United help or hinderence?

[Oliver Stone''s Apprentice]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 12/5/2002 9:48:42 AM WingNaPrayer wrote:

I have never seen 8 workers per gate at ANY airline! In fact, many times at AA gates in MIA, I've seen only two, and sometimes only ONE!
----------------
[/blockquote]

That may be the case above the wing, but I think the original post was talking about below the wing.

On the ramp, AA has typically a four or five man crew.

Add in an agent or two inside, and you have 6 or 7 per gate.

Take it down to a three man crew and a one agent gate you end up with 4 per gate. Not unthinkable.

 

[Oliver Stone''s Apprentice]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 12/5/2002 9:48:42 AM WingNaPrayer wrote:

I have never seen 8 workers per gate at ANY airline! In fact, many times at AA gates in MIA, I've seen only two, and sometimes only ONE!
----------------
[/blockquote]

That may be the case above the wing, but I think the original post was talking about below the wing.

On the ramp, AA has typically a four or five man crew.

Add in an agent or two inside, and you have 6 or 7 per gate.

Take it down to a three man crew and a one agent gate you end up with 4 per gate. Not unthinkable.

 

[DFWCC]

DR Z I was one of the AA CCs to help train TWA Leads in AA proceedures. One of the areas that needed improvement was weight and balance, seemingly not a high concern at TWA. AA saved $million$ in fuel cost by having their jets fly in proper trim. One CC every other gate is not feasable if the CC is held accountable for all the weight and its proper distribution on an aircraft. Beleive me, he is.
He needs one crew one gate at a time. He is responsible for everthing under the wing. And he damn well better be right. AA will periodically do a load audit on inbound flights. Also any Captain can request one if he or she has trim problems. Critiacl you bet. Remember the GANDOR crash. Weight and balance. Just as there is a sterile cockpit on final approach I woundn't want a CC to mix his numbers between 2 gates.
Besides 1 lead 2 gates, who went BK? Thank You
s

 

[DFWCC]

DR Z I was one of the AA CCs to help train TWA Leads in AA proceedures. One of the areas that needed improvement was weight and balance, seemingly not a high concern at TWA. AA saved $million$ in fuel cost by having their jets fly in proper trim. One CC every other gate is not feasable if the CC is held accountable for all the weight and its proper distribution on an aircraft. Beleive me, he is.
He needs one crew one gate at a time. He is responsible for everthing under the wing. And he damn well better be right. AA will periodically do a load audit on inbound flights. Also any Captain can request one if he or she has trim problems. Critiacl you bet. Remember the GANDOR crash. Weight and balance. Just as there is a sterile cockpit on final approach I woundn't want a CC to mix his numbers between 2 gates.
Besides 1 lead 2 gates, who went BK? Thank You
s

 

[grndproxwarning]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 12/5/2002 128 AM DFWCC wrote:

If U goes BK. How do you think it will effect AA?
1] There will be those who are scared to fly an airline in bk and they may move over to AA. That's a help.
2] U will get larger concessions from their workers and with lower cost that will put pressure on AA's labor force to lower wages to compete.
3] Result: When all the airlines have lower their wages to meet U's lower cost. U goes out to pasture. AA gets their pax. AA makes money and the unions fight to get back wages. In 3 yrs we'll be back to where we were [$] 2 yrs ago.
----------------
[/blockquote]Remember one thing.
Bush will not always be there to protect AA
You guys are next!

 

[grndproxwarning]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 12/5/2002 128 AM DFWCC wrote:

If U goes BK. How do you think it will effect AA?
1] There will be those who are scared to fly an airline in bk and they may move over to AA. That's a help.
2] U will get larger concessions from their workers and with lower cost that will put pressure on AA's labor force to lower wages to compete.
3] Result: When all the airlines have lower their wages to meet U's lower cost. U goes out to pasture. AA gets their pax. AA makes money and the unions fight to get back wages. In 3 yrs we'll be back to where we were [$] 2 yrs ago.
----------------
[/blockquote]Remember one thing.
Bush will not always be there to protect AA
You guys are next!

 

[WingNaPrayer]

[P]
[BLOCKQUOTE][BR]----------------[BR]On 12/5/2002 3:05:04 PM grndproxwarning wrote:
[P][/P]Remember one thing.[BR]Bush will not always be there to protect AA[BR]You guys are next![BR]
[P][/P]----------------[/BLOCKQUOTE]
[P]I wonder if AA will provide him with that retro-fitted 737 decked out in the 60's livery for his re-election campaign.[BR][BR]Talk about having a MAJOR conflict of interest! AA DID put in their two cents worth in challenging UA's loan guarantees, which just might turn out to be the biggest mistake they've made yet.[/P]

 

[WingNaPrayer]

[P]
[BLOCKQUOTE][BR]----------------[BR]On 12/5/2002 3:05:04 PM grndproxwarning wrote:
[P][/P]Remember one thing.[BR]Bush will not always be there to protect AA[BR]You guys are next![BR]
[P][/P]----------------[/BLOCKQUOTE]
[P]I wonder if AA will provide him with that retro-fitted 737 decked out in the 60's livery for his re-election campaign.[BR][BR]Talk about having a MAJOR conflict of interest! AA DID put in their two cents worth in challenging UA's loan guarantees, which just might turn out to be the biggest mistake they've made yet.[/P]

 

[Oliver Stone''s Apprentice]

I suppose he should have flown Mexicana instead?...

 

[Oliver Stone''s Apprentice]

I suppose he should have flown Mexicana instead?...

