Flt 660 diverts DEN

[Ch. 12]

Of course you can have it both ways as not every airport and every approach is the same. Again I forget you have a narrow view of how flying is accomplished. At airport like BUR and ICT, OKC, MCI and various other fields you do not often have the traffic flow you have at say LAS or LAX. I hate to go into pilot 101 but it seems you are going to want to the long version. At a field like LAS or LAX the ATC folks are more in control of an arrival than say ICT. The controllers assign speeds and expect the pilots to comply strictly with these speeds for proper traffic flow. The speed assignment generally is in place until about 5 miles from the end of the runway. If you slow down before the 5mile point it causes the planes behind you to be too close and the controller will send that trailing airplane around the pattern. This is an old SWA trick when flying a UAL airplane is trailing. They can still be cowboys on occasion BUR is a good example of no speed restriction being in place an apparently no trailing UAL aircraft. I suppose if they had only had a UAL flight behind them in BUR it might have saved the airplane, fence and service station.

Wow...talk about your paranoid conspiracy theory. I couldn't lurk any longer w/o replying.

Seeing as WN has very short turns, it seems kind of inefficient to slow down their own ops causing mis-cnx and delays just to slow down a UAL bird. I've gotta say that WN operates much more intelligently than that. I tend to think that since you are looking at severely congested airports, traffic may have something to do with slow downs that you see. But you do spin a mighty dramatic tale.

 

[Fly]

Well it's obvious you don't work at the airlines Ch 12 or you would know that this is a well known occurence when it comes to WN. Actually, I believe they do this to many legacies, not just UAL.

Now you know too.

 

[Ch. 12]

Well it's obvious you don't work at the airlines Ch 12 or you would know that this is a well known occurence when it comes to WN. Actually, I believe they do this to many legacies, not just UAL.

Now you know too.

Guess I do work in the industry b/c I've also heard (this one I have actually witnessed often) of AA's slugs in DFW and DL has been accused of doing the same to FL in ATL. I've also heard that there are rumors that there never was a moon landing. That doesn't make any of it true now, does it?

All of this makes a good story but with WN it is especially humorous b/c unlike the other examples I gave, WN is also accused of moving too quickly...or are you not in the industry to know? WN is accused of taxiing too fast and getting direct routing when they supposedly shouldn't. It seems like a pretty contradictory stance to say that WN is speeding up and slowing down ops at the same time.

So...in times of conspiracy theories, you must look at the facts. The fact that WN has VERY TIGHT turns (c'mon, Fly...if you are so knowledgeable about the industry, how did you miss WN101?) and are very efficient at their operations. So to me...it just doesn't add up that WN is always trying to slow down everybody else by slowing themselves down. And another fact...at the cities mentioned, WN would be slowing down their other incoming flights as well if they employed such tactics as have been accused b/c these are major cities for them. I just ask that people use a little logic when delving into conspiracies.

 

[Fly]

Oh, and cutting others off too.

 

[Tanker]

Ever hear of MULE? You WN buddies could fill you in but it has to do with them flying slow in front of UAL airplanes on final, dallying on the runway to force UAL go-arounds and various other tactics they used to attempt to harm and disrupt the UAL flying.

Thanks for telling me about the MULE program. I've been flying at SWA for 11 years (6 as Capt) and never heard of it. I guess it is time for me to join the program.
As for the best winds routes our dispatchers put on the release if it was considered. If it saves fuel they annotate the relaese by a remark that tells us to use it and not to ask for direct. If it doesn't save fuel they tell us that the best wind routee was considered and there were no savings.

 

[KCFlyer]

Ever hear of MULE?.... Make United Late Everytime.

It dawned on me that I HAVE heard that...but it was the UAL pilots mantra from the "summer from hell".

 

[magsau]

It dawned on me that I HAVE heard that...but it was the UAL pilots mantra from the "summer from hell".

KC,

You probably don't realize the AA pilots were fined for a slowdown after the UAL summer of love now do you? Of course not you are so misguided that you probably could not find the information if you needed to.

Oh well, the midwest mind strikes again.

 

[KCFlyer]

KC,

You probably don't realize the AA pilots were fined for a slowdown after the UAL summer of love now do you? Of course not you are so misguided that you probably could not find the information if you needed to.

Oh well, the midwest mind strikes again.

I wasn't talking about AA, was I now? UAL pilots did their best to "Make United Late Everytime", didn't they now? Why can't you admit that? Oh yeah...because your a skygod.

 

[OPNLguy]

Magasu knows SWA pilots have no idea of winds aloft and no contact with their dispatch resources. That's why UAL is kicking SWA's butt.

As one of those dispatch "resources" the statement is bovine fecal material--we converse all the time via both VHF voice and ACARS.

Now, all that said, we have our own 2% group like every other airline on the planet has their own 2% group. We deal with it, as does everyone else at their airline...

As for the best winds routes our dispatchers put on the release if it was considered. If it saves fuel they annotate the relaese by a remark that tells us to use it and not to ask for direct. If it doesn't save fuel they tell us that the best wind routee was considered and there were no savings.

Thank you.

 

[markkus757]

I do know that the regional partners for United are card-carrying members of MULE.....

Southwest has increased some turnaround times due to some of the airports they now serve as well as that behemoth of innefficiency called the TSA.