CAL mechanics have a T/A

[Bob Owens]

Well I hope it doesn't pass too, but I've got this weird feeling that this POS will probably pass. I can't speak for the other stations, but I think just like the last couple of times EWR is going to be the only majority NO vote station. Oh never mind the record profits the ATA is predicting, I remember reading an article a couple of weeks ago (sorry I don't remember which source right now) the combined United Continental has about $9 billion in unrestricted cash between the two of them (Continental is somewhere between $4 and $5 billion), once you factor in ATA estimates for later it will be more than that. So is Bob is there any updates with AA since that T/A was voted down?

Yes, we have a new and much improved table position and will hopefully meet again with the company and the NMB soon. I realize our TA (and prior table position) probably cut the legs off your negotiators but thankfully our members turned it down in a big way, 2 to 1. Everyone was predicting ours would pass as well but thankfully it didnt. Now the shoe is on the other foot, your TA if it passes would cut our legs off.

Please just make sure that everyone who doesnt like it, but thinks its going to pass anyway, votes how they feel about it!! In the past I've seen contracts at AA pass by less than 100 votes with enough uncast votes in our local that could have changed the outcome.

 

[planenut767]

Yes, we have a new and much improved table position and will hopefully meet again with the company and the NMB soon. I realize our TA (and prior table position) probably cut the legs off your negotiators but thankfully our members turned it down in a big way, 2 to 1. Everyone was predicting ours would pass as well but thankfully it didnt. Now the shoe is on the other foot, your TA if it passes would cut our legs off.

Please just make sure that everyone who doesnt like it, but thinks its going to pass anyway, votes how they feel about it!! In the past I've seen contracts at AA pass by less than 100 votes with enough uncast votes in our local that could have changed the outcome.

Well I and many of my coworkers here in EWR have done our "civic duty" and voted no to this monstrosity. It's the other stations I really can't gauge, but there might be others out there that could. Traditionally it's been the high cost of living areas (EWR, LAX, etc) that are traditionally majority no votes while the lower cost of living areas (IAH, MCO, etc) traditionally yes vote majorities (btw no COLA yet again just a promise to form a committee to examine the issue further, but only if it passes, what joke). I'm also wondering what's going to happen when the United guys come into play if everyone's going to be on the same page or not when we start having talks for a combined contract. Anyway good luck to you guys at AA I really do hope you guys get what you're asking for from them.

 

[Bob Owens]

Well I and many of my coworkers here in EWR have done our "civic duty" and voted no to this monstrosity. It's the other stations I really can't gauge, but there might be others out there that could. Traditionally it's been the high cost of living areas (EWR, LAX, etc) that are traditionally majority no votes while the lower cost of living areas (IAH, MCO, etc) traditionally yes vote majorities (btw no COLA yet again just a promise to form a committee to examine the issue further, but only if it passes, what joke). I'm also wondering what's going to happen when the United guys come into play if everyone's going to be on the same page or not when we start having talks for a combined contract. Anyway good luck to you guys at AA I really do hope you guys get what you're asking for from them.

The situation is similar at AA. Except this time some of the low cost areas voted No at a greater percentage than some places with higher costs. For instance the OH bases in Tulsa and Fort Worth along with the Line station in DFW, all low cost areas voted no in a big way (New York was 94% No) but some of the other cities such as MIA, and ORD has a lot of Yes votes. IMO the reason what it wasnt rejected at a higher rate on the line was because although the contract sucked and included a lot of concessions the company offered a much higher line premium and some of the line guys figured if they voted it down that the company would simply take something away from the line, give it to OH and those guys would then vote it in. Its a real concern and historically justified but hopefully things have changed. I think the wages are now so low that even those in low cost areas have had enough.

 

[planenut767]

Well looks like the vote count has been postponed until November 4th, due to some of the mechanics reporting to the union that they did not get a ballot and have requested a duplicate ballot be sent out to them. Also the deadline for requesting the duplicate ballots has been extended to October 22nd 12:00pm EST. The start time of the vote will be 10:00 am EST on the 4th.

 

[gtd]

Well looks like the vote count has been postponed until November 4th, due to some of the mechanics reporting to the union that they did not get a ballot and have requested a duplicate ballot be sent out to them. Also the deadline for requesting the duplicate ballots has been extended to October 22nd 12:00pm EST. The start time of the vote will be 10:00 am EST on the 4th.

Something stinks!

 

[Bob Owens]

Well it looks like your FAs turned down a 7% increase over 26 months.

Hope they dont show the mechanics up!!!!

They will feel dumb if they accept a crappy deal while everyone else holds out for something better.

 

[gtd]

Well it looks like your FAs turned down a 7% increase over 26 months.

Hope they dont show the mechanics up!!!!

They will feel dumb if they accept a crappy deal while everyone else holds out for something better.

