Here's Proof, Owens Was Correct!
- Thread starter Nightwatch
- Start date
Mark Inman
Advanced
- Jun 22, 2004
- 194
- 0
Nightwatch I can't tell you that AMFA would be able to make AA spend the money where it should be. I can guarantee you they would at least try with what little scope language we have in our contract. Has one single person filed a grievance on what they did from the TWU yet. AA increased ASM on American Eagle by 46% in the last two years added chattaqua and trans state as regional while AA’s ASM’s are below or just back to even with 2001 levels. American than turned around and said give us concession or we are filing bankruptcy. Even I could make a case of extortion to a judge with that. This does not even include the 80 mil they put in the bank for their pensions and retention bonuses but that was a good diversion tactic. You now want me to believe TWU international had two finance companies look at there books and knew nothing about this? It does how ever explain why they refuse to act on it now. ATTACHMENT 1.5 – SEAT MILES SCHEDULED BY COMMUTER AIR CARRIERS Seat Miles Scheduled by Commuter Air Carriers
August 15, 1995
This will confirm our discussions leading to signing of the agreement dated August
1995, in which we discussed provisions for the future schedules of commuter air
carriers relative to American Airlines.
It is agreed that, beginning with twelve (12) month period following August 15, 1995,
and each twelve (12) month period thereafter, the total number of available seat miles
(ASM’s) which may be scheduled by all commuter air carriers owned by AMR or feeding
American may not exceed six (6) percent of the total ASM’s scheduled by American.
This limitation will not apply to ASM’s scheduled by such commuter air carriers on new
service on a route, which American has not served since March 1, 1993.
No aircraft type currently in the American Airlines fleet, or inactive aircraft type
previously in the American Airlines fleet and still under the Company’s control, and no
current orders or options for an American Airlines aircraft type will be transferred to or
operated by a commuter air carrier either owned by AMR or feeding American Airlines.
(Signed original on file)
August 15, 1995
This will confirm our discussions leading to signing of the agreement dated August
1995, in which we discussed provisions for the future schedules of commuter air
carriers relative to American Airlines.
It is agreed that, beginning with twelve (12) month period following August 15, 1995,
and each twelve (12) month period thereafter, the total number of available seat miles
(ASM’s) which may be scheduled by all commuter air carriers owned by AMR or feeding
American may not exceed six (6) percent of the total ASM’s scheduled by American.
This limitation will not apply to ASM’s scheduled by such commuter air carriers on new
service on a route, which American has not served since March 1, 1993.
No aircraft type currently in the American Airlines fleet, or inactive aircraft type
previously in the American Airlines fleet and still under the Company’s control, and no
current orders or options for an American Airlines aircraft type will be transferred to or
operated by a commuter air carrier either owned by AMR or feeding American Airlines.
(Signed original on file)
AMFA UNLIMITED OUTSOURCING
Northwest Invokes Right To Unlimited, Unrestricted
Subcontracting of Technician and Cleaner Work
Excerpt from the June 17, 2003 letter from Northwest Airlines to AMFA:
To the extent that any of these changes to our operations might place Northwest out of compliance with the subcontracting limits set forth in Article 2(F)3.a., please consider this letter the notice required by Article 2(F)3.c.1. In such case, the Company is invoking the exception language of Article 2(F)3.c. which provided that the subcontracting limits shall not apply in the event of non-compliance is caused by a circumstance over which the company has no control.
In addition, the Company is invoking the exception language of Article 22(A)4. (severance pay), Article11(A)2. (layoff notice), and article 11(E)6. and 11(F) (realignment notice) as a result of circumstances beyond the Company’s control.
Sincerely,
Robert A. Brodin
Sr. Vice President, Labor Relations
Just as we told you, AMFA’s “iron-clad†contract language has more holes than a block of Swiss Cheese. AMFA has allowed Northwest to farmout ALL Airframe, Engine and Component, Plant Maintenance, and Ground Operations Cleaner’s work.
