Fares!

[AtlanticBeach]

Running an airline profitably is incredibly difficult. There are some very bright people who have tried and failed. On top of that we have a dramatic change in the marketplace with segmenting of competition (including other airlines, different modes of transportation and business techniques that do not require travel) and customer habits/ cost pressures that were not present in previous economic cycles.

Consistently, what has been the most financially successful method of running an airline? SIMPLIFY!

US has begun doing that with fleet rationalization, but still can't figure out that one crew should stay with one plane for 8 to 9 hours,then turn the plane over to another crew for 8 or 9 hours.

Fare rationalization and making the purchaser's initial contact with Reservations a pleasant experience has escaped US and most of the other majors. Look past Southwest to LL Bean and even Neiman-Marcus. They understand customer service.

The fact that US employees are as good as they are almost makes up for the constraints under which they have to work.

 

[W:EXCH:INVOL]

KC said....What is so difficult about lowering the unrestricted fares and limiting the number of fare buckets? As I said, if the other airlines don't match you, just thank them and welcome the business that your fare structure brings in. Why do airlines insist on appearing as a "low fare leader" by beating the "low fare leaders" on advance purchase tickets, only to fly empty seats that they were hoping to fill with passengers who paid thru the nose for their tickets? A simplified fare structure (and the elimination of the nickle and dime penalties) could do wonders for your bottom line. But managment won't even consider that step until "costs are under control". Do they not realize that costs and revenues work hand in hand? Losing business because your revenue mangement model is stuck in the 90's only means you've got to cut costs even deeper. Tweaking the revenue model together with addressing the cost side might just start stemming the losses.
Apparently most airline managment is incapable of focusing on more than one issue at a time.


Possible answer? Would it behoove management to put off any chance at reaping profits from a simplified fare structure until every last drop is squeezed from labor, lessors, etc. Gotta think it would be next to impossible for CCY to convince us to give up more if (Heaven forbid!) we showed a profit.

INVOL

 

[chelebell]

Don't mean to beat a dead horse - but again,
I hear it everyday if not every other day - the customers
are telling us "I will NEVER fly your airline again". In
all the years with this organization, I have never heard it this bad. It is about the fares and the over-restricted fare rules. I understand the reasoning behind the new policy on use it, change it or loss it, but when you compare a 60.00 NFL football game ticket to a 400.00 non-refundable fare - there is a HUGE difference. I do not want to see us waiving the change fees for any sitation, but let the passengers keep the value of the ticket for future use. Not everyone is able to reschedule on/before date of travel. Lets be reasonable and not so heartless.
Someone once said "the customers change airlines everytime they get mad at one, they change to another and back again". That may be true, but I do not hear of many coming to back to us, and I do not see it in our bottom line. The current round of sales won't bring the numbers up that we need, it will only bring up the load factors, when what we need is revenue.

 

[FrugalFlyer]

[blockquote]
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On 1/24/2003 4:56:28 PM usfliboi wrote:
Art, I think you are mis informed. From a customers perspective you may indeed percieve certain things that truly just arent there. Usairways as well as others have attempted NUMEROUS times to change the way fares are structured. Unless all goes along with those changes they fail! All you have to do is read the headlines 3 days after a fare sale comes along ! If others dont follow it doesnt go forward.
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[/blockquote]

So the airlines are lemmings.

I've said this before: US is in chpt.11 - this is a perfect time to experiment with a new/simplified fare structure since the old/traditional method of setting fares does not seem to be bringing in the revenues needed. If the experiment works then great. And if it doesn't there isn't much more to lose given USAirways' current situtation.

[blockquote]
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Why does Hp and Wn do this and do it well? SIMPLE! In most markets they have very little battle with others.
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[/blockquote]

Well, USAirways is pretty much limited to east coast region (limited market?), then by your reasoning, a new/simplified fare structure should work.

 

[Dea Certe]

Art,

Thank you once again for your kind words for the US Airways front line employees. I hope you know how much it is appreciated by us. I am looking forward to the day I have the pleasure to serve you, praying management doesn't drive you and the rest of our most valued customers away with the insane decisions made by some person in a cubicle far removed from the reality of the business traveler.

Thanks for staying with us.

Dea

 

[crusher]

The problem with fares is the entire structure. No one At CCY ever listens to the people who actually work at the airports.As a CSS who regularly works the shuttle, we could simplify everything with 5 fares. Simpler is better. Our marketing dept is a bunch of just out of college kids with no practical experience in this industry or any other and they think their book knowledge will suffice. Listen to those who do the work they are the real professionals.

 

[W:EXCH:INVOL]

Exactly. Just don't see it happening, though.

INVOL

 

[TomBascom]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 1/28/2003 1214 PM crusher wrote:

The problem with fares is the entire structure. No one At CCY ever listens to the people who actually work at the airports.As a CSS who regularly works the shuttle, we could simplify everything with 5 fares. Simpler is better. Our marketing dept is a bunch of just out of college kids with no practical experience in this industry or any other and they think their book knowledge will suffice. Listen to those who do the work they are the real professionals.
----------------
[/blockquote]

Your marketing people don't even have the most elementary "book knowledge" available to anyone who has taken so much as a survey course in marketing. You'd be a lot better off is you did have fresh out of school kids or even interns running the marketing dept. B. Ben Baldanza and his wrecking crew are utterly unqualified to be in their positions and obviously lack the slightest grasp of the subject matter.

