Big Bash In Stl Tonight

[rampguy]

Rampguy must still have a job...

Yes, I am employed but just came off the street. Quit being a dip ----. My post was about employee to employee. BTW, I felt this way on my out the door and while I was on the street.

 

[twaokc]

Yes, I am employed but just came off the street. Quit being a dip ----. My post was about employee to employee. BTW, I felt this way on my out the door and while I was on the street.

Mike, that is great news. Glad you are back.
Carl

 

[extwacaptain]

Rampguy, (Mike)

Please add our WELCOME, to your return......GREAT NEWS!!!

Our best for your future,

Randy and Sally Kramer

 

[rampguy]

Thanks Carl and you also Capt & Sally. I thought it was good news too. lol

 

[Skyyggoddess]

Operations, I would like to extend a formal invitation to you and yours, how about parking lot attendant?

This is really sad.
I went without a paycheck (on an overage leave) for over a year and a half so that someone less fortunate than me would have a job. Because of my seniority, I always knew the person that was still flying was a TWA F/A. And before anyone makes the snide comment that they hoped I enjoyed my time off; you have no idea what I was doing with my time off, but I can guarantee you that I would have rather been flying.

One day I hope all of the furloughs are back, but comments like these will make it impossible to ever mend any fences and have decent working conditions. You have done more damage to TWA people with this comment than you may realize.

What I don't understand is why no one at TWA knew the reputation of AAL officers and management. Hasn't anyone been reading the paper the last 10 years? We've had horrible management/labor relations. No one with more than a few months of seniority trusts AAL management. Most of management would slit your throat for a dime...we all know that. Why didn't your labor unions do their homework and prepare you for this? Do you even know why the AAL F/A's went on strike in "93? Its because once again a promise by management was broken. We (the F/A's) gave in the lean times, were promised that it would be made up when times were better. That promise was broken at least through two contracts that I can think of. Why didn't you know that AMR couldn't be trusted, its been well documented?

 

[MCI transplant]

Skygoddess----- You're absolutly correct! We all have to get on with our lifes! But under the circumstances, not an easy thing to do! Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that ALL TWA Hosteses were now on the street! As for us knowing what we were getting into! Sorry! But we as employees had no say in this "Buy out"!!!!! None, Nada!!!!

 

[FibberMcGee]

This is really sad.
I went without a paycheck (on an overage leave) for over a year and a half so that someone less fortunate than me would have a job. Because of my seniority, I always knew the person that was still flying was a TWA F/A. And before anyone makes the snide comment that they hoped I enjoyed my time off; you have no idea what I was doing with my time off, but I can guarantee you that I would have rather been flying.

One day I hope all of the furloughs are back, but comments like these will make it impossible to ever mend any fences and have decent working conditions. You have done more damage to TWA people with this comment than you may realize.

What I don't understand is why no one at TWA knew the reputation of AAL officers and management. Hasn't anyone been reading the paper the last 10 years? We've had horrible management/labor relations. No one with more than a few months of seniority trusts AAL management. Most of management would slit your throat for a dime...we all know that. Why didn't your labor unions do their homework and prepare you for this? Do you even know why the AAL F/A's went on strike in "93? Its because once again a promise by management was broken. We (the F/A's) gave in the lean times, were promised that it would be made up when times were better. That promise was broken at least through two contracts that I can think of. Why didn't you know that AMR couldn't be trusted, its been well documented?