Full text of Letter at: www.iam-amt.org
More;
Dave Works at NWA:
Name: Dave Buchanan
Employer: NWA
Location: Insp
Date: Tuesday, June 17, 2003
Time: 08:28 PM
Comments
Ok Wake-up and others. Many of you have heard me preach and predict. You know that I was right all along. Even some of the AMFA officers agree. After reading the article in the Pioneer Press today I think that there can be no doubt of the inability from these stooges. Remember after 9/11 and I tried to get the AMFA people involved in a variety of issues? Remember how they failed and even chastised me for suggesting they do? Well now they take shots at the credible people who did participate. If you don't know what I am talking about yet, get off your asses and find a copy of the St. Paul business section. Some AMFA officers are now saying that it is time to get a new union. They tell me that this organization cannot and will not take appropriate action. Although it is very late, there are some things that might be explored. If you boys and girls are serious about finding the proper representation you all know where to find me. Lets get us a real union now.
To read more visit the Discussion Board: http://www.amfanuts.com/bulletinboard.htm
Read Article:
Northwest Air Mechanics: New Layoffs Planned
Wednesday June 18, 11:19 am ET
MINNEAPOLIS (Dow Jones)--Northwest Airlines Corp. plans to eliminate a net of 150 positions due to SARS, according to the Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association.
Full Text: http://biz.yahoo.com/djus/030618/1119001051_2.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alaska Mechanics Not Protected Against Farm Outs
April 30, 2003
Well as a fine example of how well AMFA has done to represent the mechanics and related at Alaska Airlines once again we see that AMFA failed to negotiate Farm Out protection for their members at Alaska.
Under Article 2 Scope of Agreement Paragraph C states:
The Company agrees that all work normally performed by the employees covered by this Agreement in its Maintenance Shops, Airport Stations, or other facilities is recognized as coming within the jurisdiction of the Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association and is covered by this Agreement. The parties agree that the Company may (1) continue to contract out work heretofore customarily farmed out; (2) return equipment, parts, or assemblies to the manufacturers or to a manufacturer-approved repair station for repair or replacement; (3) purchase necessary parts, equipment or facilities including but not limited to the installation of fixed equipment and new facilities construction; (4) contract out any work when the Company's facilities, equipment or personnel are not sufficient or available or where employees covered by this Agreement do not have the experience and ability to satisfactorily perform the work required or warranty agreements exist; (5) contract out any work for which the Company's cost exceeds the vendors charges, less material; (6) reserve the right to contract out other work with the approval of the Union.
This was negotiated with the first AMFA contract at Alaska and was not amended with this last contract negotiations. Why is AMFA letting Alaska farm out what ever work they want and as much as they want?
The "Iron Clad" farm out protection that AMFA boastfully negotiated for the Northwest Mechanic backfired on AMFA with so much work being farmed out now that 4,500 mechanics and related have been laid off at Northwest while their Heavy Maintenance is done over seas and their engine work is being done at a 3rd party maintenance facility just to site a couple examples.
But when O.V. Delle Femine was asked about farm out protection and the lack of it in the Alaska, Atlantic Coast, and Mesaba contracts. Delle said that the Scope Clause protected them from farming out maintenance.
Well Delle you lied again. Since AMFA came to Alaska mechanics in Seattle where told approximately 1.5 to 2 years ago that Seattle was going to be a line maintenance base only and that they would have to relocate to Oakland where the heavy maintenance would be done.
Many mechanics relocated and some where even laid off because of this change. Now this might not seem so bad except for the fact that the 737 heavy maintenance that had been done in Seattle did not relocate with the mechanics. Instead Alaska is farming out all 737 heavy checks to B.F. Goodrich Aerospace (Tramco) in Everett, WA. This accounts for 70% of their fleet. Alaska has 71 737's (9 737-200C, 40 737-400, 16 737-700, and 6 737-900) and 31 MD80's.
70% of all the heavy maintenance at Alaska Airlines is being farmed out to a 3rd party non-union maintenance facility. While AMFA has not done anything to stop it! Where is their protection? How many other companies will be allowed to farm out their maintenance at the expense of the hard working mechanics at those airlines?
While hard working mechanics get laid off and their work is farmed out Delle does nothing. Instead of relaxing in the grand AMFA castle in the golden promise land in Loconia, NH maybe Delle should do something about protecting the work of those he represents.
