Three Way Battle In Denver Heats Up
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Well, let's see. An acquantance just returned from Denver to Texas on UAL. He bought well in advance and he showed at the counter over an hour early. He got bumped off because the UAL CRJ was weight restricted. I asked him if he was the last to check in, he said "no", that UAL just arbitrarily chooses who gets bumped in those type of situations. BTW, he is a longtime corporate pilot, and I guarantee that this negative experience will influence his companies travel department when it comes to the occasional ticket they buy.
I'll also bet good money, that the next time he needs to return from CO, he'll buy a ticket on a CanyonBlue narrowbody and forgo the little RJ.
skybolt
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Kind of off-topic but you bring up a good point with weight-restricted RJs. With the over-abundance of the little birds out there, more and more pax are becoming accustomed to getting denied due to weight restrictions. Airlines are scheduling them to fly towards the end of their limits and one strong headwind or one band of t-storms ensures that a full flight will leave with empty seats. If the legacies don't figure this out, they will continue to lose out to the LCCs and non-RJ flying carriers.
mrfish3726
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- Jul 7, 2004
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http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_3384140
SWA is just filling in were ATA left off is all, so much for the code share! What happened to all the HUPLLLLLAAAAA?
ATA Airlines plans to fly its last flights out of Denver today. Southwest Airlines, which has had a marketing partnership with the carrier, will essentially replace ATA's service.
SWA is just filling in were ATA left off is all, so much for the code share! What happened to all the HUPLLLLLAAAAA?
ATA Airlines plans to fly its last flights out of Denver today. Southwest Airlines, which has had a marketing partnership with the carrier, will essentially replace ATA's service.
Cosmo
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- Aug 20, 2002
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Not quite. While ATA had four daily B737 round trips to MDW and two daily B757 round trips to PHX from DEN (until yesterday), by March Southwest will have a total of 20 daily B737 departures from DEN (6 x LAS, 5 x PHX, 4 x MDW, 4 x SLC and 1 x BWI). This is more than triple ATA's DEN frequencies and almost triple their seat capacity. This is hardly the status quo.
WNrforlife
Senior
- Apr 17, 2003
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Unless the Texas city he is returning to is Dallas. Unless the WA is lifted, he won't be able to fly from DEN.
Well, to add a bit more to what Cosmo said, not exactly. Not only will they be operating 20 daily departures just 60 days after starting service at DEN, they've also asked for another gate on Concourse C. That clearly indicates that Southwest is very pleased by their performance at DEN so far, and they intend to increase service further.
Southwest's highest DEN-SLC fare is 20% lower than F9's average DEN-SLC fare was a year ago. Heck, it's only $4 each way more than Frontier's LOWEST fare that doesn't come into effect when Southwest begins service.
How many more markets does WN have to enter from DEN before it matters?
DEN-ATL, DEN-MCI, DEN-STL, DEN-OMA, DEN-DCA, DEN-EWR, DEN-OKC, DEN-SEA, DEN-PDX, DEN-SNA, DEN-SAN, DEN-ABQ, DEN-MSP, DEN-DTW, DEN-CLT, DEN-LGA, DEN-YYZ, DEN-MEX, DEN-CUN......
Or add 80 flights. One way or the other it will only matter when W9 hurts another airline. The only time it will matter to those other people will be when WN has more seats to more destinations, (non-stop) than another carrier and becomes the second largest player in the market. Until that point it doesn't matter.
And speaking of 'cheap' fares, why is it now that WN is the only carrier between STL-MCI that the city pair is never on sale for $39? Years ago the city pair was always on the cheap list when TW was flying with 14 daily and WN with 12. Now only 4 flights. Hmmmm, low fares always? You are only free to move about the country until WN owns the market then the prices go up! First response is going to be market demand. Well this is the opposite of the WN effect. So don't tell me that the WN effect is always a good effect on a market. Same with Wal-Mart. You have the lowest prices until Wal-Mart closes all other stores, then Wal-Mart raises the fares to subsidize the other stores. Well, same goes for WN. Low fares to start, but once you get rid of the competition up go the fares and now no choice. Be real careful what you wish for, your wish may come true.
Speaking of wishes, I wish WN the best in Denver! I wonder if it will be a repeat of F9 and West-Pac? COS as I understand has plenty of gates open F9!
Or add 80 flights. One way or the other it will only matter when W9 hurts another airline. The only time it will matter to those other people will be when WN has more seats to more destinations, (non-stop) than another carrier and becomes the second largest player in the market. Until that point it doesn't matter.
And speaking of 'cheap' fares, why is it now that WN is the only carrier between STL-MCI that the city pair is never on sale for $39? Years ago the city pair was always on the cheap list when TW was flying with 14 daily and WN with 12. Now only 4 flights. Hmmmm, low fares always? You are only free to move about the country until WN owns the market then the prices go up! First response is going to be market demand. Well this is the opposite of the WN effect. So don't tell me that the WN effect is always a good effect on a market. Same with Wal-Mart. You have the lowest prices until Wal-Mart closes all other stores, then Wal-Mart raises the fares to subsidize the other stores. Well, same goes for WN. Low fares to start, but once you get rid of the competition up go the fares and now no choice. Be real careful what you wish for, your wish may come true.
Speaking of wishes, I wish WN the best in Denver! I wonder if it will be a repeat of F9 and West-Pac? COS as I understand has plenty of gates open F9!
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Nov 9, 2003
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Yup, $90 each way tomorrow, $54 each way 2 weeks from now, and $49 each way a month from now. That's really gouging the public.
Let's look at another monopoly route - this time by my employer US - GSO to CLT, about 90 miles apart.
$261 one way is still available tomorrow, two weeks from now, and a month from now.
How about round trip? You can double the WN fares, how about US?
$536.60 tomorrow, $432.60 two weeks from now with an overnite stay or a month from now with a Saturday night stay. Of course, these include taxes and fees.
Jim
coolflyingfool
Veteran
- Aug 20, 2002
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BoeingBoy - if there was a respected reader list, you would be on mine!! You point out facts and you never shy away from pointing the finger at your airline. You are an upstanding individual in my book!
Now as for the fares. Every airline is guilty of getting money where it can to offset the highly competitive routes, but I think that WN does a good job of not sticking you with a hot knife. Just my thoughts.........
Now as for the fares. Every airline is guilty of getting money where it can to offset the highly competitive routes, but I think that WN does a good job of not sticking you with a hot knife. Just my thoughts.........
KCFlyer
Veteran
- Aug 20, 2002
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Maybe because the fully refundable walkup fare is $79 (before taxes and fees). I remember the good old days when TWA used to the the only game on that route. $250 one way back then...
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- Thread starter
- #15
One might say that F9 definitely appears to be trying to align its cust. service with the WN model recently. Their marketing is also a knock-off of WN's...especially with the new TV show. However I think all of this is just a reaction to having WN in their one and only hub now...just trying to remain competitive. The airbus fleet and service levels don't mesh with WN and all that WN would get is routes. Seeing as F9's routes aren't anything that require rights or slots (for the most part) WN would gain nothing other than one less competitor with a merger. It would be alot to spend to get rid of F9. I think WN will just keep expanding DEN (within reason) with upcoming deliveries and stick with their own model. Does it look like F9 is getting dolled up for a dance with WN? Yes. Do I think WN will ask them to dance? No.
