Doug and the Gang Cash In.
- Thread starter 700UW
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jimntx
Veteran
What part of this is the way things work in American business now don't you understand? With the possible exception of Southwest, there ain't a group of airline executives out there that aren't doing the same or wishing that they could. Now, you can work yourself into a lather over that or just decide to accept it for what it is...legal thievery. It won't change anything one way or the other.
May I remind you that one of the first things the executives at PMAA did following the concessions they forced on us in 2003 "to keep us out of bankruptcy" was to award themselves cash bonuses. At least DP is simply cashing in some stock options that were due to expire. If I had been him, I wouldn't have let them expire either.
May I remind you that one of the first things the executives at PMAA did following the concessions they forced on us in 2003 "to keep us out of bankruptcy" was to award themselves cash bonuses. At least DP is simply cashing in some stock options that were due to expire. If I had been him, I wouldn't have let them expire either.
Crash Pad DCA
Senior
Where are the stock options for the rest of the US employess?jimntx said:
Crash Pad DCA
Senior
http://www.bizjournals.com/bizjournals/blog/seat2B/2014/02/commuter-airlines-face-pilot-shortage.html?page=all
How miserly airlines created their own pilot shortage
The nation's big airlines want you to know that there's a dreadful pilot shortage and they apologize profusely if their commuter-carrier partners cancel flights to your hometown airport due to the debilitating shortfall.
The nation's big airlines don't want you to know that their commuter carriers, which operate half of all the nation's commercial flights, often pay pilots so little that it's often financially wiser to drive a truck or flip fast-food burgers than fly a plane.
And the bosses of the nation's big airlines certainly prefer that you don't conflate the fact that they're cashing in big time with the reality that they continue to insist on financial concessions from their existing pilots.
How miserly airlines created their own pilot shortage
The nation's big airlines want you to know that there's a dreadful pilot shortage and they apologize profusely if their commuter-carrier partners cancel flights to your hometown airport due to the debilitating shortfall.
The nation's big airlines don't want you to know that their commuter carriers, which operate half of all the nation's commercial flights, often pay pilots so little that it's often financially wiser to drive a truck or flip fast-food burgers than fly a plane.
And the bosses of the nation's big airlines certainly prefer that you don't conflate the fact that they're cashing in big time with the reality that they continue to insist on financial concessions from their existing pilots.
jimntx
Veteran
And, the LCC bankruptcies are different from other BKs how? It's the way things work in American business today. And, our unions (and their members) allow it. I was told that the flight attendant union at AA had a "no raise for management without equal raise for flight attendants" clause in their proposed BK TA. It was probably the first thing struck from the document by management, and AFAIK, the union made no attempt to object. It's why I love the fact that the AE pilots turned down the Agreement in (Un)Principle. The company thought all they had to do was threaten the pilots with shutting down the airline. (With the flight attendants all they have to do is offer some piddling, eaten up by an increase in medical insurance premiums raise. Works every time.) Well, the pilots have called their bluff, and despite the naysaying and contemptuous comments from people like E who think that if it's said by management it is true, the pilot shortage is real. And, it is going to get worse very quickly. As WT pointed out, there's a whole bunch of mainline pilots who are about to be forceably retired due to reaching age 65, and it will accelerate.
Now, E was quick to point out that WT had faulty numbers--that AE represented only 42% of mainline's feed. Well, let's see how well mainline does when that mere 42% goes missing. (And, I think even E would admit privately that there is not enough excess lift and pilots out there for anyone to pick up the slack.)
I repeat...LCC is different from other airlines and companies in BK how? We allowed it. (Unless, you are TWU, but that's your fault also.) We stood by while the plans were made to stuff pockets with cash and stock options and promotions. You get what you negotiate.
See above.
I grew up in Birmingham, AL when the steel mills and mines were still open and just about everyone belonged to a union. NO ONE crossed a picket line except for emergency personnel--fire trucks and ambulances. NO ONE. Because everyone knew that despite the law there was no way anyone was going to arrest everyone who refused to cross. And, the union leaders were willing to go to jail for their convictions and their members.
Now, union members gladly and happily pick up struck work from other unions or cross another union's picket line. Then, we all wonder why the unions have no strength anymore. The unions are us. And, as long as the pervasive American "me first" attitude includes all union members, things are only going to get worse. We can look forward to outsourcing of any job in any company--in craft unions to China probably. And, if you are a pilot or flight attendant don't think you are safe either. The airlines will be pushing to change the regulations such that our jobs can be given to contract workers who make less money and get NO benefits from the airline just as they have done with agents and mechanics and other job categories.
And you have out of touch union executives like the Bufeenbargers and Roachs who are enriching themselves and enjoy lavish perks while their members are told to give up hard fought pension, retiree medical, and other benefits. GVP Mark Blondin made a video in 2012 about the importance of keeping DB pension plans and less than two years later Buffy takes action to effectively nullify the 2-1 rejection of Boeing's offer and force a revote-at a time when the plant was closed for holiday shut down and then boasts that the vote was taken democratically. Yep that's democratic.
Josh
Josh
robbedagain
Veteran
- Oct 13, 2003
- 11,125
- 2,676
and dont forget some financial places that commit fraud yet their execs get away with it not to mention the financial collaspe in which not one flippin arse mgmt got arrested or sent to prison for the fraudulent crap in the financial sector
robbedagain
Veteran
- Oct 13, 2003
- 11,125
- 2,676
really i think they knew and they covered it up real well then it all blew up in the financial crisis
jimntx
Veteran
No one, especially not I, said you had to like it. But, for heaven's sakes, either do something about it, or kwitcher bellyachin' as the old cartoon used to say. All of this moral outrage is just a bit too precious when we all allowed it to happen in the first place. Then after the fact, everyone gets their panties in a wad.
What really needs to be done is not legal so the only thing I can do on my own is to do the least amount of business with the companies that I don't like. It's not much but it's legal. Before I retired I flew by the contract ...as weak as it was there were still some useful parts. Years ago when crew sched. called on some holiday or another to assign a trip to me on a day off I left the family and went to help the company. In the last ten years I got many calls to assign a trip to me and I did not accept a single one even though several times I was asked the dreaded phrase "are you refusing this assignment". Something between open rebellion and tacit acceptance can actually affect changes over time.jimntx said:
What would you do about something you did not think was/is right?
