Aa Cash Cow - Concessions For What?

[RV4]

As I visit websites for information, it occurs to me that we are watching an ugly re-run in the making.

The concessions of the 1980's at AA funded the build-up of Sabre, which was eventually completely "spun-off" from the airline.

It appears today's concessions are funding the "build-up" of American Eagle.

What will AA do with Eagle once the "cash cow" (AA) has funded the expansion of this seperate business (Eagle) with concessions from the employees of the "cash cow"?

According to this website
http://www.thenewfoundlandgroup.com/gpage9.html.html

Eagle has 170 Aircraft on Order and 193 Aircraft on Option.


Just look at the Regional Jet Orders and Options listed on the screen capture below:

WHY DOES THE AA EMPLOYEE CONTINUE TO FUND SEPERATE COMPANY EXPANSION WITH PAY AND BENEFIT CUTS?

To the AA Mechanic:

Who is doing the maintenance on the regional jets your concessions are purchasing?

 

[will fix for food]

As I visit websites for information, it occurs to me that we are watching an ugly re-run in the making.

The concessions of the 1980's at AA funded the build-up of Sabre, which was eventually completely "spun-off" from the airline.

It appears today's concessions are funding the "build-up" of American Eagle.

What will AA do with Eagle once the "cash cow" (AA) has funded the expansion of this seperate business (Eagle) with concessions from the employees of the "cash cow"?

According to this website
http://www.thenewfoundlandgroup.com/gpage9.html.html

Eagle has 170 Aircraft on Order and 193 Aircraft on Option.


Just look at the Regional Jet Orders and Options listed on the screen capture below:

WHY DOES THE AA EMPLOYEE CONTINUE TO FUND SEPERATE COMPANY EXPANSION WITH PAY AND BENEFIT CUTS?

To the AA Mechanic:

Who is doing the maintenance on the regional jets your concessions are purchasing?

Only one problem with your theory Dave, Eagle is carrying that financing debt on IT'S balance sheet, not American's. Bowler made a presentation to our negotiating committee that Eagle can't afford to give us a raise because AMERICAN EAGLE has a multi-billion dollar debt from new aircraft financing. Sorry, but your concessions are going to clean up your own mess, i.e. , the underfunded pension and whatever else. In fact, rumor is, Eagle is being spun off in part to pay for your pension. Nice huh? They "can't afford" to pay us but they are willing to sell part of Eagle to drum up some cash to pay for YOUR pension.


You can thank us later.


American the "Cash cow"? Which airline was the one that has been turning profits for the last year? In fact, according to the new fee-per-departure agreement American pays Eagle operating costs plus 8% per flight. Eagle has been operating 10% over BELF for the last quarter reported to the DOT. Who gets the gravy? You do. But I do thank you for giving us the 8%. That is more than they intended on giving us earlier this year. They actually tried to give ALL of Eagle's revenue to American and just reimbursed us for operating expenses. Unfortunatly Eagle's expenses came in lower than planned so we still made money.


Sorry about that, we'll cut you back a check.


Who is doing the maintenance on (American Eagle's) regional jets? Well that would be American Eagle mechanics. American Eagle mechanics work on American Eagle planes owned by American Eagle Holdings. You have as much claim on those planes as I do on the 777 fleet. Which is none. But, since your such a nice guy, we will offer you the same deal that you offered us. For every four open positions at Eagle, an American mechanic can have one of them. (If you pass the interview and physical) You will of course lose all seniority (except Company seniority) and go to the bottom of the pay scale and to the top of the furlough list. What a deal huh? And before you go blaming that abortion on the TWU (although they surely orchestrated it) when times were good for old A/A I don't remember ever hearing one rank and file American mechanic calling for an equitable flow thru-flow back provision...ever. And that includes reading probably two thousand of your personal posts on various websites. But now that things are a little different over on the sunny side of the ramp the tune has changed. Very nice.

 

[RV4]

SO if AMR had filed for Bankruptcy Protection, your airline would have been sperated out and treated differently?

Hmmm, I got some swamp land in Arizona, you interested?

 

[will fix for food]

SO if AMR had filed for Bankruptcy Protection, your airline would have been sperated out and treated differently?

I'm not sure what your point is. Care to elaborate?

 

[RV4]

SO if AMR had filed for Bankruptcy Protection, your airline would have been sperated out and treated differently?

I'm not sure what your point is. Care to elaborate?

My point is that you appear to take a position that somehow Eagle having a seperate profit/loss sheet somehow makes you immune to a doomed Corporation.

As for your claim that AA emlpoyee somehow owes Eagle employee something, take alook at the upper management structure and see who is funding who.

Eagle has very little upper managment overhead because these positions within AMR are listed on the AA profit/loss sheet.

It must be nice to run a company where another company pays for all the legal/flight/HR/Communications/Website/Customer Service ect. VP positions for you? Of course you have been more profitable, AA pays for all your overpaid overhead positions.

Just look and compare AA to Eagle Top Heavy Managment Teams - Eagle is charged with (3) Three, AA has the rest of the gurus.

http://www.amrcorp.com/corpinfo.htm

 

[will fix for food]

SO if AMR had filed for Bankruptcy Protection, your airline would have been sperated out and treated differently?

I'm not sure what your point is. Care to elaborate?

My point is that you appear to take a position that somehow Eagle having a seperate profit/loss sheet somehow makes you immune to a doomed Corporation.

As for your claim that AA emlpoyee somehow owes Eagle employee something, take alook at the upper management structure and see who is funding who.