Now was AMFA such a good idea? Maybe we should ask those guys who lost their jobs.
Northwest Invokes Right To Unlimited, Unrestricted
Subcontracting of Technician and Cleaner Work
Excerpt from the June 17, 2003 letter from Northwest Airlines to AMFA:
To the extent that any of these changes to our operations might place Northwest out of compliance with the subcontracting limits set forth in Article 2(F)3.a., please consider this letter the notice required by Article 2(F)3.c.1. In such case, the Company is invoking the exception language of Article 2(F)3.c. which provided that the subcontracting limits shall not apply in the event of non-compliance is caused by a circumstance over which the company has no control.
In addition, the Company is invoking the exception language of Article 22(A)4. (severance pay), Article11(A)2. (layoff notice), and article 11(E)6. and 11(F) (realignment notice) as a result of circumstances beyond the Company’s control.
Sincerely,
Robert A. Brodin
Sr. Vice President, Labor Relations
Just as we told you, AMFA’s “iron-clad†contract language has more holes than a block of Swiss Cheese. AMFA has allowed Northwest to farmout ALL Airframe, Engine and Component, Plant Maintenance, and Ground Operations Cleaner’s work.
Full text of Letter at: www.iam-amt.org
More;
Dave Works at NWA:
Name: Dave Buchanan
Employer: NWA
Location: Insp
Date: Tuesday, June 17, 2003
Time: 08:28 PM
Comments
Ok Wake-up and others. Many of you have heard me preach and predict. You know that I was right all along. Even some of the AMFA officers agree. After reading the article in the Pioneer Press today I think that there can be no doubt of the inability from these stooges. Remember after 9/11 and I tried to get the AMFA people involved in a variety of issues? Remember how they failed and even chastised me for suggesting they do? Well now they take shots at the credible people who did participate. If you don't know what I am talking about yet, get off your asses and find a copy of the St. Paul business section. Some AMFA officers are now saying that it is time to get a new union. They tell me that this organization cannot and will not take appropriate action. Although it is very late, there are some things that might be explored. If you boys and girls are serious about finding the proper representation you all know where to find me. Lets get us a real union now.
To read more visit the Discussion Board: http://www.amfanuts.com/bulletinboard.htm
Read Article:
Northwest Air Mechanics: New Layoffs Planned
Wednesday June 18, 11:19 am ET
MINNEAPOLIS (Dow Jones)--Northwest Airlines Corp. plans to eliminate a net of 150 positions due to SARS, according to the Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association.
Full Text: http://biz.yahoo.com/djus/030618/1119001051_2.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alaska Mechanics Not Protected Against Farm Outs
April 30, 2003
Well as a fine example of how well AMFA has done to represent the mechanics and related at Alaska Airlines once again we see that AMFA failed to negotiate Farm Out protection for their members at Alaska.
Under Article 2 Scope of Agreement Paragraph C states:
The Company agrees that all work normally performed by the employees covered by this Agreement in its Maintenance Shops, Airport Stations, or other facilities is recognized as coming within the jurisdiction of the Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association and is covered by this Agreement. The parties agree that the Company may (1) continue to contract out work heretofore customarily farmed out; (2) return equipment, parts, or assemblies to the manufacturers or to a manufacturer-approved repair station for repair or replacement; (3) purchase necessary parts, equipment or facilities including but not limited to the installation of fixed equipment and new facilities construction; (4) contract out any work when the Company's facilities, equipment or personnel are not sufficient or available or where employees covered by this Agreement do not have the experience and ability to satisfactorily perform the work required or warranty agreements exist; (5) contract out any work for which the Company's cost exceeds the vendors charges, less material; (6) reserve the right to contract out other work with the approval of the Union.
This was negotiated with the first AMFA contract at Alaska and was not amended with this last contract negotiations. Why is AMFA letting Alaska farm out what ever work they want and as much as they want?
The "Iron Clad" farm out protection that AMFA boastfully negotiated for the Northwest Mechanic backfired on AMFA with so much work being farmed out now that 4,500 mechanics and related have been laid off at Northwest while their Heavy Maintenance is done over seas and their engine work is being done at a 3rd party maintenance facility just to site a couple examples.
