Handgun handed off at airport, gets on US plane

[N965VJ]

<SNIP> This person will never, ever work in a security sensitive position for the rest of their life if they are convicted of conveying a weapon into a sterile airport environment. This is a severe violation of the public trust.

Alvin Crabtree, a TSA screener in DEN that brought a gun to work still has his job. It will be interesting to see if different standards are applied here.

 

[nycbusdriver]

He works in Philly....he knows better than to check a bag there.

There may be several reasons that this passenger didn't want to send the gun in a checked bag, which can legally be done.

Goodstew's implication is probably the best reason. Firearms in checked baggage get stolen. The airline says not to place anything exceptionally valuable in checked luggage, then they tell you you have to put any unloaded firearm in checked luggage. DUH! Once you declare the firearm at the ticket counter, word gets out that this bag has goodies in it.

Another possible reason is simply for convenience. Maybe the passenger didn't intend to check any luggage (and pay the extra fees) and didn't want to hassle with a stop at the ticket counter. So the employee simply offered to help save his friend time and money. It could actually have been that innocent. If the gun was unloaded, and no ammunition was found, then what damage could the passenger have done? If he had a permit for the gun (ostensibly to have it in Philadelphia,) then he likely went through a background check to get the permit. My guess is that his record was spotless to get the permit, and that this was simply a stupid error in an attempt at convenience.

 

[jimntx]

Apples and Oranges, the union represents the employee and the contract is with the employer, not the Federal government, try again.

And by the way the IAM has represented mechanics against the FAA, just as ALPA and other unions, when action is taken against a license held by the pilot or mechanic the unions step in and represent them against the FAA.

I suppose the union could represent the employee in this case, but there is no DFR if they don't. DFR applies only when the employee is charged with a contract violation, or the company is attempting to circumvent a contractual obligation with the employee.

This employee allegedly violated Federal law. Unlike with a mechanic where the "violation" may have been in the performance of his/her duties and the union decided to represent the employee not only for his/her protection, but also for the good of all other mechanics, I doubt seriously there is anything in the gate agents contract addressing sneaking contraband through security. It's like when rampers, such as happened at AA and WN, colluded in sneaking drugs into the country from Central/South America.

I doubt the union is going to want to involve themselves in this issue or appear to be protecting the employee from his own stupidity. Weapons may not be carried aboard U.S. airlines except by armed LEOs, and except for FAMs, even they have to notify the airline that they are carrying and forms have to be provided to the working crew. The law doesn't make allowances for unarmed weapons or people who have "had appropriate background checks." Weapons may not be carried aboard. End of discussion with the Feds.

Addition: Have any of you who are trying to justify what this employee did considered what effect this stupid act may have on the rest of us? The airlines finally convinced the TSA that employees could be trusted to go through less strenuous screening than passengers at the security checkpoint. In fact, at some airports we now have the advantage of "Employee Only" portals. Violations such as this could mess it up for all of us and we will have to go back to the same screening as passengers.

 

[LD3]

Apples and Oranges, the union represents the employee and the contract is with the employer, not the Federal government, try again.

That's the point of my post, you throw the union in right from the get-go, this has nothing to do with the company. If the DHS decides to prosecute and he is found guilty of a felony no union in the world would get him his sida badge back...I am sure your right about the union representing a mechanic or pilot vs the FAA, but this is about a non job related issue, a stupid move to bypass security...

 

[robbedagain]

NBC10 WACU also said that upon further search they found another pax had a box cutter talk about the failure of TSA

 

[Jester]

Firearms in checked baggage get stolen. The airline says not to place anything exceptionally valuable in checked luggage, then they tell you you have to put any unloaded firearm in checked luggage. DUH! Once you declare the firearm at the ticket counter, word gets out that this bag has goodies in it.

Another possible reason is simply for convenience. Maybe the passenger didn't intend to check any luggage (and pay the extra fees) and didn't want to hassle with a stop at the ticket counter. So the employee simply offered to help save his friend time and money.