Amen to that!

 

[paul1]

whats the word its nov 4

 

[adiruwho]

whats the word its nov 4

Passed, short term amenable 2012, seems to be a bird in hand vote pending a joint CBA

 

[Bob Owens]

Passed, short term amenable 2012, seems to be a bird in hand vote pending a joint CBA

Dissapointing, to say the least. Once again mechanics quiver while the FA's take a stand.
I guess they figure they will get another shot when the merger takes place.

 

[gatemech]

I can only hope that when the same money is presented to UA mechanics we turn it down. This is
probably the last time for a long time the company has money and showing profits during negotiations.
I don't want to pay for the merger. I don't want to pay for Tiltons package (whatever that is). I don't
want to pay for high executive salaries or over staffed management team. I want what is fair and due
to us for all the concessions and horrible treatment over the years from the top down to frontline sups.

I understand families are hurting. I'm hurting. I think it is worth the fight. We are worth it.

Did I get my message across?

 

[paul1]

whats top out now for cal vs ual

 

[whoop whoop]

Dissapointing, to say the least. Once again mechanics quiver while the FA's take a stand.
I guess they figure they will get another shot when the merger takes place.

I couldn't agree with you more. But I lay most of the blame on the ibt. It is two fold. First, if they had any respect for this profession, they would of never brought this garbage back for a vote. Second, they were selling this P.O.S. harder than the company was. Saying things like, the company will not give any more, it's only a two year contract, they will put us on the back burner if we turn this down, and the best is, this something to build on so we can get them next time. LOL, all quotes from the ibt.

 

[whoop whoop]

whats top out now for cal vs ual

As of date of signing a 12 year day shift mechanic is at $35.22/hr. July 1 2012 we will be at $36.92/hr. The sad part is AMFA was able to convince a judge seven years ago that mechanics were worth more at UAL. The ibt has done nothing but bring us down over the last decade.
I don't know what UAL is at. If you go to www.cal-ualmechanics.com, they have an up to date pay chart of most American carriers.

 

[Bob Owens]

I couldn't agree with you more. But I lay most of the blame on the ibt. It is two fold. First, if they had any respect for this profession, they would of never brought this garbage back for a vote. Second, they were selling this P.O.S. harder than the company was. Saying things like, the company will not give any more, it's only a two year contract, they will put us on the back burner if we turn this down, and the best is, this something to build on so we can get them next time. LOL, all quotes from the ibt.

Sadly I admit, I was hoping to ride on your coat-tails brother.

AA mechs have been industry leaders in concessions for decades and your agreement is better than the current agreement there and the TA that was rejected.


Go to www.union-reports.dol.gov and find out what the guys who sold this get paid. Look up the LM-2 filing. You may want to enquire what type of pass they get when they fly. While the RLA mandates free travel on the carrier for negotiations some airlines give top union officials positive space first class seats. Sometimes I think that Union leaders get too comfortable on their union paid salary & benifits and forget what it was like to live under a union negotiated concessionary contract. Its sad to see how successful the airlines have been at lowering our expectations and how little our Unions have done to raise them. How do they rationalize telling UPS that $46.99 is not enough for the A&Ps in EWR while telling A&Ps at CAL, on the other side of the same Airport, that $36.92 is good enough?

Its not unreasonable for workers who have consistantly increased productivity to see their standards of living at the very least "maintained".



Good luck and start building the strike fund for 2012. Since 2002 the FAA has only issued around 6000 new certificates per year, thats probably at the most 3000 new A&Ps a year. AA alone loses around 500'year through attrition. A&P demand is not confined to the airline industry and MROs are already reporting difficulty filling positions, and thats with 15 million people out of work!! AA just lowered the experience requirement for Line Maintenance to ZERO years experience, get your A&P and you can start fixing airplanes and working live trips tomorrow. The shortage is here, sure we may be in a better postion in 2012 but we will also have lost two more years of our lives working at substandard wages (your contract leaves you around $10/hr underpaid and the 2.5% increases will leave you lagging inflation( inflation averages 3% per year).

With the Republican sweep of Congress we can look forward to at least two things from our Government that would mitigate our ability to capitalize on the shortage.
1. Less oversight of Foreign Maintenance-more mechanics jobs shipped overseas
2. FAR 66 to resurface, this would let the airlines certify their own mechanics, so instead of us holding our portable FAA license airlines would issue their own, non-portable but equivelent certificates. It was shelved around 10 years ago but its not dead.

Republicans will cite the shortage itself as a reason for this, "These are jobs American dont want" they will claim. They will claim that if they dont change the system (more outsourcing and company issued certs) that our aviation infastructure will fail (just like they claim that if we didnt let illegals come in and harvest our food for slave wages we would starve), the fact is that its the wage that is causing the shortage not the work.