 

[TWAnr]

[H4][A href="http://www.thestreet.com/_yahoo/funds/ericgillin/10057351_2.html"][FONT size=2]http://www.thestreet.com/_yahoo/funds/ericgillin/10057351_2.html[/FONT][/A][BR][BR]UAL's Loss Is Rivals' Gain[BR][FONT size=1]Page 2[BR][/FONT][BR][FONT size=2]The Big Winner: American[/FONT][/H4]
[P]More than any other carrier, the one most likely to benefit from UAL's bankruptcy is the nation's largest, American Airlines. These two rivals fight head-to-head in Chicago, United's biggest hub, and in California, one of the nation's largest and most competitive travel markets. With UAL cutting flights and services, many analysts feel that American can steal back some market share, without cutting too deeply into profit margins. [/P]
[P]Prior to the Air Transportation Stabilization Board's rejection of UAL's request, some industry watchers expressed concern that a UAL bankruptcy would trigger a domino effect where more carriers would go bankrupt. The thought was that a bankrupt UAL would gain significant price advantages against rivals, especially AMR, and use it to drive them out of business. [/P]
[P]But most Wall Street analysts dismissed this idea, arguing that UAL management will act rationally, understanding the risk to the overall industry in triggering a price war. "We do not subscribe to the domino theory of bankruptcy in the airline industry," wrote Higgins. "Ultimately, what it takes for UAL's competitors to maximize revenues is almost exactly what it takes for UAL to do the same -- any damage UAL does to its competitors' top line would hurt it as well -- and we believe UAL understands that." [/P]
[P]While this theory won't actually be tested until UAL files Chapter 11, it does make some sense, considering that USAir has made numerous attempts to raise prices, not lower them, while in bankruptcy. [/P]
[P]AMR will also benefit on the labor front, since UAL's unions will likely have their wages reduced while the company restructures. American's pilots are flying under an open contract and will be far less likely to be demanding at the negotiation table, not while pilots are being sacked at UAL.[/P]

 

[TWAnr]

[H4][A href="http://www.thestreet.com/_yahoo/funds/ericgillin/10057351_2.html"][FONT size=2]http://www.thestreet.com/_yahoo/funds/ericgillin/10057351_2.html[/FONT][/A][BR][BR]UAL's Loss Is Rivals' Gain[BR][FONT size=1]Page 2[BR][/FONT][BR][FONT size=2]The Big Winner: American[/FONT][/H4]
[P]More than any other carrier, the one most likely to benefit from UAL's bankruptcy is the nation's largest, American Airlines. These two rivals fight head-to-head in Chicago, United's biggest hub, and in California, one of the nation's largest and most competitive travel markets. With UAL cutting flights and services, many analysts feel that American can steal back some market share, without cutting too deeply into profit margins. [/P]
[P]Prior to the Air Transportation Stabilization Board's rejection of UAL's request, some industry watchers expressed concern that a UAL bankruptcy would trigger a domino effect where more carriers would go bankrupt. The thought was that a bankrupt UAL would gain significant price advantages against rivals, especially AMR, and use it to drive them out of business. [/P]
[P]But most Wall Street analysts dismissed this idea, arguing that UAL management will act rationally, understanding the risk to the overall industry in triggering a price war. "We do not subscribe to the domino theory of bankruptcy in the airline industry," wrote Higgins. "Ultimately, what it takes for UAL's competitors to maximize revenues is almost exactly what it takes for UAL to do the same -- any damage UAL does to its competitors' top line would hurt it as well -- and we believe UAL understands that." [/P]
[P]While this theory won't actually be tested until UAL files Chapter 11, it does make some sense, considering that USAir has made numerous attempts to raise prices, not lower them, while in bankruptcy. [/P]
[P]AMR will also benefit on the labor front, since UAL's unions will likely have their wages reduced while the company restructures. American's pilots are flying under an open contract and will be far less likely to be demanding at the negotiation table, not while pilots are being sacked at UAL.[/P]

 

[AAmech]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 12/5/2002 3:05:04 PM grndproxwarning wrote:

[blockquote]
----------------

----------------
[/blockquote]Remember one thing.
Bush will not always be there to protect AA
You guys are next!

----------------
[/blockquote]
Protect? I's sure like to know what AA has gotten from GW?

Bush has his DOJ appealing the judges Anti-Trust decision.
Denied their bid for Anti-trust with BA.
Refused to give AA routes to China.

Yeah, Ol GWB. Great Friend of AA!!

 

[AAmech]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 12/5/2002 3:05:04 PM grndproxwarning wrote:

[blockquote]
----------------

----------------
[/blockquote]Remember one thing.
Bush will not always be there to protect AA
You guys are next!

----------------
[/blockquote]
Protect? I's sure like to know what AA has gotten from GW?

Bush has his DOJ appealing the judges Anti-Trust decision.
Denied their bid for Anti-trust with BA.
Refused to give AA routes to China.

Yeah, Ol GWB. Great Friend of AA!!

 

[ZMAN777]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 12/5/2002 8:18:57 AM FA Mikey wrote:

AA will maintain a better cost advantage over its weaker rivals U and UAL.
----------------
[/blockquote]

Mikey,

I hate to burst your bubble of naivete' but currently AMR is losing MORE than UAL every single day. At ORD, while UAL is hurting, you guys are hurting MORE! Don't take my word for it. Go ask your own guys who track loads/revenue/fleet plans.

If this weren't the case I don't think Uncle Don would be coming for your wallet. Add to this the liklihood that UAL will soon be lowering its' costs and perhaps you can begin to see the fault in your logic.

The 4 billion in savings is a GOAL! And guess what, you're not anywhere close to it!

Don't get me wrong. I'm not bashing AMR at all. My girlfriend flys for your guys and I've had great flights aboard you as well. What I'm saying is don't drink the kool-aide wholesale. I admire a team player but it's important to remain objective when evaluating anything the company feeds you.

Cheers,
Z