But when O.V. Delle Femine was asked about farm out protection and the lack of it in the Alaska, Atlantic Coast, and Mesaba contracts. Delle said that the Scope Clause protected them from farming out maintenance.
Well Delle you lied again. Since AMFA came to Alaska mechanics in Seattle where told approximately 1.5 to 2 years ago that Seattle was going to be a line maintenance base only and that they would have to relocate to Oakland where the heavy maintenance would be done.
Many mechanics relocated and some where even laid off because of this change. Now this might not seem so bad except for the fact that the 737 heavy maintenance that had been done in Seattle did not relocate with the mechanics. Instead Alaska is farming out all 737 heavy checks to B.F. Goodrich Aerospace (Tramco) in Everett, WA. This accounts for 70% of their fleet. Alaska has 71 737's (9 737-200C, 40 737-400, 16 737-700, and 6 737-900) and 31 MD80's.
70% of all the heavy maintenance at Alaska Airlines is being farmed out to a 3rd party non-union maintenance facility. While AMFA has not done anything to stop it! Where is their protection? How many other companies will be allowed to farm out their maintenance at the expense of the hard working mechanics at those airlines?
While hard working mechanics get laid off and their work is farmed out Delle does nothing. Instead of relaxing in the grand AMFA castle in the golden promise land in Loconia, NH maybe Delle should do something about protecting the work of those he represents.
Now was AMFA such a good idea? Maybe we should ask those guys who lost their jobs.
scab scraper
Member
- Mar 12, 2004
- 96
- 0
NICE WORK STRAKE!!!!!!!!!!!!! however the SCABS will not reply. TRUTH hurts..
it amazes me that you go away on vc for a couple weeks come back & these UNION BUSTERS have not changed one bit. still name calling de grading the "UNION" even sackman has added a new word to his.....vocabulary!!!! did i spell that right jerk?? i wonder where you got that word from ? (SCAB) let me guess. you were powa liftin & your bud says cum on SCAB give it all ya got.
felons? the best you can do? you are so lame scabman. being you are down thar in afw maybe you tell me how dan the jerk is doin'?
then we have dAAve over there makin a bunch of predictions, what a joke but, IF anyone would know it would be him. he is NEVER in his work area & he & his little band of SCABS are off meeting in a "secret" place to stir up some more LIES & rumors. well dAAve IF you think you can get as many cards signed as we had voting inthe past election...........it is STILL not enough. you didn't make it in the TWU & you will make it here. i was glad to see you FINALLY 'fesed up to trying to be TWU but FAILED!!!!!!!!!!!!! those are your words SCABmaster. YOU FAILED!!!!!!!
feels gooooooood to get it off your chest huh? go get your little cluster together & have a confessin time & look for some more TWU people to put down. you & sackman have to be brothers. all both of you do is put people down & try to ruin them like amfa(PUKE) has ruined so many others. O BTW O SCABmaster you have the BIGGEST RAT OF ALL among your ASSOcation ... BUCK!!!!!!!
that is where you get your "dirt" from...."you call me a SCAB i'll tell HR" it's on/on/on/ with you people
then we have the total jerk "rusty"..TWU pres. says.....bla/bla/bla. you gotta be there rusty...if you are gonna quote people you have to be there. come by the hall we'll let you in & then you will have it from the real source not some second hand info from the SCABmaster.....go to the bottom line on "nightwatch" post
that O SCABS says it all & rusty boy there is NO INTEGRITY in what amfa (PUKE) has done to THOUSANDS of lives in the United States. i want NO PART of your so called "integrity"
S=SELFISH
C=CONCEITED
A=ASININE
B=BIGOTS
TWU/AFL/CIO/ATD=UNION=SCABFREE
it amazes me that you go away on vc for a couple weeks come back & these UNION BUSTERS have not changed one bit. still name calling de grading the "UNION" even sackman has added a new word to his.....vocabulary!!!! did i spell that right jerk?? i wonder where you got that word from ? (SCAB) let me guess. you were powa liftin & your bud says cum on SCAB give it all ya got.