Eagle has very little upper managment overhead because these positions within AMR are listed on the AA profit/loss sheet.

It must be nice to run a company where another company pays for all the legal/flight/HR/Communications/Website/Customer Service ect. VP positions for you? Of course you have been more profitable, AA pays for all your overpaid overhead positions.

Just look and compare AA to Eagle Top Heavy Managment Teams - Eagle is charged with (3) Three, AA has the rest of the gurus.

http://www.amrcorp.com/corpinfo.htm

"My point is that you appear to take a position that somehow Eagle having a seperate profit/loss sheet somehow makes you immune to a doomed Corporation."


Immune to a doomed corporation? Where did that come from? I was responding to your allegation that your pay give backs were paying for Eagle planes. That is simply wrong. MY pay, or lack of it, has been financing Eagle's aircraft acquisitions, and will continue to do so if the Company has it's way.


"As for your claim that AA emlpoyee somehow owes Eagle employee something, take alook at the upper management structure and see who is funding who."


Again, I don't know where you got that from. I don't think American employees owe Eagle employees anything. But by the same token I don't think we owe you anything either, especially our aircraft. Early on it was drilled into our heads that we were separate Companies, both by management and by the treatment we get from A/A employees. And that's OK with us.


"Eagle has very little upper managment overhead because these positions within AMR are listed on the AA profit/loss sheet."

"It must be nice to run a company where another company pays for all the legal/flight/HR/Communications/Website/Customer Service ect. VP positions for you? Of course you have been more profitable, AA pays for all your overpaid overhead positions.

"Just look and compare AA to Eagle Top Heavy Managment Teams - Eagle is charged with (3) Three, AA has the rest of the gurus."


I think you are really reaching if you think that the difference between profit and loss for Eagle and/or American is the fact that the V.P. of H.R. and the rest are paid by American. If it makes you feel any better, I am 99% sure that American charges Eagle for every service it provides for us. Including, I am assuming, a little extra to pay for the V.P.'s.

As an example, I remember reading a detailed bill from A/A that I happened to come across and they charged us for everything down to the last package of paper clips. I doubt that has changed.

However.... I have no proof that this is still the practice. If you can show me where American provides services to Eagle gratis, I would be interested in seeing what they were.

I will be waiting for your documentation.

 

[jetdryvr]

AE does pay for every service, inventory, gate use ect that we use or get from AA. We pay for sabre access, releases, and even for space in the terminal. Which everone of you stated that AAers have always stressed we are not the same company is correct. That was until now when it seems they all want part of Eagle with nothing in return.

 

[will fix for food]

You are strangely and uncharacteristically quiet Dave....still working on that documentation to back up your statements?

BTW, since you have repeatedly made the point that American mechanics should work on the RJ's it occured to me there is a way you could do just that.

Apparently AMR offered to move the CRJ's to American's certificate if it will be cost neutral. All you have to do to capture that flying(which I believe will be the growth segment after the F100 retirement) is to prove to the Company it will be cost neutral.

To do this, all you have to do is:

1. Take more pay/benefit cuts to bring your labor costs in line with Eagle's.

2. Get all the other work groups to do the same.

Easy huh?

 

[RV4]

Yeah, AA employees take the pay and benefit cuts, and Eagle capacity gorws 14.3 percent. Who is funding who?

American Eagle Airlines Reports September Traffic
Thursday October 2, 1:19 pm ET


FORT WORTH, Texas, Oct. 2 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- American Eagle Airlines today reported systemwide traffic for September increased 19.1 percent from September 2002, on a capacity increase of 14.3 percent. System load factor was 60.1 percent, up 2.4 points year over year.
American Eagle boarded 1.1 million passengers in September, up 6.8 percent from September 2002.

American Eagle is the largest regional airline, operating over 1,300 daily flights to more than 130 cities throughout the United States, Canada, the Bahamas, Mexico and the Caribbean on behalf of American Airlines. American Airlines is the world's largest carrier. Together, American, American Eagle and the AmericanConnection® regional carriers serve nearly 275 cities in 50 countries and territories with approximately 4,300 daily flights. The combined network fleet numbers more than 1,000 aircraft. American's award- winning Web site, AA.com, provides users with easy access to check and book fares, plus personalized news, information and travel offers. American Airlines is a founding member of the oneworld Alliance.

 

[will fix for food]

Yeah, AA employees take the pay and benefit cuts, and Eagle capacity gorws 14.3 percent. Who is funding who?

I don/t know, who is funding who? Eagle pays for it's own planes, pays American for services rendered, gives American all onboard revenue minus cost plus 8% when Eagle onboard revenue appears to be above cost plus 8%.....yea.....that is a good question...who is funding who?


Dave Stewart=Box of rocks


BTW, Eagle's capacity was growing long before you took any concessions. How do you explain that?

 

[jetdryvr]

your aircraft counts are wrong. I will try and get the latest link. Your concessions are not funding AE we are the only profitable unit. In the past it was AE profit donating to your profit sharing check that we did not see. If we have it so great at AE come on down and work here.

 

[jetdryvr]

AIRCRAFT FLEET PROJECTION--- [active airplanes net of operational spares maintenance]
JUL’03 DEC’03 MAR’04 JUL’04 DEC’04

SAAB 38 28 28 28 28

ATR 42 10 10 9 5 0

ATR 72 35 35 34 35 34

ERJ 145 43 47 54 67 82

ERJ 140 50 55 55 55 53

ERJ 135 37 37 37 37 37

CRJ 700 11 17 19 23 24