone knows that the strength of UA is their route structure - the best in the industry. They will fight to the end to keep that entact.

The "interesting corporate transaction" talk is the biggest BS. I'm sure the "good news" Dave is set to announce will be code-share related.

On paper...closing IND and sharing maintanence facilities in PIT sounds cost interesting. But with UA and the IAM in tense negotiations...I HIGHLY doubt that this scenario is true.

Can we please retire the words unique and interesting?


----------------
[/blockquote]
Why did Pan Am sell Asia, South Amercia and LHR and same for TWA (LHR that is), becasue they needed the money. You can only sell what people are interested in buying.

 

[UnitedChicago]

real world:

why are Pan Am, TWA, and lets add Eastern (sold south america and east coast shuttle) all out of business?

Many reasons...but one big reason is because they dismantled their route structure through asset sales to the point that no one wanted to fly them anymore.

UA will only sell if they are faced with liquidation. Knock-on-wood, they are not to that point. They are meeting the stringent conditions for the DIP financing. They have time - albeit not much - to continue to operate intact and righ the ship.

Now it's no secret that a combined UA and U still makes a lot of sense. Who knows...it may or may not happen and I know many love to fanasize about scenarios.

But I honestly don't think anyone at UA WHQ has the time to even consider this aspect at this point.

 

[DCAflyer]

Frugal Flyer wrote:[BR][BR]... if UA were to put up some assets for sale, I would imagine some sort of a bidding war. How would the bk. court and the UA creditors react if UA wanted to sell a hub such as DEN to USAirways but CO or DL or Frontier offerred more $$$ for it? I would imagine that even if UA wanted to sell to US, the creditors / judge may not approve it but instead sell to the higher bidder. Can US get into a bidding war? Would US have enough $$$ for this even with the ATSB loan guarentee?[BR][BR][BR]DCAflyer responds:[BR][BR]I dont' believe there is a law in the bankruptcy code requring the judge to accept the highest bid. There is also no reason why the companies couldn't lobby the creditors committee to recommend such an arrangement as being in the best interest in the company. Simply put, IF UAL wanted to sell DEN ops to U (a big if) and IF AA, DAL, or NWA tried to outbid U, then UAL and U could go to the creditors committee and say, "Look, this transaction will allow UAL to remain a viable airline and infuse needed cash into the company. It remains the best option for UAL to continue to be a viable concern and in the long run the best option for you (the creditors) to be paid in full." There is a good chance the committee would recommend such a transaction since UAL would continue to have access to the route structure under the codeshare agreement.[BR]

 

[JFK777]

Stick-in-Rudder,

Wolf purchased the London Heathrow routes from Pan Am as well as the routes to South America. Dick Ferris the CEO until 1987 purchased the first jewel, the Asian routes. Wolf bought balance to the UA international route system by making them a big player to Europe, espescially Heathrow.

 

[DCAflyer]

UnitedChicago asked:[BR][BR]Why would UA sell DEN?[BR][BR][BR]DCAflyer responds:[BR][BR]Same reason United would restart its ill-conseived "low-cost" shuttle... and the same reason they thought the ATSB would literally buy into their fundmanetally-flawed previous restructuring plan. Stupidity! [BR][BR]Not that our airline hasn't experienced more than its share of adle-brained management decisions over the years. But you shouldn't assume that UAL management has learned from the mistakes of airlines past. You need to realize that on the upper floors of WHQ, a lot of decisions are being made. Who knows what they are or how they will play out. But UAL employees shouldn't underestimate their far-reaching implications. Is UAL going to hand over any of its profitable routes or operations to U? Probably not. But there could be a deeper relationship being developed than what we have seen.[BR][BR]DCAflyer

 

[UnitedChicago]

Pineybob & DCAflyer:

I assume you both are U employees. How would or did you feel when the CH7 spector was raised about U? Or how about asset sales?

All of this talk on this post is just TALK.

Can you PLEASE give the UA employees some RESPECT and at least let them get through the first two full months of BK?

You both have no clue what's goin on at UA. You make many assumptions. I could waste more time and refute them...but I won't.

If nothing else, please show a little respect for your colleagues in the industry - especially since you all are going through the same thing.

 

[delldude]

[P]
[BLOCKQUOTE][BR]----------------[BR]On 1/15/2003 2:43:17 PM ITRADE wrote:
[P]I find it a bit macabre that folks are discussing picking over the bones of UA's carcass when folks were debating, with some resentment, the same of US Airways just a month ago.[BR][BR][/P]----------------[/BLOCKQUOTE]
[P][/P]I/T:what comes around goez around.

