UA to FLY PHL-SFO 6 flights a day

[BuffaloJoe]

I was looking at the booking section and it has listed PHL-SFO with 6 N/S, 1 being CO op westbound. Seems wild that UA would add all those flights just due to Virgin America doing 2. US has 5/Day also. Just seems like there is going to be a war this summer. LAX flight is a AM departure too in APR.

 

[jimntx]

Is there a chance that the UA/CO flights are "operated by US Airways"? They all do codeshare a lot.

 

[BuffaloJoe]

Is there a chance that the UA/CO flights are "operated by US Airways"? They all do codeshare a lot.

But the US flight times are different as well as equipment. US flies A321's on the route as UA flies A319 and 1 CO-738 W/B. And I think that they can not codeshare between PHL-SFO only flights.

 

[zethya]

OAG Schedule for 7/20/2012 (Peak Season to the West Coast) :
PHL-SFO
UA 4 Non Stops and 1 One Stop
US 5 Non Stops
VX 2 Non Stops

UA has 2 PHL Departing flights scheduled with 10 minutes of VX's.

9 against 2 - That's a bit of a lopsided challenge. Seems that US would care less about VX at PHL if they are planning to merge with AA and switch to OW. Kind of a shame that U.S. airlines will do anything to destroy VX and deprive the consumer the benefit of choosing a higher quality product. IMO, the really difficult challenge for VX is to convince high yield passengers to leave Alliance members and choose VX - which cannot offer any international FF travel benefits - not even on other Virgin affiliates (e.g., Virgin Atlantic). I'm afraid that unless US does actually merge out of *A, VX's days on this route may be numbered.

 

[BuffaloJoe]

12 Nonstops in May

US-5
UA-4
VX-2
CO-1

I included CO with UA in the title, but UA had a 11:45am nonstop that got pulled off. It may have been on for a short time. Also the CO and UA flights 2 of them leave within 50 minutes of each other with US's flight in the middle. With VX flying 3 to LAX, I wonder what DL's response will be. US has 6 on the LAX flight.

 

[WorldTraveler]

With VX decision to enter the market, UA has no choice but to add service in order to protect its key hub

 

[jimntx]

12 Nonstops in May

US-5
UA-4
VX-2
CO-1

I included CO with UA in the title, but UA had a 11:45am nonstop that got pulled off. It may have been on for a short time. Also the CO and UA flights 2 of them leave within 50 minutes of each other with US's flight in the middle. With VX flying 3 to LAX, I wonder what DL's response will be. US has 6 on the LAX flight.

At some point, someone is going to have to answer the question...Does the PHL-SFO market justify 12 non-stop transcons/day? As important as SFO has been to AA over the years, we have been cutting back in the SFO market in general.

 

[BoeingBoy]

To/from SFO by itself? Probably not an a year around basis, at least not with average load factors high enough to be profitable. The bay area? Yes, if passengers can be attracted to SFO because of the competition (i.e. lower fares which hurts US/UA more than VX).

Jim

 

[FWAAA]

Cush of VX thinks the market is underserved:

"In Philadelphia, we saw two things that were particularly attractive," said Virgin America president and CEO David Cush. "One was high ticket prices, which generally when we come in drop quite a bit.

"Second, about half the travelers going between Philadelphia and San Francisco and Los Angeles fly nonstop. The other half connect through other cities, like Chicago or Dallas-Fort Worth.

"That tells us that it is an underserved market. People are connecting because there are not enough nonstop seats on the route."

http://articles.philly.com/2012-01-18/business/30639672_1_virgin-america-ceo-david-cush-touch-screen-entertainment

My response two weeks ago was that perhaps only half of the passengers between PHL and SFO are willing to pay the generally higher nonstop fares and that perhaps the other half are fare-sensitive leisure passengers and don't mind connecting. If VX lowers fares on the nonstops (likely), they might stimulate demand for nonstops.

 

[WorldTraveler]

That UA and US were not doing a better job at keeping the local market on themselves opened the door for VX to enter the market.
.
Sure VX' presence in the market will increase the share of traffic flying on somebody's nonstops - but it will also dramatically reduce fares with the amount of capacity that is being thrown into the market.
.
In ORD and JFK, VX has been able to withstand much larger competitive responses than what UA and US are mounting in PHL and they have persisted with their expansion. The only carriers likely to be hurt long=term will be UA and US - and yet one more long-haul market that has been the domain of network carriers will be shared with a low fare carrier - in this case one who delivers a pretty strong value proposition that passengers seem to support.

 

[NWANWA]

Cush of VX thinks the market is underserved:


http://articles.philly.com/2012-01-18/business/30639672_1_virgin-america-ceo-david-cush-touch-screen-entertainment

My response two weeks ago was that perhaps only half of the passengers between PHL and SFO are willing to pay the generally higher nonstop fares and that perhaps the other half are fare-sensitive leisure passengers and don't mind connecting. If VX lowers fares on the nonstops (likely), they might stimulate demand for nonstops.

My friend just paid 2400 dollars for a roundtrip flight in First on United this summer. United def. gets a premium on these flights out of SFO and should do well with the connections in PHL onto USAirways. Some people will fly Virgin, but United has a great FFprogram and many loyal fliers out of the bay area.