felons? the best you can do? you are so lame scabman. being you are down thar in afw maybe you tell me how dan the jerk is doin'?
then we have dAAve over there makin a bunch of predictions, what a joke but, IF anyone would know it would be him. he is NEVER in his work area & he & his little band of SCABS are off meeting in a "secret" place to stir up some more LIES & rumors. well dAAve IF you think you can get as many cards signed as we had voting inthe past election...........it is STILL not enough. you didn't make it in the TWU & you will make it here. i was glad to see you FINALLY 'fesed up to trying to be TWU but FAILED!!!!!!!!!!!!! those are your words SCABmaster. YOU FAILED!!!!!!!
feels gooooooood to get it off your chest huh? go get your little cluster together & have a confessin time & look for some more TWU people to put down. you & sackman have to be brothers. all both of you do is put people down & try to ruin them like amfa(PUKE) has ruined so many others. O BTW O SCABmaster you have the BIGGEST RAT OF ALL among your ASSOcation ... BUCK!!!!!!!
that is where you get your "dirt" from...."you call me a SCAB i'll tell HR" it's on/on/on/ with you people
then we have the total jerk "rusty"..TWU pres. says.....bla/bla/bla. you gotta be there rusty...if you are gonna quote people you have to be there. come by the hall we'll let you in & then you will have it from the real source not some second hand info from the SCABmaster.....go to the bottom line on "nightwatch" post
that O SCABS says it all & rusty boy there is NO INTEGRITY in what amfa (PUKE) has done to THOUSANDS of lives in the United States. i want NO PART of your so called "integrity"
S=SELFISH
C=CONCEITED
A=ASININE
B=BIGOTS
TWU/AFL/CIO/ATD=UNION=SCABFREE
Strake,Aug 20 2004, 06:42 AM]
AMFA UNLIMITED OUTSOURCING
Name: Dave Buchanan
Employer: NWA
Location: Insp
Date: Tuesday, June 17, 2003
Boy you guys had to dig for that one.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alaska Mechanics Not Protected Against Farm Outs
April 30, 2003
Well as a fine example of how well AMFA has done to represent the mechanics and related at Alaska Airlines once again we see that AMFA failed to negotiate Farm Out protection for their members at Alaska.
So in the six years that AMFA has been at Alaska they have failed to get what the TWU has failed to get over the last 50 years at AA.
Under Article 2 Scope of Agreement Paragraph C states:
This was negotiated with the first AMFA contract at Alaska and was not amended with this last contract negotiations. Why is AMFA letting Alaska farm out what ever work they want and as much as they want?
Funny, but it sounds like our scope clause with the exception of this line "with the approval of the Union".
I'll admit that its not great language but what we really need to do is compare the AMFAs scope at Alaska to the closest comparably sized airline that the TWU represents. Its not AA, maybe its the 15 year contract at Eagle. The fact is the smaller the airline the less efficient it is to do all the work in house. You left out the fact that AA spends more on outsourcing alone than Alaska's entire maintenance budget. (thats from the Washington post)
The "Iron Clad" farm out protection that AMFA boastfully negotiated for the Northwest Mechanic backfired on AMFA with so much work being farmed out now that 4,500 mechanics and related have been laid off at Northwest while their Heavy Maintenance is done over seas and their engine work is being done at a 3rd party maintenance facility just to site a couple examples.
I believe that AA spends more on outsourcing than NWA and the TWU has more members laid off than AMFA does. Both unions have seen members laid off but all the TWU members took at least a 25% cut in compensation. The TWU has lost nearly 4000 title I workers however if you count all the OSM positions as lost A&P jobs, then add all the lost A&P jobs due to the loss of R&D you will see that the TWU has eliminated more A&P jobs than any other union.
70% of all the heavy maintenance at Alaska Airlines is being farmed out to a 3rd party non-union maintenance facility. While AMFA has not done anything to stop it!
Where is their protection?
How many were laid off? Wasnt Alaska in fact hiring laid off UAL workers? Werent those that were laid off offered the option to transfer? I know a laid off mechanic from UAL who was recently hired on at Alaska. Your statements dont jive with the facts.