SkyGoddess. That is part of the problem. You think one comment is from ALL TWA people. We can be as guilty of that as well. I tried (when I had a job) and did get along with everybody although it wasn't always returned in kind. I also spoke up for naatives when I thought they were getting the raw deal from anyone. I do remember the stike of '93 but no, I didn't know that was the reason. I do remember helping out the strikers at our airport though, but maybe you didn't know that. Did you read the papers about TWA in the past 10 years? You may have read some stories but did you really understand what was going on. Did you read about WN, NW, HP etc? If it doesn't truly involve you then very few people know what is going on at another company. In mid-October, long after any TWA f/a was working I had several f/a s and flight deck crew make snide remarks to me but I let it go. I was amazed at how many didn't even know the consequences of the STL pull down or that it was even taking place! Your altruism is noted but in my mind there are people still working at my job at my airport doing what I did without calling in sick, working holidays and nights and weekends,that have 2 years seniority but I don't blame them-they didn't make the decisions.
This whole topic started with a snide comment that was untrue and didn't happen. I for one, and I know I'm not alone, had a great time seeing old friends not seen for many years. It was also a time to say goodbye to a lot a great people that we will never see again. Believe it or not, I am grateful for the two more years I had with an airline. I have tried many times on this forum to be consiliatory but to little avail. I have seen more of this world because of TWA/AA than most people see in 7 lifetimes and that is what I will focus on. I refuse to be bitter. I'll be back in the business as soon as possible-maybe not with AA but another airline to be sure because I love the job and the travel. And as far as giving in the lean times-----TWA employees wrote the book on that one. Good luck to all especially the laid off professionals both AA and TWA.

 

[DFWCC]

I have to beleive most of the anger is and as it should be, directed towards AA senior mngt. I spent 2mos in STL as part of the AA/TWA transition team. I was one of about 70 CC that came to STL to help TWA leads convert to the AA DECS/RES load plan system. The 1st week there were some raised eyebrows, of course, understandable. After a few days, they realized, " hey I didn't make the rules here, let's just get to-gether as a team and do the best we can."
I really got to know these hard working people. I was amazed what they did with what they had. I felt we were all bag busters the only difference was the color of our shirts. I made some good freinds.
I know there were alot of happy faces when in January they received in most cases a $6/hr raise. Life seemed good.
I am truely sorry for what has happened. I think 9-11 had more top do with AA problems than anything else. Remember it was AA's senior mngt who pulled the plug on STL. There are many good people out of work. Careers and retirements ruined for both TWA and AA. Here at DFW we still have people on layoff.
To All of us good luck and GOD BLESS

 

[Skyyggoddess]

Fibber & DFWCC, I really appreciate your replies. You are both right. People are individuals and you can't judge a whole group by the comments of a few.
I think the statement about 9-11 is probably true. We would not be in this terrible shape if it weren't for that horrible day. I have read a good portion of the late SEC filing by Carty and it appears that AMR was in financial trouble going back to 2000; but the devestation was surely on that day and when 587 was lost.
My best to you both.
Terry

 

[rampguy]

I have to beleive most of the anger is and as it should be, directed towards AA senior mngt. I spent 2mos in STL as part of the AA/TWA transition team. I was one of about 70 CC that came to STL to help TWA leads convert to the AA DECS/RES load plan system. The 1st week there were some raised eyebrows, of course, understandable. After a few days, they realized, " hey I didn't make the rules here, let's just get to-gether as a team and do the best we can."
I really got to know these hard working people. I was amazed what they did with what they had. I felt we were all bag busters the only difference was the color of our shirts. I made some good freinds.
I know there were alot of happy faces when in January they received in most cases a $6/hr raise. Life seemed good.
I am truely sorry for what has happened. I think 9-11 had more top do with AA problems than anything else. Remember it was AA's senior mngt who pulled the plug on STL. There are many good people out of work. Careers and retirements ruined for both TWA and AA. Here at DFW we still have people on layoff.
To All of us good luck and GOD BLESS

DFWCC, Excellent post. We long time TWA people always touted TWA as a class airline with class employees (as I am sure the same is true with AA) but the behavior from just a few show something less than class. They have sold their pride and dignity for the chance to throw a few arrows at others. I totally agree the anger should be directed at AA mgmnt.

 

[FibberMcGee]

DFWCC, Excellent post. We long time TWA people always touted TWA as a class airline with class employees (as I am sure the same is true with AA) but the behavior from just a few show something less than class. They have sold their pride and dignity for the chance to throw a few arrows at others. I totally agree the anger should be directed at AA mgmnt.

