Us Airways - Continental

[BoeingBoy]

Maybe the CLT Observer caught some of the discussion we've have about posible parallels with the CAL turnaround. Maybe not. But they wrote an article talking about the comparison.....

(Yes, it requires a free subscription)

Hanging up the gloves

Can US Airways and its workers mend a bruised relationship?

KERRY HALL AND TONY MECIA

Staff Writers

The airline had twice filed for bankruptcy protection. It had slashed employee wages. Morale cratered, and some workers feared the company would ground its flights and end their jobs for good.

The year was 1994, not 2004. The airline was Continental, not US Airways.

Jim

 

[wings396]

And the BIG Difference, is that CO Cared about Morale. As we all know that is not the case here at US, and it never has been. The Employees have been the constant Whipping Boys of Management here. CO had the Employees give back once, not THREE times. On top of that they actually did something constructive with the givebacks by turning the Airline around. At US, we give and they continue to make one blunder after another. Concessions are the Only plan this Airline ever had to turn things around. After 10 years of being run out of town by SWA they now THINK that they finally have a plan to compete with them an the other LCC's......

 

[kiloromeo]

Very little similarity:

1. SWA had only about 80 aircraft at that time, LCCs were not around in any meaningfull size. They still had the high yield Biz traveler back then
2. The state of the industry was in no way as pathetic as it it today. One estimate is that 75% of all passenger traffic by the end of 2005 will fly on a C11 airline.


CO had much easier environment in which to climb back...

 

[repeet]

Since we're Americans, loyality is one thing and cash is another.

As Americans we will endure, and be loyal to those to whom we think deserve it.

On the other hand, what does loyality have to do with business. (Crystal City has taught us that, very well).

Since US Aiways has spent years showing us how worthless and unworthy their employees are,

if you want the work done, SHOW US THE CASH!!!

 

[whlinder]

CO had two underutilized hubs to grow (IAH & EWR). What does US have? PHL would be something but WN is there now and the operation is a mess. DCA & LGA are decent but limited by slots. I don't think they have a comparable market that can be developed like CO did to IAH & EWR.

 

[sfb]

1. SWA had only about 80 aircraft at that time, LCCs were not around in any meaningfull size. They still had the high yield Biz traveler back then

Bzzzzt. As of December 31, 1994, Southwest had 199 aircraft. And their operation at HOU (across town from CO's largest hub) was almost as large as it is today (within about 10%). WN also was one of their biggest competitors at CLE back in 1994.

2. The state of the industry was in no way as pathetic as it it today. One estimate is that 75% of all passenger traffic by the end of 2005 will fly on a C11 airline.

This is true to some degree, but 1994 wasn't a great year for the industry, either. USAir lost a staggering $685 million that year. And the industry had seen plenty of majors go into bankruptcy -- Eastern, Pan Am, Midway, TWA, America West, and Continental -- between 1991 and 1993, with only the latter three surviving.

One of the biggest differences, as others have said, was that CO had two underdeveloped hubs with great potential at EWR and IAH. They had a more robust international route structure. Air Mike was a cash machine for Continental for many years. And they had management which was willing to talk the talk and walk the walk. Here's the relevant section from the "Go Forward" Plan: "Working Together -- Have a company where employees enjoy coming to work every day and are valued for their contributions. Treat each other with dignity and respect. Focus on safety, make employee programs easy to use, and keep improving communication. Pay compensation which is fair to employees and fair to the company."

 

[UseYourHead]

Continental’s problems started back in 82-83 with BK 1. And yes there was a BK 2 along with numerous other problems...one BIG one was how they treated employees. You ob-viously were not around, that mess went on for years.

It took over a decade of blunders before someone (Gordon) came in and morale picked up.

So what do we have in common with CO?

If we want to be a turn around, like they were (and unlike EAL, PanAm, etc.) we have to be here for that to happen. The just shut it down mentality is not a part of the solution.

Can things be better here, HELL YES! But it starts with each one of us, what we do each day, how we treat each other’s, and our customers.

And the BIG Difference, is that CO Cared about Morale. As we all know that is not the case here at US, and it never has been. The Employees have been the constant Whipping Boys of Management here. CO had the Employees give back once, not THREE times. On top of that they actually did something constructive with the givebacks by turning the Airline around. At US, we give and they continue to make one blunder after another. Concessions are the Only plan this Airline ever had to turn things around. After 10 years of being run out of town by SWA they now THINK that they finally have a plan to compete with them an the other LCC's......