How many other companies will be allowed to farm out their maintenance at the expense of the hard working mechanics at those airlines?
Well since no other airline spends more on outsourcing than AA maybe you should ask the TWU.
While hard working mechanics get laid off and their work is farmed out Delle does nothing. Instead of relaxing in the grand AMFA castle in the golden promise land in Loconia, NH maybe Delle should do something about protecting the work of those he represents.
The grand AMFA castle? In one post you guys mock the man for living in his car now all of a sudden he has a castle? Is that your response to the known fact that the TWU decided to rent office space on Broadway?
Now was AMFA such a good idea? Maybe we should ask those guys who lost their jobs.
Maybe we should ask the ones who are still working too. Maybe we should ask the laid off TWU workers what they think of the TWU, in fact maybe we should ask the currently working members how they feel about the TWU though a membership vote? Are you up to that?
AMFA UNLIMITED OUTSOURCING
Name: Dave Buchanan
Employer: NWA
Location: Insp
Date: Tuesday, June 17, 2003
Boy you guys had to dig for that one.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alaska Mechanics Not Protected Against Farm Outs
April 30, 2003
Well as a fine example of how well AMFA has done to represent the mechanics and related at Alaska Airlines once again we see that AMFA failed to negotiate Farm Out protection for their members at Alaska.
So in the six years that AMFA has been at Alaska they have failed to get what the TWU has failed to get over the last 50 years at AA.
Under Article 2 Scope of Agreement Paragraph C states:
This was negotiated with the first AMFA contract at Alaska and was not amended with this last contract negotiations. Why is AMFA letting Alaska farm out what ever work they want and as much as they want?
Funny, but it sounds like our scope clause with the exception of this line "with the approval of the Union".
I'll admit that its not great language but what we really need to do is compare the AMFAs scope at Alaska to the closest comparably sized airline that the TWU represents. Its not AA, maybe its the 15 year contract at Eagle. The fact is the smaller the airline the less efficient it is to do all the work in house. You left out the fact that AA spends more on outsourcing alone than Alaska's entire maintenance budget. (thats from the Washington post)
The "Iron Clad" farm out protection that AMFA boastfully negotiated for the Northwest Mechanic backfired on AMFA with so much work being farmed out now that 4,500 mechanics and related have been laid off at Northwest while their Heavy Maintenance is done over seas and their engine work is being done at a 3rd party maintenance facility just to site a couple examples.
I believe that AA spends more on outsourcing than NWA and the TWU has more members laid off than AMFA does. Both unions have seen members laid off but all the TWU members took at least a 25% cut in compensation. The TWU has lost nearly 4000 title I workers however if you count all the OSM positions as lost A&P jobs, then add all the lost A&P jobs due to the loss of R&D you will see that the TWU has eliminated more A&P jobs than any other union.
70% of all the heavy maintenance at Alaska Airlines is being farmed out to a 3rd party non-union maintenance facility. While AMFA has not done anything to stop it!
Where is their protection?
How many were laid off? Wasnt Alaska in fact hiring laid off UAL workers? Werent those that were laid off offered the option to transfer? I know a laid off mechanic from UAL who was recently hired on at Alaska. Your statements dont jive with the facts.
How many other companies will be allowed to farm out their maintenance at the expense of the hard working mechanics at those airlines?
Well since no other airline spends more on outsourcing than AA maybe you should ask the TWU.
While hard working mechanics get laid off and their work is farmed out Delle does nothing. Instead of relaxing in the grand AMFA castle in the golden promise land in Loconia, NH maybe Delle should do something about protecting the work of those he represents.
The grand AMFA castle? In one post you guys mock the man for living in his car now all of a sudden he has a castle? Is that your response to the known fact that the TWU decided to rent office space on Broadway?
Now was AMFA such a good idea? Maybe we should ask those guys who lost their jobs.
Maybe we should ask the ones who are still working too. Maybe we should ask the laid off TWU workers what they think of the TWU, in fact maybe we should ask the currently working members how they feel about the TWU though a membership vote? Are you up to that?