 

[ITRADE]

[P]
[BLOCKQUOTE][BR]----------------[BR]On 1/16/2003 10:27:19 AM UnitedChicago wrote:
[P]Pineybob & DCAflyer:[BR][BR]I assume you both are U employees. [BR][BR]----------------[/P][/BLOCKQUOTE]
[P]You are dead wrong on one account. And, you may be wrong on a second account.[/P]

 

[UnitedChicago]

That's fine if they're not... still ... a little respect please.

 

[UnitedChicago]

I hear you both. Let me clarify that I'm not a United employee...I'm a loyal UA customer.

I felt for you all at U when you file ch11 and truly hope things will work out. I don't think it's right for either group to be disrespected by talk - that's why I get vocal about it.

Anyway...I think we all agree on hoping for the best in both situations.

 

[DCAflyer]

UnitedChicago said:[BR][BR][SPAN class=BodyFont]Pineybob & DCAflyer:[BR][BR]I assume you both are U employees. How would or did you feel when the CH7 spector was raised about U? Or how about asset sales?[BR][BR]All of this talk on this post is just TALK.[BR][BR]Can you PLEASE give the UA employees some RESPECT and at least let them get through the first two full months of BK?[BR][BR]You both have no clue what's goin on at UA. You make many assumptions. I could waste more time and refute them...but I won't.[BR][BR]If nothing else, please show a little respect for your colleagues in the industry - especially since you all are going through the same thing.[BR][BR][BR]DCAflyer responds:[BR][BR]Sorry, Chicago, but I don't think I said anything disrespectful to UAL employees. A couple of points in reply I feel are in order, however. [BR][BR]First, for countless weeks and months the U employees on this board had to endure demeaning remarks by, among others, UAL employees who visited this very site. Now that the shoe is on the other foot, UAL folks don't like it. But again, nothing in my post was demeaning. [BR][BR]Second, when the merger discussions were alive and ongoing back in 2000-2001, UAL employees were up in arms and certainly were not about to willingly let us into your precious little fold... or your elite group, if you will... with one labor group going so far as to file a lawsuit to block seniority integration. If there is bad blood and ill feelings about a potential union between the two airlines and if U comes out smelling like a rose, UAL employees need look no further than themselves as to why there might be some hesitation on the part of U employees to graciously accept UAL employees into such a scenario. [BR][BR]And finally, THIS IS THE US AIRWAYS BOARD. If you don't like our discussions, don't visit this page. If you asked us to be more respectul on the UAL page (and again, I don't think I was disrespectful) you might have a point. [BR][BR]All this is not to say I wish anything bad to happen to United. But UAL folks were in denial for a LONG time about what might happen. You can swallow your pride and learn from our experience. But I do not now and never have wished anything negative on UAL employees. But just remember when you ask us to be respectful, MANY MANY MANY of YOUR people weren't respectful to us for a LONG LONG LONG time.[BR][BR]DCAflyer[/SPAN]

 

[BillLumbergh]

Let's play nice, here.

 

[DCAflyer]

UnitedChicago,[BR][BR]Thanks for the clarification. I assumed from your handle that you were a UAL employee. Thanks also for your good wishes. I feel positive that we will work out our issues and emerge victorious. [BR][BR]DCAflyer

 

[UnitedChicago]

DCAFlyer:

No problem...sorry for the confusion!

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that U emerges. You all have overcome huge challanges and I hope the pension issue can be solved.

Take care.

 

[iflyjetz]

Is this one of those Nero threads? (Fiddling as Rome burns around you)

CAL and AMR are quickly approaching chap 11; perhaps U can buy a bunch of their assets as well?

First, DEN and SFO are not slot limited. Please, have U open up major hubs there. There's nothing stopping U.

Second, RSA holding a bunch of leases on UAL jets means nothing. UAL can return them to RSA, so that they can join thier brethren in early retirement in the deserts of the southwest US. RSA holds no hammer over UAL; RSA is probably much more concerned about those jets being returned to them.

Let me know when PHL is going up on the auction block. It's the only decent O&D hub that U's got. I want to make sure that Tilton puts in a bid for it. Oh crap, I forgot. We're chap 11, and don't have a bunch of extra cash to be buying $hit from other airlines. Hmmm ... isn't U chap 11? No interesting/unique corporate transaction's going to change that.