Dueling rumors
- Thread starter Light Years
- Start date
Old PSA
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- Aug 26, 2002
- 188
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To: mrplanes
I couldn''t have said it better my self. There are so many examples that support your statements about Dave and the boys, I not even going to try to list them.
Until the BOD finds someone who wants to run an airline in the real world (not the PAST)and not just make "big deals", US will continue to languish.
I couldn''t have said it better my self. There are so many examples that support your statements about Dave and the boys, I not even going to try to list them.
Until the BOD finds someone who wants to run an airline in the real world (not the PAST)and not just make "big deals", US will continue to languish.
PITbull
Veteran
- Dec 29, 2002
- 7,784
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mrplanes,
You should be CEO. You see what I see, and we are few; but numbers are and will increase with time. The Union busters are here at U, and will spread out across our Industry and then all Industries, which will hurt our economy at the very least keep it where it is (soft). Unionized workers spend money as long as they have a "livable wage". For those who are non union, their wages stay up for the very reason that unionized workers set the "wage bar". Many in our socieity just don't get it quite yet. But will soon. The great "equalizer" is OFF kilter and needs to shift. It will take time, planning and organizing, but it will happen.
You have more insight and foresight, and courage to speak the truth about this new mangement than anyone I have spoken to this past year.
You should be CEO. You see what I see, and we are few; but numbers are and will increase with time. The Union busters are here at U, and will spread out across our Industry and then all Industries, which will hurt our economy at the very least keep it where it is (soft). Unionized workers spend money as long as they have a "livable wage". For those who are non union, their wages stay up for the very reason that unionized workers set the "wage bar". Many in our socieity just don't get it quite yet. But will soon. The great "equalizer" is OFF kilter and needs to shift. It will take time, planning and organizing, but it will happen.
You have more insight and foresight, and courage to speak the truth about this new mangement than anyone I have spoken to this past year.
The place is simply a commodity. The pension boys aren''t philanthropists. They got control of the place for about the cost of a couple of A330''s. The only way they get a return is to sell or merge it. Management survival has nothing to do with operational expertise. On the other hand, if they are deemed to have become an obstruction in the quest for a payday, they''ll disappear faster than a bag in Philly.
T-bone
Advanced
- Feb 15, 2003
- 239
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I know this doesn''t follow the thread of this conversation but, A heads up on the fleet. A/C 393 was found in C-check to have it''s roof ready to blow (8-foot crack at stringer 10 left). This A/C has only 38k cycles, so with the involvement of Boeing and the FAA, This is going to greatly accelerate major heavy maint to the 737 fleet. Watch out for a lot of permanent parks.
Deel:
Your thought seems to be correct. However, the way the money will be made is by having the newly issued stock (of which RSA holds the most) being at a very high price. While RSA and Dave are extremely intelligent money men, they can not force Wall Street to bid up the price of the stock unless the underlying company is solid, profitable and worth something to someone.
While I don''t enjoy the systematic dismantling of this company, I certainly would not object to being part of a well run airline that purchases us. But for that to happen, this management has to make us worth something. In other words, we must have a good airline. Sure, he can turn us into a dog and pur a for sale sign up but the stock price isn''t going to be much. Look at the major airline stock prices today. That tells you all you need to know about what a "good airline" is worth. My contention is simply that Dave does not have the ability or leadership to create a well run airline.
We may well be destined to wear other colors of a proud and competent company. To get there will require a management that makes us a valuable commodity. These guys aren''t doing it. I hope we are both correct in assuming the BOD will recognize it and exchange money managers with leaders.
mr
Your thought seems to be correct. However, the way the money will be made is by having the newly issued stock (of which RSA holds the most) being at a very high price. While RSA and Dave are extremely intelligent money men, they can not force Wall Street to bid up the price of the stock unless the underlying company is solid, profitable and worth something to someone.
While I don''t enjoy the systematic dismantling of this company, I certainly would not object to being part of a well run airline that purchases us. But for that to happen, this management has to make us worth something. In other words, we must have a good airline. Sure, he can turn us into a dog and pur a for sale sign up but the stock price isn''t going to be much. Look at the major airline stock prices today. That tells you all you need to know about what a "good airline" is worth. My contention is simply that Dave does not have the ability or leadership to create a well run airline.
We may well be destined to wear other colors of a proud and competent company. To get there will require a management that makes us a valuable commodity. These guys aren''t doing it. I hope we are both correct in assuming the BOD will recognize it and exchange money managers with leaders.
mr
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And also let us not forget this kind of discord between labor groups will only play into the hands of the vipers running this company. If we can''t unite then why even bother paying union dues or belonging to a union at all! If we don''t make a united stand we are just pissing in the wind.
