ETOPS cert on 737-800s

[SpongeBob]

it should be a hydrulic driven generator, as a back-up source, the 757-200ER,757-300ER and 767-200ER,767-300ER, have hydrulic driven generator to be ETOPS certified, And the 767-400ER,777-200,777-200IGW,777-200LR,777-300ER have BUGs(Back Up Generator) to be ETOPS certified, 180 mins single engine, those CFM56-7B use engine oil, not like it older brother CFM56-5 series, which sips the engine oil.

I'll be the first to admit that I am not well versed with the requirements of ETOPS certification. That said, when the 737-800 was delivered I do recall that Alaska commented the aircraft would come ETOPS capable from the factory. What that means specifically, I do not know.

I was under the belief that the ETOPS certification for Alaska's 738's was more a matter of developing crew certification and training programs and getting those approved by the FAA.

Does anybody know how Aloha Airlines is handling these requirements?

Regarding serving PHL, I haven't heard it whispered through the rumor mill at all. The current speculation revolves around ATL and now HNL/OGG.

-Spone

 

[star power]

I'll be the first to admit that I am not well versed with the requirements of ETOPS certification. That said, when the 737-800 was delivered I do recall that Alaska commented the aircraft would come ETOPS capable from the factory. What that means specifically, I do not know.

I was under the belief that the ETOPS certification for Alaska's 738's was more a matter of developing crew certification and training programs and getting those approved by the FAA.

Does anybody know how Aloha Airlines is handling these requirements?

Regarding serving PHL, I haven't heard it whispered through the rumor mill at all. The current speculation revolves around ATL and now HNL/OGG.
For ETOPS check out FAA advisory circular AC120-42A.
-Spone

 

[Some Clown]

I'll be the first to admit that I am not well versed with the requirements of ETOPS certification. That said, when the 737-800 was delivered I do recall that Alaska commented the aircraft would come ETOPS capable from the factory. What that means specifically, I do not know.

I was under the belief that the ETOPS certification for Alaska's 738's was more a matter of developing crew certification and training programs and getting those approved by the FAA.

Does anybody know how Aloha Airlines is handling these requirements?

Regarding serving PHL, I haven't heard it whispered through the rumor mill at all. The current speculation revolves around ATL and now HNL/OGG.

-Spone

Dual main aircraft batterys installed would be my first clue that they were ETOPS ready. At least thats what we had at my last airline who's -800's were supposed to be 120 min ETOPS out of the box. (specific Air Carrier certification required as well)

*edit Not sure they were 120 min because the airline didn't have the certification or even begin seeking it before I pulled the "eject handle" and headed for WN.*


If you work in MX, pop open the center panel in the FWD wall of the FWD pit and see for yourself.

 

[star power]

Dual main aircraft batterys installed would be my first clue that they were ETOPS ready. At least thats what we had at my last airline who's -800's were supposed to be 120 min ETOPS out of the box. (specific Air Carrier certification required as well)

*edit Not sure they were 120 min because the airline didn't have the certification or even begin seeking it before I pulled the "eject handle" and headed for WN.*
If you work in MX, pop open the center panel in the FWD wall of the FWD pit and see for yourself.

The two battries is for the required MAIN/STBY DC power requirements, when all electrical power goes out. ETOPS for 75 min, out of the box, yes. AC 120-42A states,"(8) Three or more reliable, independent alternating current (AC) electrical power sources should be available. As a minimum, each electrical source should be capable of powering the items specified in Paragraphs 8.c.(4) and 8.c.(7). If one or more of the required electrical power sources are provided by an APU, hydraulic system, or ram air turbine, the following criteria apply as appropriate:
(i) The APU when installed, should meet the criteria in Paragraph 8.b.(4).
(ii) The hydraulic power source should be reliable. To achieve this reliability, it may be necessary to provide two or more independent energy sources (e.g.,bleed air from two or morepneumatic sources)".( the 737-800 has no HDG or BUG).
"(iii) Ram Air Turbine (RAT)" (the 737-800 does not have).

If the APU is use for backup power (air and/or electrical) the APU will be place under the same program as the engines, IFSD,ETMA,PRSRB,Oil consumption monitoring. this for 120min ETOPS (IFSD - 250,000 engine hours(significant portion with experience candidate airplane, achieve an IFSD of approximately .05/1000 (the objective is continuing improment towards a rate of .02/1000 hours)), For 180min ETOPS (same as 120 min plus at least additional one year with the approved extended range configured fleet. achieve and maintain an IFSD of approximately .02/1000 hours.
Good Luck.

 

[Some Clown]

The two battries is for the required MAIN/STBY DC power requirements, when all electrical power goes out. ETOPS for 75 min, out of the box, yes. AC 120-42A states,"(8) Three or more reliable, independent alternating current"


Good info!

Thanks....

 

[coolflyingfool]

How about a SEA-HNL-NRT route?

 

[Some Clown]

How about a SEA-HNL-NRT route?

I don't think it has the legs to do the HNL-NRT trip and carry a decent payload. The headwinds along that part of the North Pacific going westbound can be brutal if my memory serves me. Its been a while since I worked in that part of the world.

Great Circle Route Mapper

 

[coolflyingfool]

Okay, I will give you that the HNL-NRT is to long. It would not be profitable for AS. Thanks for the route info!!

 

[whlinder]

Could the 800 with winglets do ANC-NRT?

 

[coolflyingfool]

The ANC-NRT leg would come in at 3000 miles. I am not sure you want to push a highly profitable leg SEA-ANC in to sharing seats with the continuation to NRT. I don't think there is enough traffic to support the ANC-NRT leg. just my thoughts...........

 

[bcp7]

The great circle distance between ANC and NRT is 2984 Nautical miles. Boeing claims the max range for the -800 is 3060 NM. If you factor in ETOPS fuel requirements, you can't make the trip carrying any payload, and probably not at all. I don't have access to a flt planning system to verify it though.

 

[Guest_airlineguy_*]

ok, does the apu have to be running? If so, must it be on the busses? My understanding is there must be continuous power available. does this not mean auto transfer of power? Must the apu run the entire flight or just the etops portion. Interesting discussion.

Hello from Veñezuela!

 

[bcp7]

Yes, for operating in ETOPS airspace in a 737-800, the APU gernerator must be operating to provide a 3rd electrical source. With the price of fuel these days, most companies will not start the APU until just before entering ETOPS airspace, and will shut it down upon leaving OPS airspace.

If the APU or the APU Generator are not operable, you cannot enter ETOPS airspace.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Just to add an interesting tidbit to the discussion.....

SEATTLE (AP) -- Boeing Co. said Tuesday it had launched a new version of its single-aisle, twin-engine 737 after All Nippon Airways Co. converted a previous 737 order to take two of the new airplanes.

The new 737-700ER will have the longest range of any 737, with the ability to fly between 4,793 and 6,341 miles, depending on what options an airline chooses. It can seat as many as 126 passengers in a two-class configuration.

The jet features the fuselage of the commercial 737-700 and the wings and landing gear of the larger 737-800.

All Nippon Airways, Japan's second-largest carrier, is scheduled to take delivery of the first airplane early next year.

The 737 family is Boeing's top-selling aircraft, with more than 6,000 orders to date.

Jim

 

[whlinder]

I can see CO flying that thing out of EWR to tons of cities in Europe and South America.