Iam Going Back To Court

[ktflyhome]

Yea, AOG-N-IT.

I lost my Seniority and around a $1000.00 pay, along with many other things. As we all know the list goes on and on. It made me sick to compare my last few years Tax Returns. And the cost of living sure isn't going down. Gas is as high as ever. I'm just glad I live in a town where drinking is cheap.

 

[cavalier]

But the idea presented by another poster of closing US down essentially "Because you could" disturbs me.

But, it doesn’t disturb you that this management team breaks our contracts daily. Makes life very difficult for us all via frivolous disciplinary policy. Makes using our healthcare benefits nothing less than a nightmare. Gives people grief when trying to use government backed FMLA. Hires a nurse to override your doctor’s excuse so they can punish you. Run the company into the ground so badly that the people left are nowhere near where they want to be, out of stations away from families, or if lucky enough to still be in station, on strange shifts with mid-week days off. You are called in for drug and alcohol tests and if you dare screw up there, you’re fired. Come to work one second late because there was an accident, you just received a written warning, two more you’re and fired. Forget your ID badge, better go home and get it, losing hours of work only to return to a written warning for being late. Basically they treat you as a liability, not an asset, they want you gone yesterday. Then you come on here, not even a U employee, and preach, telling me what is wrong in my thinking! Because I am being monitored, Bob, I can’t tell you how I REALLY feel, but just maybe you are getting the picture. I don’t care, understand I just don’t care what happens, but I will strike if asked to and feel good about it!

CAPISCE

 

[ktflyhome]

It's no fun on here if people aren't arguing.

 

[AOG-N-IT]

It's no fun on here if people aren't arguing.

Thier should be no arguement to it.

The IAM (whether Bob likes it or agrees with it or not?) Is the representation we have. The IAM is the dog in the fight..and fight is exactly what must take place.

We (The Membership) have to support the dog we have in this fight. We do not have the luxury of simply shifting our support to another union or becoming at will employee's at this point. A shift away from the IAM at this point would certainly play into the companies hand ...and an "at will workplace" would definately allow the company to run "Rough Shot and Amuck" beyond anything we have noted to date.

The issue is not the unions representing the employee's...the issue is U itself not being able to shift to the likes of an LCC overnight with everything except for labors compensation remaining status quo.

U cannot become WN or B6 by simply electing to not pay it's employee's what they themselves have agreed to.

U's costs due to fleet diversity , Hub and Spoke operations , seperate Res Centers , Maintenance bases , dependence on travel agencies and a million other reasons will not allow us to be what they are. U's problem is not making what we have work period. To out LCC an LCC with a Legacy structure , even if reduced further? , will no pass muster. Lowering the bar will only breed an enviroment that will make U ripe for the picking by another legacy carrier at somepoint in the future. They are not looking to fix it....they just want the rules and wages relaxed enough to make a takeover and quick individual profiteering by the RSA and the executive levels possible. They are not trying to save U as a stand alone business...and playing into their hands will make a TWA type scenario all the easier.

I would rather cease like Eastern with a fight...as opposed to crumbling , moving and ultimatley disappearing like those at TWA did. Only the very very lucky few survived the takeover merger with AA/TWA. Fight to fix U....do not capitulate for an even more un-certain outcome as many at TWA found in the end.

 

[PITbull]

AOG,

And you have stated it exactly correct. We all know what writing is on the walls and it shall come to pass. Nothing will change the inevitable.

Those who refute this probability are in denial.

 

[AOG-N-IT]

PB's

I'm of the firm belief that is U's problems were as simple as just lowering the employee's compensation alone? It would be done in some fashion or another...but the math and the reality of the situation does not support the overly-simplified solution being presented.

If the Dave's could pull this off that easily? My suggestion would be to send them to Haiti to resolve it's historical problems and un-rest in an alike fashion. 1.85 Billion dollars of US funds coupled to a military incursion into Haiti 10 years ago has not changed it's basic issues....and 1.8 Billion in concessions coupled to another 1.5 Billion being asked of the U employee's now , will not change our fortunes (misfortunes) either.

Until the core issues are taken to task..until the core probelms are aknowledged and resolved....NO amount of government funding or employee concessions is going to change what we are dealing with.

The end game for U and Haiti will be the same. The money will flow to those whom already get the lions share...and in the end , The Papa Docs ,the Baby Docs and the Daves of the worlds will walk away from the ruins of what they've created with their pockets full.

 

[High Iron]

AOG N IT:

They are not looking to fix it....they just want the rules and wages relaxed enough to make a takeover and quick individual profiteering by the RSA and the executive levels possible. They are not trying to save U as a stand alone business...and playing into their hands will make a TWA type scenario all the easier

Based on the rhetoric/action ratio of present management team so far, that is absolutely the most plausible conclusion. I think most have come to the same conclusions by now...it's so obvious. Ship is going down...everyone in the engine room keep the boilers stoked so everyone topside will have light and heat till the end.

 

[ojxux]

No union can call a strike outside of section 6. There is only 1 instance that they can, and that is if abrogation happens in BK. That means there is no contracts.

A violation of the current contract (which I suspect everyone agrees is occurring) would give the union the right to strike right? Sort of like the ALPA argued when their pension got canned. Even though the company had a contract with ALPA through 2007 the union contended it had the right to strike.

No worries though, I'm sure the current president would have no problem using his power under RLA and ending it before it could even begin. I think Bush used it in 2001 to stop a potential strike at northwest. :down:

 

[700UW]

When the honorable Robert Cindrich ruled it a major dispute, the IAM could have withdrawn its services at that time.

The IAM did not because it would have played into the company's hands and triggered a force majuere event.

So if the IAM did not withdraw its services at that time, where (pineybob) do you get the idea that the IAM will do that now?

The IAM has tried on numerous occasions to work with this management, and they turn a blind eye and deaf ears.

IMO, I believe Dave and his buddies want to tank this company and he is following Lorenzo's playbook to the T!

There are several ways for a strike to occur under the RLA:

During Section 6 negotiations is when the end of the 30 day cooling off period occurs, (this is the only case where the President can step in and create a Presidential Emergency Board (PEB) which last for 60 days, they hear testimony from both sides and come up with a contract reccomendation. The parties can reject it and go on strike, or Congress can legislate the contract (that happens on the railroads all the time.

You have a contract dispute where the Courts rule it a major dispute.

Finally abrogation in bankrupctcy court.

 

[700UW]

The IAM all ready does Bob, the court is not ruling on the contract language, they will rule on the major vs minor dispute.

So if it goes against the IAM it automatically goes to arbitration on the contract language itself.

 

[sentrido]

They(Management) will just keep asking till we don't give anymore.Wouldn't you?