Northwest Gets Slammed On Msnbc

It does not matter how far MWH or PDX are to AMS. The plane flew to SEA and *then* diverted.

I suspect the reason the plane diverted to MWH rather than PDX is because the pilot waited until the last second to make a decision, and prevailing winds meant that MWH was possible but not PDX.

They gambled on getting in and out of MWH before crew time expires (not much time left considering they lost an hour on departure), and they lost the bet. Next time don't cut it so close!
 
Ahhhhhh.........Making bad decisions and then not being held accountable for them..........FUTURELESS!
 
JS said:
It does not matter how far MWH or PDX are to AMS. The plane flew to SEA and *then* diverted.

I suspect the reason the plane diverted to MWH rather than PDX is because the pilot waited until the last second to make a decision, and prevailing winds meant that MWH was possible but not PDX.

They gambled on getting in and out of MWH before crew time expires (not much time left considering they lost an hour on departure), and they lost the bet. Next time don't cut it so close!
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Ahh I can hear it now if this played out a different way.
Plane circles SEA for a short time and then decides to divert early to where ever. Meanwhile the WX clears at SEA. Airplane gets delayed at the diversion airport for whatever reason and the crew runs out of duty time.
Then all the back seat critics would be saying:

" those dumb asses they could have orbited over SEA longer. But nooooo they had to divert early"!
 
mistified said:
Ahh I can hear it now if this played out a different way...
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Don't know if you've spent much time working in SEA in the winter, but the scenario you lay out isn't very likely. When it fogs in there, it stays fogged in until something happens to change the ambient temp at ground level. Something like a sunrise, for instance.

Even Alaska, with their CATIII fleet and their HGS-equipped 737s, was diverting SEA flights to PDX long before NWA decided to bring international service to Moses Lake. They actually have staff at MWH, but apparently realized that the infrastructure necessary to handle diversions - 24 hour fueling, local hotels, etc. - was lacking.

At NWA we are justly proud of our Meterology folks, but they can't do us any good if nobody in SOC listens to them. It's not as if SEA hasn't fogged in before, and NWA was quite able to decide to divert to PDX then. Significantly, nobody questioned their decisions then - and they didn't drag the NWA name through the mud in the process.
 
NWA/AMT said:
At NWA we are justly proud of our Meterology folks, but they can't do us any good if nobody in SOC listens to them. It's not as if SEA hasn't fogged in before, and NWA was quite able to decide to divert to PDX then. Significantly, nobody questioned their decisions then - and they didn't drag the NWA name through the mud in the process.
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So we are right back to where we started.
Why Moses Lake instead of PDX? The $64mil question.
I prefer to wait until all the facts are out.
SOC does not mandate where to divert. They can only make suggestions.
Bottom line is that the operation was done SAFELEY(sp). And after a how many hours of crew duty/ flight?
 
Certainly, depending on weather, weather projections, traffic congestion, remaining fuel, and location of circling, MWH could well have been a better choice than PDX.

Despite being a "podunk" airport, MWH has fabulous runway facilities, with the longest runway being over 13,500 feet long. It's used by Boeing for FAA certification and some testing.
 
mweiss said:
Certainly, depending on weather, weather projections, traffic congestion, remaining fuel, and location of circling, MWH could well have been a better choice than PDX.

Despite being a "podunk" airport, MWH has fabulous runway facilities, with the longest runway being over 13,500 feet long. It's used by Boeing for FAA certification and some testing.
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Good points.
It's also used by JAL for pilot training sorties.
 
Why is everyone so hung up on the length of the MWH runway? Did the plane have malfunctioning brakes?
 
mistified said:
I prefer to wait until all the facts are out.
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You'll be waiting a long time.

Who was held accountable for, and what were the 'facts' behind, the Detroit Debacle?
 
NWA/AMT said:
You'll be waiting a long time.

Who was held accountable for, and what were the 'facts' behind, the Detroit Debacle?
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I guess I see them as two different issues.
One you have poor handling before the airplne ever made it off the ground. The other was a diversion after a very long international flight where multiple weather /fuel variables had to be considered for the safe outcome of the flight. One was airborne one was not.
 
mistified said:
I guess I see them as two different issues.
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The press, and the public, don't. In fact, every report I have seen on the MWH situation referenced the DTW situation. Neither they, nor the NWA spokespersons, pointed out the differences in the two situations. Considering the commonality, the headline "Passengers Held Hostage", why would they?

Incidentally, flights into SEA were also being diverted to BFI and PAI that night, as well as PDX and GEG. Both BFI and PAI are much closer to SEA than MWH and all four of those stations have been used by NWA for weather diversions in the past.
 
JS said:
Why is everyone so hung up on the length of the MWH runway?
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I just mention it because of the "podunk" references. It's a good airport for most types of diversions.

I am surprised at the BFI diversions. I'd expect it to be exceptionally rare for SEA to be closed while BFI is open. They're only 3 1/2 miles apart.
 
mweiss said:
I am surprised at the BFI diversions. I'd expect it to be exceptionally rare for SEA to be closed while BFI is open. They're only 3 1/2 miles apart.
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Strange, but true...In fact, it's been my experience that when SEA is closed, BFI is (relatively) wide open. NW has diverted quite a few flights there in the past.
 
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