 

[Art at ISP]

In line with this discussion on how stupid the fare system is, I just booked a trip last night--ISP-MCO-CLT-ISP. In order to save $160 in air fare, the final leg will go from CLT-RDU-PHL-ISP!

It's a good thing I like flying

I should make this my new signature--It's the fares, stupid!

 

[usfliboi]

Art ! Maybe we should bring back the incentives for individual segments to encourage out ff to route them selves this way ... Hey thats idea ill pass it own

 

[KCFlyer]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 1/28/2003 335 PM Art at ISP wrote:

In line with this discussion on how stupid the fare system is, I just booked a trip last night--ISP-MCO-CLT-ISP. In order to save $160 in air fare, the final leg will go from CLT-RDU-PHL-ISP!

It's a good thing I like flying

I should make this my new signature--It's the fares, stupid!



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[/blockquote]

Art, you're one dedicated customer. But Southwest offers 3 nonstop flights from MCO to ISP. And their fully refundable one way fare was $169. When I tried routing MCO-CLT-RDU-PHL-ISP on the USAirways website, the shortest time I could find was almost 11 hours. IMHO, that's a lot to "pay" just to be assured of an assigned seat.

 

[CLTBWIDAYSYR]

KC,

Believe it or not, we DO have loyal customers like Art. Now, we are all WELL aware how you love LUV, but do you really think it's beyond the realm of possibility that we might have folks who think we do a pretty da mn good job too?

Happy to have you aboard, Art.

 

[nvrsaynvr]

Perhaps it's the company's current agenda for taking from the employee that prohibits a lowering of our highest fares. If a $1200 ticket (full fare) were reduced to $600 then an employee could purchase a companion pass for 50% less. (That might actually be cheaper than some of the 21 day advance tickets). I have had friends purchase positive seat tickets for less than I could provide them passes for. Sort of takes the value out of "passes".

Okay, it probably is ridiculous to make this implication about the company's agenda. Therefore, so this post is not a total waste of space and time, I say thanks to the customers of US Airways who have taken their time to post here and have offered suggestions to CCY on how to make our business more attractive, and probably more successful. If Dave's team can and do read these comments from all so close to the action, the flyer, the agent who sells the fare, and the agent who must at times face the flyer when adjusting the fare (upwards), maybe the clouds will part and allow new thinking to penetrate their seemingly closed minds. It seems simple enough to me that, if what you are doing (and for sooooooooo long) is not working, then change what you are doing.

I would truly love to see more changes to our business model that appear geared toward generating revenue, rather than cutting cost. This cost cutting has very real limits, I think there are no limits to increasing revenue. That is except, perhaps, the limitations of those to whom this task falls.

 

[nvrsaynvr]

Perhaps it's the company's current agenda for taking from the employee that prohibits a lowering of our highest fares. If a $1200 ticket (full fare) were reduced to $600 then an employee could purchase a companion pass for 50% less. (That might actually be cheaper than some of the 21 day advance tickets). I have had friends purchase positive seat tickets for less than I could provide them passes for. Sort of takes the value out of "passes".

Okay, it probably is ridiculous to make this implication about the company's agenda. Therefore, so this post is not a total waste of space and time, I say thanks to the customers of US Airways who have taken their time to post here and have offered suggestions to CCY on how to make our business more attractive, and probably more successful. If Dave's team can and do read these comments from all so close to the action, the flyer, the agent who sells the fare, and the agent who must at times face the flyer when adjusting the fare (upwards), maybe the clouds will part and allow new thinking to penetrate their seemingly closed minds. It seems simple enough to me that, if what you are doing (and for sooooooooo long) is not working, then change what you are doing.

I would truly love to see changes to our business model that appear geared toward generating revenue, rather than cutting cost. This cost cutting has very real limits, I think there are no limits to increasing revenue. That is except, perhaps, the limitations of those to whom this task falls.

 

[Art at ISP]

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[/blockquote]

Art, you're one dedicated customer. But Southwest offers 3 nonstop flights from MCO to ISP. And their fully refundable one way fare was $169. When I tried routing MCO-CLT-RDU-PHL-ISP on the USAirways website, the shortest time I could find was almost 11 hours. IMHO, that's a lot to "pay" just to be assured of an assigned seat.
----------------
[/blockquote]

KCFlyer,

First of all, I have business in CLT right after leaving MCO. Second of all, if given a choice between WN and driving, I'll drive. WN fits a niche but that niche is not for me. I don't do cattle class-period. I fly too much to not be able to choose my own seat. I respect that YOU prefer WN. I don't.

The people at US Airways are beyond doubt the best this industry has to offer. They have always done right by me, and they are the reason I remain fiercely loyal-to them. I feel terrible about what management has tried to do to them. My point was only regarding CLT-RDU-PHL-ISP and the fact that the fare was $160 less than CLT-PHL-ISP, although they will incur higher costs to get me there.

Good luck to you, KC and enjoy WN. To my good friends at US, thanks and keep it up!