I certainly hope you weren't referring to my post above as classless and throwing arrows. If so, you should try reading some of my posts all the way back. I have stuck up for TWA of course but I don't believe I ever ran AA down, nor would I.

 

[rampguy]

DFWCC, Excellent post. We long time TWA people always touted TWA as a class airline with class employees (as I am sure the same is true with AA) but the behavior from just a few show something less than class. They have sold their pride and dignity for the chance to throw a few arrows at others. I totally agree the anger should be directed at AA mgmnt.

I certainly hope you weren't referring to my post above as classless and throwing arrows. If so, you should try reading some of my posts all the way back. I have stuck up for TWA of course but I don't believe I ever ran AA down, nor would I.

No Fibber, I wasn't referring to you. I wasn't referring to any 1 specific person and I never had you in mind while making my post. I am referring to those that think they need to attack others that had nothing to do with theirs or my demise.
Yes, I do think that the TWA employees weren't treated fairly but to slam all native employees as something less than they is as low and classless as you can get. The two things NO ONE can take from me is my pride and dignity and that is what they lose when they resort such. When I got my layoff papers, I walked out the door shaking hands with my new but short time co-workers. They wished me well and I did the same.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

This is really sad.
I went without a paycheck (on an overage leave) for over a year and a half so that someone less fortunate than me would have a job. Because of my seniority, I always knew the person that was still flying was a TWA F/A. And before anyone makes the snide comment that they hoped I enjoyed my time off; you have no idea what I was doing with my time off, but I can guarantee you that I would have rather been flying.

One day I hope all of the furloughs are back, but comments like these will make it impossible to ever mend any fences and have decent working conditions. You have done more damage to TWA people with this comment than you may realize.

What I don't understand is why no one at TWA knew the reputation of AAL officers and management. Hasn't anyone been reading the paper the last 10 years? We've had horrible management/labor relations. No one with more than a few months of seniority trusts AAL management. Most of management would slit your throat for a dime...we all know that. Why didn't your labor unions do their homework and prepare you for this? Do you even know why the AAL F/A's went on strike in "93? Its because once again a promise by management was broken. We (the F/A's) gave in the lean times, were promised that it would be made up when times were better. That promise was broken at least through two contracts that I can think of. Why didn't you know that AMR couldn't be trusted, its been well documented?

skygoddess;
Terry, as usual, your right.(about AA management)

Speaking about nAAtives, AA management has for many, many years , treated it's employees, just like the Federal Government treated NATIVE Americans in this country. Many broken promises(treaties), lies and deception !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

3 things I can say about TWAers,


3.

EVERY Twa/er that I came in contact with, at my station, (and a few are thankfully still working), WERE/ARE CLASSY,TOP NOTCH PEOPLE, (who on their worst day, were 10 times the UNION people, that over half of the "phoney" so called (AA) union people ARE)

2.

I'm proud to say that I conducted(on these boards)(US aviation, and Plane business), a very "lonely" campaign, that ALL of TWA union folks, should get a RATIO, in terms of occ. seniority integration.

And,

"1".

(WITHOUT QUESTION), THE 2 people, who I've had/still have the EXTREME pleasure of meeting on these boards, Who "Wrote the book on CLASS", are former TWA/ers,

(Captain) Randy, and Sally Kramer !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Best wishes to all TWA/ers.

NH/BB's

 

[LiveInAHotel]

Ok, this party is over!

 

[extwacaptain]

Bears,

Aw, shucks! You’re right about Sally having “CLASSâ€, but when you meet guys like Rampguy, you’ll “throw rocks†at me. I believe the two of you, alone, could have integrated our employee groups with results far more desirable than the present situation.

Your voice in the past suggesting a RATIO was indeed lonely on these message boards, and your words were like the friendly signals from a lighthouse on a stormy night at sea and will forever be remembered.

Know that your courage and willingness to “stand almost alone†for a just cause (fairness to both groups) will always be admired and appreciated.


Respectfully,
Randy & Sally Kramer

p.s.
Someone just mentioned “this party’s overâ€, but we could not leave without expressing our thanks.