Emergency landing after row of seats comes loose

[eolesen]

AA knows who maintained the airplane. So do the mechanics.

Maybe that's why nobody is blaming Timco on this one, but hey, I'm willing to listen to reason.

 

[AA89]

How many MD 80s were sent to Timco?

Maybe that's why nobody is blaming Timco.

Time for the Minister of Misinformation to roll out the company approved causes. Do we still serve enough snacks on MD 80 routes to dislodge seats from their tracks??

 

[eolesen]

Maybe AA should start charging extra for sugary drinks to offset the maintenance expense...

 

[Bob Owens]

Really? You may be right, but in decades of flying AA, I cannot recall ever noticing that my row of seats was loose, nor have I ever seen other passengers complain (and you'd think they'd notice if they sat down and their row of seats was loose). I've seen maintenance come on board for various things, but never to tighten up a row of loose seats. Perhaps maintenance gets to that loose row prior to boarding, every time. If it's really as common as you say, you'd think there would be more complaints and that the media would have been all over it during the last few decades.

In my decades of working on airplanes I've seen plenty of seats that rock, Its not unusual and with three people sitting in the row it may not be that noticable, we are talking about a movement of less than 1/4". Normally the fix is to tighten up the front. On a B-ck it would not be unheard of for the Inspector to write up a dozen or so rows.

 

[Bob Owens]

dupe.

 

[strikeforce]

aahles@star-telegram.com
FORT WORTH -- American Airlines will add new seat-locking devices to 49 Boeing 767-300s to prevent seats from coming loose on those planes, the carrier announced Friday.
The work is in addition to the 48 Boeing 757s that were outfitted with the secondary locking device last week after rows of seats came loose in flight on two aircraft.
The Fort Worth-based carrier, which has 58 Boeing 767-300s, said it does not need to cancel any flights to complete the installation as it will be done during overnight maintenance checks. The Federal Aviation Administration approved American's plan for the device, American said.
"After inspecting our entire aircraft fleet, we have determined that 49 of our 767s have the same primary locking device that was found on 48 of our 757s," American told managers in a message Friday. "There have been no in-flight incidents impacting customers with the seat-locking mechanisms on these 767s. This added layer of safety involves the same aviation-strength locking device that we installed on some of our 757s."
American had to cancel close to 100 flights last week when it added seat-locking mechanisms to its 757s. The carrier said normal wear and tear and beverage spills kept the old devices from working properly.
The problem with loose seats first came to light Sept. 29 when American Flight 685 from Boston to Miami had to make an emergency landing at New York's JFK airport after a row of three seats came loose in flight. Another plane had a similar problem Oct. 1, prompting the inspections.
In an interview with the Star-Telegram on Thursday, American CEO Tom Horton said the seat problem is unique to American because it involves a group of planes whose interiors had not been updated.
"There are issues that affect the entire industry. There are issues that affect an individual airlines because of the way something is configured," Horton said. "Some of our 757s have completely new interiors. These were the 48 that had not gone through that and as a consequence the seat configuration was unique to those airplanes and unique to American."

why are people blaming TIMCO when according to Horton, "these were the 48 that had not gone through" seat mods??

 

[FWAAA]

In an interview with the Star-Telegram on Thursday, American CEO Tom Horton said the seat problem is unique to American because it involves a group of planes whose interiors had not been updated.

"There are issues that affect the entire industry. There are issues that affect an individual airlines because of the way something is configured," Horton said. "Some of our 757s have completely new interiors. These were the 48 that had not gone through that and as a consequence the seat configuration was unique to those airplanes and unique to American."

why are people blaming TIMCO when according to Horton, "these were the 48 that had not gone through" seat mods??

Timco is being blamed because AA has farmed out the re-pitch project to Timco. The re-pitch includes removing row 12 and adjusting the remaining rows ahead of the overwing exit. This work is being done quickly and isn't waiting for the complete cabin refurb. I believe (but not certain) that the re-pitch work is being performed at BOS. At least some of the loose-seat 757s had been re-pitched (by Timco). The 763 re-pitch is being outsourced to someone (Timco?) at SAN.

 

[WorldTraveler]

so, can we summarize this whole incident (or set of them) as a rushed repitch of seats using equipment/parts that AA might have uniquely used and done by people/contractors who weren't familiar w/ the characteristics of that seat or at least weren't as focused on seat attachment as other parties and without the proper QC after the job?

Because even if there are attempts to say these are industry issues, I am not aware of any other airlines at least in recent memory that have had multiple rows of seats coming loose in flight.

 

[dfw gen]

World traveler I believe you have hit the nail on the head. Typically seats are removed and overhauled every three years unless there is a repitch or Eco ordered. It's the old adage you get what you pay for. You order cheap you get cheap. Aa is not lying but not telling the whole truth yes crap in the seat track will not allow you to not allow you to lock the seat down. That's why we spend a day cleaning seat tracks BEFORE installing the seats.
But at aa we don't have enough time to do it right the first time, but plenty of time for it the second and third time.....

 

[eolesen]

Because even if there are attempts to say these are industry issues, I am not aware of any other airlines at least in recent memory that have had multiple rows of seats coming loose in flight.

Nope. They've just had wheels literally come off the airplane, tools left in fuel tanks or behind wall panels, electrical wiring reversed, and pitch control cables inappropriately rigged...

I'll take a loose seat over an incorrectly wired engine control.

 

[Tater Salad]

Nope. They've just had wheels literally come off the airplane, tools left in fuel tanks or behind wall panels, electrical wiring reversed, and pitch control cables inappropriately rigged...

I'll take a loose seat over an incorrectly wired engine control.

Dude, what is your problem with AMT's? Did one terrorize you when you were a child or something?

 

[eolesen]

So, I'm guessing you (Tater) have no problem with chop shops?

Those are all events that happened to airplanes coming out of outsourced overhaul, if you believe the AMTs on this and other forums.

I have lots of respect for AMTs. I have zero respect for unions who place dues revenue ahead of their members, and for people who think they're somehow immune to economic gravity. Try not to confuse the three viewpoints.

 

[WorldTraveler]

Nope. They've just had wheels literally come off the airplane, tools left in fuel tanks or behind wall panels, electrical wiring reversed, and pitch control cables inappropriately rigged...

I'll take a loose seat over an incorrectly wired engine control.

there is NO acceptable excuse for any human controllable mistakes... no one should justify ANY controllable errors.

Errors can happen regardless of union or non-union status. If there seems to be a reason for concern, it is that the appropriate QC wasn't followed, regardless of who did the work.

Trying to spin a QC problem at one company into an industry wide problem is nothing more than deflection of responsibility.

 

[eolesen]

Don't disagree on QC being the ultimate issue, [deleted], but my point is that errors happen industry wide, which is what your question was. They just happen to occur very infrequently, which says that QC in general does work.

 

[Glenn Quagmire]

so, can we summarize this whole incident (or set of them) as ...

...without the proper QC after the job.

Quality control does not happen after the job WT, final inspection does. There is a huge difference between the two.