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[Bob Owens]

That's the problem with pro company sorts like you, you see a paltry monetary offer and think it's the "end all." It was a lump sump that did not increase your salary, but pensionable.
Are you aware of the other little goodies in that contract? One biggie was the company wouldve have started putting NON LICENSED mechanics in the line stations.
The company wants that very badly and if they insist, then I can guarantee you the mechanics will shut this place down. But unlike the debacle at NWA, we won't strike, we will keep planes on the ground LEGALLY.

The companys offer cantained many many concessions.
They want to get rid of Seniority based "first shot" at promotion
They want to have sub-industry standards on Overtime rates
They want sub-industry standards on Vacation accrual
They want sub -industry standards on sick time pay
They want sub-industry standards on sick time accrual
They want sub-industry Holiday pay rates and quantity
They want another 2 year pay freeze at present concessionary rates
They wanted mandatory acceptance of Transfers in the event of a layoff, don't fill the opening wherever it may be and you are terminated
They want the grievant to have less time to respond to a grievance than the company has. If the grievant responds late he loses automatically based on time limits.
There are more.
Basically they are trying to pick up whatever they feel they left on the table in 2003. Our pay has declined by nearly 40% yet they still won't offer any money, they wont even discuss it, I believe the position of the company as far as money is "it must be cost neutral". In other words "no money". At the very least all the productivity gains and job losses that we've given the company since 2003 should be a part of "the pie", they dont even want to consider that either, last year they claimed that fuel costs took that, now they wont even discuss it!!! Basically its "screw you we're not giving you anything, we wont even discuss it". Negotiations have gone on for a year and a half and the company has refused to address any money issues whatsoever despite the many concessions given by the TWU.

 

[Hopeful]

The companys offer cantained many many concessions.
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Thanks for that wealth of information, Bob. No let's wait for EOLESEN and FWAAA to respond. They imply that they are all for us "union folk" getting a better contract and how we should be blaming our union and how this is not really the "time" to seek restore and more.
In their eyes, our wonderful and irreplaceable management team can do no wrong and have been more than generous because we still have a pension.....blah blah blah

 

[Bob Owens]

Thanks for that wealth of information, Bob. No let's wait for EOLESEN and FWAAA to respond. They imply that they are all for us "union folk" getting a better contract and how we should be blaming our union and how this is not really the "time" to seek restore and more.
In their eyes, our wonderful and irreplaceable management team can do no wrong and have been more than generous because we still have a pension.....blah blah blah

The only reason we have the pension is because it was cheaper and required less cash than a replacement 401K would have. If they had the same plan as SWA they would have had to lay out a lot more cash than they did.

Look in your Total Value Statement, the last time I checked they laid out around $2k towards my pension. I believe SWA has up to an 8% match on total earnings (and a minimum contribution if the emploee contributes nothing). With OT that means AA would have had to lay out $5600 instead of $2000 if we had the same plan. They saved at least $3600 just on me.

We have to keep the DP because they've underfunded it (as they are legally allowed) for years and we dont have the opportunity to build up our savings. We have to make them live up to this promise but if I had the choice all over gain I'd take the SWA pension.

 

[tech2101]

Dave, just because the media or a couple politicians label the reimbursement a bailout doesn't make it one.

Case law shows that restitution can be paid to businesses for lost revenues during the time their business were closed, as long as it can be determined such closing was directly caused by a defendant’s conduct.

There's never been any suspension of an entire business in any other industry that I can think of, so all of the examples I find were directly related to criminal activity. Maybe FWAAA knows of other examples.

You can argue about how much each airline should have received as restitution, but what was reimbursed didn't come anywhere close to covering the actual expenses incurred.

However convenient it is, to call the 2001 payments a bailout is simply ignorant.

Your post is accurate.

 

[The Goose]

The only reason we have the pension is because it was cheaper and required less cash than a replacement 401K would have. If they had the same plan as SWA they would have had to lay out a lot more cash than they did.

Look in your Total Value Statement, the last time I checked they laid out around $2k towards my pension. I believe SWA has up to an 8% match on total earnings (and a minimum contribution if the emploee contributes nothing). With OT that means AA would have had to lay out $5600 instead of $2000 if we had the same plan. They saved at least $3600 just on me.

We have to keep the DP because they've underfunded it (as they are legally allowed) for years and we dont have the opportunity to build up our savings. We have to make them live up to this promise but if I had the choice all over gain I'd take the SWA pension.

The company will, without a doubt, pay. They'd obviously prefer it to be in a non-quantifiable way as it is now.

 

[eolesen]

Thanks for that wealth of information, Bob. No let's wait for EOLESEN and FWAAA to respond. They imply that they are all for us "union folk" getting a better contract and how we should be blaming our union and how this is not really the "time" to seek restore and more.
In their eyes, our wonderful and irreplaceable management team can do no wrong and have been more than generous because we still have a pension.....blah blah blah

Why bother? One of my 'alternative lifestyle' coworkers used to say never interrupt a good circle jerk. You seem to be engaged in one right now, so enjoy if thats what gets you off...

 

[TWU informer]

Why bother? One of my 'alternative lifestyle' coworkers used to say never interrupt a good circle jerk. You seem to be engaged in one right now, so enjoy if thats what gets you off...

Nice "non-response"!!!

 

[Hopeful]

Why bother? One of my 'alternative lifestyle' coworkers used to say never interrupt a good circle jerk. You seem to be engaged in one right now, so enjoy if thats what gets you off...

Nothing compares to the circle jerk you do when defending executives.