Divide and conquer within.....what else is new

[Chuck Schalk]

It is my understanding that tulsa union reps are putting out to the floor that the line local wants to make the line test harder for overhaul mechanics to qualify for the line. That is a company function to set up test.  It amazes me that your Tulsa reps use the same play book and Tulsa falls for it.  Tulsa reps have used myself, Bob Owens, and now gary Peterson as propaganda to spread lies and divide our membership between line and overhaul.  JFK voted 96% NO because we read the whole contract and realized how much leeway the company would have with the non-union language.  Before Tulsa bites on the hook, look at the history of where the info came from and why!

 

[MetalMover]

Sounds to me that because Tulsa will be shrinking further come 2014, they are concerned that their members will have to bump the line once more.
But the difference is that this time they will be bumping their own former Tulsans!

 

[lpbrian]

I would think most of the affected AMTs to exercise local options and displace to OSM positions.

 

[CactUS4Ever]

Were hearing on the US side Tulsa will be knocked down to 2000 mechanics in 2014. I suppose its due to some MD80s going away and the new airbus coming online.

 

[OldGuy@AA]

The story from the hall is that Gary Peterson is pushing for this because he knows DFW will be the most appealing option for Tulsa guys to bump and he wants to protect his own. There was also a story that an "Overhaul Guy" (didn't say if from AFW or TUL) was responsible for injuring (the word was killing) a fellow AMT by making a mistake. Since we had not heard of any deaths in DFW, I called BS on this one. But as you know, the sheep in Tulsa believe what they are told by the TWU. Personally, I think it is the TWU International that is responsible. I'm sure AA expressed concern that there would be too much bumping and asked them for some help. It would help if Gary Peterson put out a letter to the Tulsa membership denying he is responsible. That would expose the liars who started this story. Hopefully Chuck can make that happen. Thanks for the post Chuck. Incidentally, they want you to have to study 700 questions and then be asked any 40 of them. Then you must pass a practical test. The biggest question is how many new hires off the street on the line stations could pass this test. I am guessing none. But Tulsa did this to ourselves by voting yes.

 

[Thomas Paine]

Much ado about nothing. Historically the airline ends up with more work than they planed on not less. Known maintenance issues don't just go away, but new ones are added. Do your jobs in Tulsa and find them and you will secure your job that much longer. Yes Tulsa will shrink, at the same time the rest of the workforce, in fact every single mechanic, will be getting older, some will retire, some will die, and some will move on to other endeavors. Massive RIFS are unlikely, unless something drastic happens and they can dump the MD-80s and 757s that are flying around at pretty much full capacity, faster than planned.
 
Its sad that some in Tulsa are saying that Gary Peterson is just trying to protect DFW, shows how disconnected they are from the new reality, the Juniority list that Tulsa has kept in place over the years already does that, regardless of their seniority they go to the station where the Junior man is, and the Junior people are in NY and LAX. So without a massive RIF they will never get deep enough into that Juniority list to affect DFW. What's more likely is periodic small RIFs when attrition doesn't keep up with the fall off of work or if the workers are needed elsewhere in the system. Once again the two places that will most likely end up short when there is a surplus of workers in Tulsa will be New York and LAX, because any vacancies in DFW will be filled by transfers from AFW and elsewhere around the system.  So what it comes down to is if you can slip into DFW on a Transfer then do so, because when the RIFS start the only places you will be able to go will be NY or LAX.

 

[OldGuy@AA]

Good post Mr. Paine. You make some good points. Yes the guys in Tulsa are getting older by the day. If AA offers another early out package more will take it, but you know they will offer only as much as they absolutely have to and won't address any medical plan for the early outers. This will limit the takers again. If they are serious they will offer some kind of affordable medical plan, then they can get rid of lots of us.

 

[swamt]

Were hearing on the US side Tulsa will be knocked down to 2000 mechanics in 2014. I suppose its due to some MD80s going away and the new airbus coming online.

First sentence is correct, (not sure of the final number you post) but YES, Tulsa will be shrinking, if they have not already started, it will this year (2013) and continue into and thru 2014, and some folks from the TWU union are claiming it will continue thru 2018.
Second part is what the TWU wants you to believe. These reductions at Tulsa are still the results of the contract that the TWU agreed too with the company, brought it out to the membership because the agreed to it, and selling it to the membership, for the company, to get a ratification vote to pass. And they (TWU) pushed for a yes vote very hard, even used scare tactics to get it to pass. If you guys vote in the alliance, as one group, it will be the same same for all of you. Your choice when the time comes...

 

[Thomas Paine]

Were hearing on the US side Tulsa will be knocked down to 2000 mechanics in 2014. I suppose its due to some MD80s going away and the new airbus coming online.

You are hearing wrong.

 

[dfw gen]

Excellent post Paine those that have been around and TAKE THE TIME to read the contract will find out what you say is true. Most sheep don't even know how much they make an hour!