OldpropGuy
Advanced
- Aug 20, 2002
- 185
- 8
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On 7/3/2003 7:32:57 AM blueoceans wrote:
"...US Airways cannot reduce its mainline fleet below the current limit of 279 aircraft because current fundamental factors do not support a "force majuere" claim and ALPA will not authorize a fleet reduction."
ALPA won''t allow this, ALPA won''t allow that. Who''s running this company, anyway?
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Let''s not forget that this is the same ALPA that allowed the flying to go outside the company to the contract carriers.On 7/3/2003 7:32:57 AM blueoceans wrote:
"...US Airways cannot reduce its mainline fleet below the current limit of 279 aircraft because current fundamental factors do not support a "force majuere" claim and ALPA will not authorize a fleet reduction."
ALPA won''t allow this, ALPA won''t allow that. Who''s running this company, anyway?
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MR, you are right. A refloat of the stock is the other exit, but it can't price properly so long as (a) the entire sector is depressed, and (B) US, in particular, is unable to achieve significant operating improvement, something that appears to elude them no matter how draconian the reductions. Dumping the place will be faster, and probably more profitable. The crucible for the management is to continue to strip the place without permanently damaging the franchise. Already, the Shuttle looks less interesting, and they keep gambling that reducing or eliminating what, in the past, were core services, will simply drive traffic to what is left. In the latter undertaking, they don't seem to give sufficient weight to what competitive forces will do, particularly the low cost guys, in the way of backfilling. The internal thinking appears very parochial, and seems to be based on past historical experience. Where it comes unstuck is, in the past, the upstart carrier was crushed by the application of superior service and marketing at matching cost to the consumer. This time around, they have not been able to afford to do it, and you can see a couple of significant new entrants gaining critical mass (JetBlue, AirTran, Frontier). Those guys are not Vanguard or Carnival. Likewise, as in BWI, WN has wasted no time in filling the hole. Just walk down the concourse at PBI and count the number of gates WN has added in the last 2 years. I follow this thing more as sport, than anything. Learning from people's mistakes is useful. In Wolf's case, you could understand why they did what they did. The guy was working towards a payday, and probably would have gotten it if he hadn't pushed his less talented opposite number at UA to an unsustainable price point. That was just arrogance, because he clearly always knew the business plan was limited by history and geography. On the other hand, this bunch seems to think they can fix it, and may not comprehend the very black and white realities of an investment fund. It is return driven, and as such, its imperatives are always changing. The other unspoken issue is Continental, with whom US competes very direclty in many markets. They have quite successfully avoided scrutiny of their very weak balance sheet, gambling continuance of superior service would restore profits. Recently, they have begun to cut fares. In fact, curiously, if you scan the various fare search engines, you see guys like JetBlue are often more expensive than the majors, which speaks volumes about their ability to establish brand. It sort of reminds you of a film which you know ends a certain way, but you find entertainment value in how it gets there.
OldpropGuy
Advanced
- Aug 20, 2002
- 185
- 8
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On 7/5/2003 8:00:23 AM cavalier wrote:
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And also let us not forget this kind of discord between labor groups will only play into the hands of the vipers running this company. If we can''t unite then why even bother paying union dues or belonging to a union at all! If we don''t make a united stand we are just pissing in the wind.
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You''re kidding, right? When did any labor group, especially ALPA, ever worry about anyone but themselves? On 7/5/2003 8:00:23 AM cavalier wrote:
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And also let us not forget this kind of discord between labor groups will only play into the hands of the vipers running this company. If we can''t unite then why even bother paying union dues or belonging to a union at all! If we don''t make a united stand we are just pissing in the wind.
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Why don''t you just say "Can''t we all just get along?"
Give me a break.........The piss has been blowing back for years!
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On 7/5/2003 7
49 PM OldpropGuy wrote:
Why don''t you just say "Can''t we all just get along?"
Give me a break.........The piss has been blowing back for years!
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Take a handfull of guys like you with like minds and we will fall just like the company wants. The company loves your kind, defeated before the first shot is fired. On 7/5/2003 7
49 PM OldpropGuy wrote:----------------
On 7/5/2003 8:00:23 AM cavalier wrote:
----------------
And also let us not forget this kind of discord between labor groups will only play into the hands of the vipers running this company. If we can''t unite then why even bother paying union dues or belonging to a union at all! If we don''t make a united stand we are just pissing in the wind.
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You''re kidding, right? When did any labor group, especially ALPA, ever worry about anyone but themselves? On 7/5/2003 8:00:23 AM cavalier wrote:
----------------
And also let us not forget this kind of discord between labor groups will only play into the hands of the vipers running this company. If we can''t unite then why even bother paying union dues or belonging to a union at all! If we don''t make a united stand we are just pissing in the wind.
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Why don''t you just say "Can''t we all just get along?"
Give me a break.........The piss has been blowing back for years!
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T
tay
Guest
From where I stand about 5 shots have been fired and they have one more bullet left, and they just keep revolving the barrel!!