So disassemble the firearm with a simple field stripping, degrease and wrap the pieces, package them into a box and ship it insured through the USPS... anyone ask any questions, it is "machine parts". I did it myself when I had to return a defective firearm to the company in Miami, but I used UPS at that time.

It was just plain stupid to attempt to get anything on board an aircraft without it being screened, especially something which would be assumed to be a loaded gun. When a kid's squirt gun is being seized by the TSA, attempting smuggle an actual gun on-board is beyond the pale of stupidity and an airline employee should especially know this... someone should be out of a job, and if lucky, this duo might get probation.

So Advices Jester.

 

[N965VJ]

<SNIP> Addition: Have any of you who are trying to justify what this employee did considered what effect this stupid act may have on the rest of us?

In the past I used to defend employees not having to go through the checkpoint, but if these two are convicted that pretty much takes the wind out of my sails. Enjoy having the hotel shuttle dropping you off at the bottom of the jetway in LAS while it lasts.

NBC10 WACU also said that upon further search they found another pax had a box cutter talk about the failure of TSA

A keyword search for the term “box cutterâ€￾ at that news outlet’s website turns up nothing as it relates to this story.

 

[hp_fa]

If the gun was unloaded, and no ammunition was found, then what damage could the passenger have done?

Conceivably the unloaded gun could have been brandished and most folks seeing a gun, albeit unloaded, in their face are not going to wonder if the gun is loaded or react accordingly.

 

[wopr21]

Conceivably the unloaded gun could have been brandished and most folks seeing a gun, albeit unloaded, in their face are not going to wonder if the gun is loaded or react accordingly.

And another person could have the ammo

 

[hp_fa]

True, if it also got past TSA.

 

[nycbusdriver]

...react accordingly.

And that would be?

 

[phlagent]

I found out that when the A/C arrived in PHX, the airport had bomb sneefing dogs around the
belt, the dog sneffed out 7 big rubber containers in the employee's name, in the containers
were guns and drugs, this came from an US employee in PHX.

I know everyone blames US for lost or stolen Items from the suitcases. But in the local paper
in the PHILA/NEW JERSEY are a TSA empolyee was cought stealing laptops and gaming boxes
from passenger bags when they would hand search them. It seems the gov doesn't not
know how to hire people also

 

[FA Mikey]

If the gun was unloaded, and no ammunition was found, then what damage could the passenger have done?

If there was a threat to do harm, plenty.

If he had a permit for the gun (ostensibly to have it in Philadelphia,) then he likely went through a background check to get the permit. My guess is that his record was spotless to get the permit, and that this was simply a stupid error in an attempt at convenience.

That stupid error will likely lose him his LTCF.

 

[signals]

I think all the pax has to do is fill out a gun tag(?) and get a lock-box from the airlines, and he's legal if he has a permit and the gun is registered. I'm guessing that ammunition must not be in any proximity to the gun.

We've had a couple of gun incidents involving pax and employees and stupid decisions. Now here's a bit of advice, don't ask TSA, because they seem as clueless as the inquisitor! This was my own observation, though.

I'm guessing this guy was a rookie. A bit of advice that I read on the web is that if the gun owner wants to inquire about his firearm, he must never start the sentence with "I have a gun...!"

 

[ussnark]

I think all the pax has to do is fill out a gun tag(?) and get a lock-box from the airlines, and he's legal if he has a permit and the gun is registered. I'm guessing that ammunition must not be in any proximity to the gun.

We've had a couple of gun incidents involving pax and employees and stupid decisions. Now here's a bit of advice, don't ask TSA, because they seem as clueless as the inquisitor! This was my own observation, though.

I'm guessing this guy was a rookie. A bit of advice that I read on the web is that if the gun owner wants to inquire about his firearm, he must never start the sentence with "I have a gun...!"

Indeed.

We still have way too many folks here that are more than willing to set their hair on fire, then try to get others to light theirs, also. In a universe where it seems anything is possible, even to replacing reality with their own , starting a sentence off with the word "conceivably" seems to be used to allow most any kind of speculation, as if. I would suggest that a person brandishing a gun would likely want to establish his cred by discharging at least one round, else risk being taken down by someone vying for a Darwin Award.