 

[Thomas Paine]

Good post Mr. Paine. You make some good points. Yes the guys in Tulsa are getting older by the day. If AA offers another early out package more will take it, but you know they will offer only as much as they absolutely have to and won't address any medical plan for the early outers. This will limit the takers again. If they are serious they will offer some kind of affordable medical plan, then they can get rid of lots of us.

Well for some the package may be "retire, or pack up your things and go to NY". How many over 55 are going to move?  I'm not too sure they will offer a package when they know that they wont need much of an incentive to get people to leave for free. Lets face it, they probably want the younger guys out on the line anyway, and will be content to leave the oldest guys in Tulsa to retire out and they wont replace them. Attrition across the whole system will be reflected as reduced headcount in Tulsa. Younger mechanics from Tulsa will fill vacancies on the line. They will keep making Tulsa a less and less desirable place to come to everyday by breaking balls and terminating people over little things. Once terminated they will let guys opt to retire. Tulsa will likely get older and older over the next few years, then maybe in 2018 they will offer a buyout and close the place. Overspeed's fairy tale of "jobs coming back due to our language" will never come to pass. Even the guys who are left in Tulsa will vote against it because by 2018 the average guy in Tulsa will be well into retirement age.

 

[Tex-Mech]

Excellent post Paine those that have been around and TAKE THE TIME to read the contract will find out what you say is true. Most sheep don't even know how much they make an hour!

Good point.  I looked up the changes to the QAM, and the company can change the test to whatever they want, and the changes stick until or unless the union arbitrates them.  Here is the 2003 contract

 
[SIZE=medium](f)        The Company will immediately furnish the International Union with twenty one (21) copies of its Qualifications Administration Manual.  Further, the Company will immediately furnish the International Union with twenty one (21) copies of any additions, deletions or changes subsequently made.[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=medium]            (1)       The International Union will have sixty (60) calendar days from the date of receipt of the manual and subsequent additions, deletions or changes which may be made, to notify the Company in writing of any objections as to the requirements and qualifications standards established in the manual.  [/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=medium]            (2)       In the event of such objections, the Company will continue with the previously established requirements or qualifications standards in effect, and the Union may appeal its objection to the System Board of Adjustment in accordance with the provisions of Article 29.[/SIZE]
 

 Here is the one Tulsa voted for in 2012 based on 514's endorsement.
 

 
f) The Company will furnish the International Union with a soft copy of its Qualifications Administration Manual. Further, the Company will furnish the International Union with a soft copy of any additions, deletions or changes subsequently to be made thirty (30) days prior to addition or deletion.
(1) The International Union will have thirty (30) calendar days from the date of receipt of the manual and subsequent additions, deletions or changes which may be made, to notify the Company in writing of any objections as to the requirements and qualifications standards established in the manual.
(2) In the event of such objections, the Company will continue with the implementation of their additions, deletions and/or changes to previously established requirements or qualifications standards in effect, and the Union may appeal its objection to the System Board of Adjustment in accordance with the provisions of Article 29.

 
How about the Tulsa local start putting the blame for what they done back on themselves.  They sold this pig that we are all stuck with now.  You can't say that Tulsa wasn't warned.
 

 

[Bob Owens]

The test should be harder.
 
 
 
Management isn't doing anyone any favors by rubber stamping guys who never worked the line to go out to the line. Especially to Class II stations where they really can't carry anyone.  New hires on the line have to show at least two years experience in heavy turbine line maintenance and then are on a six month probation. If someone transfers to the line after being pushed through the test and ends up being a hazard to himself, his coworkers and the passengers the only recourse is termination. Better to get laid off in Tulsa with recall rights than terminated from a line station because you are not up to speed.

 

[bikeguy]

You are hearing wrong.

Is the 757 work still going to be outsourced? If so when and is that going to amount to a lot of guys displaced?
Rumor here in DFW is up to 400 jobs will be trimmed.

 

[787nightmare]

The story from the hall is that Gary Peterson is pushing for this because he knows DFW will be the most appealing option for Tulsa guys to bump and he wants to protect his own. There was also a story that an "Overhaul Guy" (didn't say if from AFW or TUL) was responsible for injuring (the word was killing) a fellow AMT by making a mistake. Since we had not heard of any deaths in DFW, I called BS on this one. But as you know, the sheep in Tulsa believe what they are told by the TWU. Personally, I think it is the TWU International that is responsible. I'm sure AA expressed concern that there would be too much bumping and asked them for some help. It would help if Gary Peterson put out a letter to the Tulsa membership denying he is responsible. That would expose the liars who started this story. Hopefully Chuck can make that happen. Thanks for the post Chuck. Incidentally, they want you to have to study 700 questions and then be asked any 40 of them. Then you must pass a practical test. The biggest question is how many new hires off the street on the line stations could pass this test. I am guessing none. But Tulsa did this to ourselves by voting yes.

 
 
"....they want you to have to study 700 questions and then be asked any 40 of them-must pass a practical test".
 
Jeezzz!!   any new hires ever encounter this? Unbelievable...