[post="196760"][/post]​

 

[sfb]

Continental’s problems started back in 82-83 with BK 1. And yes there was a BK 2 along with numerous other problems...one BIG one was how they treated employees.

...

If we want to be a turn around, like they were (and unlike EAL, PanAm, etc.) we have to be here for that to happen. The just shut it down mentality is not a part of the solution.

The essential problem is that the "beatings will continue until morale improves" mentality isn't part of the solution, either. How do you expect people to respond when management's (and certain pilots') response to criticism is "well if you don't like it, leave?" What's the appropriate response to contract proposals that are land grabs of epic proportions? Sure, oil prices have spiked -- but does that justify contracts that won't be amendable for over seven years -- and tack on a couple of years of management foot-dragging at the negotiating table afterwards for good measure? Does this mean that the mechanics and CWA should essentially vote themselves out of jobs? Would the pilots have gone along with the company if they had proposed outsourcing all 737 flying to Mesa?

It is abundantly clear that management's negotiating tactics have moved to a scorched-earth policy. How can they expect people to be happy about coming to work when the message is "we value you but only if you're willing to work for the lowest salaries in the industry?"

 

[UseYourHead]

The pilots did have the courage to vote in the lesser of two evils (brought to us by the 4 fools that were going to show the company). My point is that we did vote in something that could result in job losses, and major pain, because it was better than the alternative.

I have a feeling that this round for the other groups could be a better deal for many/most than starting over. It would be good for folks to be out pounding the pavement to tst the waters ahead of time.

I agree with you about a change in management tactics, I hope it comes soon too, we sure could use someone to rally around...we have all shown how well we can do it!

The essential problem is that the "beatings will continue until morale improves" mentality isn't part of the solution, either. How do you expect people to respond when management's (and certain pilots') response to criticism is "well if you don't like it, leave?" What's the appropriate response to contract proposals that are land grabs of epic proportions? Sure, oil prices have spiked -- but does that justify contracts that won't be amendable for over seven years -- and tack on a couple of years of management foot-dragging at the negotiating table afterwards for good measure? Does this mean that the mechanics and CWA should essentially vote themselves out of jobs? Would the pilots have gone along with the company if they had proposed outsourcing all 737 flying to Mesa?

It is abundantly clear that management's negotiating tactics have moved to a scorched-earth policy. How can they expect people to be happy about coming to work when the message is "we value you but only if you're willing to work for the lowest salaries in the industry?"

[post="197202"][/post]​

 

[Headhunter]

It took over a decade of blunders before someone (Gordon) came in and morale picked up.

[post="197196"][/post]​

And you know where he came in from? PIEDMONT! Here's a toast to all my fellow Speedbirds! I know we're supposed to move beyond 1988, but the answer is to let all the ORIGINAL Piedmonters run US Airways - they knew what they were doing!

Also, let's not forget that the Internet wasn't as prevalent, especially online bookings, back in 1994. "Perfect" price information has changed a lot. Others say that it wasn't the Internet per se which lowered fares, but the LCCs who offered those low fares - but I believe both factors go hand-in-hand.

 

[Headhunter]

Interesting quote from the article:
"Wow. He's not some weasel from a New York investment bank here to cut our checks."

So, where have the two most recent UAIR BOD hires (i.e., Lakefield, Stanfield) come from????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Justaramper]

The greedy ones have got to go...! Until certain ones from upper mgt. are gone, it will be a never ending fight between "us & them"

Some of us are here, because we have chosen to stay. But many are starting to leave and it's a shame because we are losing damn good employees.

Al C, Jerry glASS , Benny B and Lakefield should consider another means of employment.....

 

[UseYourHead]

I know, I was hired at Piedmont in Jan 1986....

And you know where he came in from? PIEDMONT! Here's a toast to all my fellow Speedbirds! I know we're supposed to move beyond 1988, but the answer is to let all the ORIGINAL Piedmonters run US Airways - they knew what they were doing!

Also, let's not forget that the Internet wasn't as prevalent, especially online bookings, back in 1994. "Perfect" price information has changed a lot. Others say that it wasn't the Internet per se which lowered fares, but the LCCs who offered those low fares - but I believe both factors go hand-in-hand.

[post="197238"][/post]​

 

[usfliboi]

Just so youll know, CAL will implement paycuts, across the board, before befune leaves. !

 

[700UW]

First of all it is Bethuene, and CO's Pilots, F/As and Mechanics are unionized, they cannot implement paycuts on them across the board.