nycbusdriver
Veteran
So what? I have no problem letting the machine do the work. You probably have to get out and hand-crank the engine of your car, too.
A350 Entry into Service Pushed Back 6-Months
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So what? I have no problem letting the machine do the work. You probably have to get out and hand-crank the engine of your car, too.
nycbusdriver
Veteran
That was an A300, I believe. I don't think we fly those, and I believe the technology is either different, or the problem has been addressed. The F/O used procedures that Airbus specifically warned against (but American used in their training.)
Are you at all concerned with the hard-over rudder engineering flaw that cause the Boeing 737 to crash while arriving near Pittsburgh?
USAir Flt 427
BoeingBoy
Veteran
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Since I said nothing about that, good deflection. Just a philosophical design difference. Airbus doesn't want pilots to fly their pretty airplane - pilots might mess it up. Boeing believes a pretty airplane milliseconds before impact looks the same in the smoking hole, so lets the pilot try anything and everything to prevent the smoking hole.
Jim
Have you ever flown an Airbus?
Absolutely.
Your turn to actually answer the question: Have you ever flown an Airbus?
I used to be a member of the "If it's not Boeing, I'm not going" crowd. I went to the Airbus from the 75/76 kicking and screaming. It took a few months, but after I stopped fighting it, I came to accept it was a pretty good aircraft. Not perfect, but good.
Now, if I was given a wish list of A/C that I have flown, and to take out and fly for fun it would go like this:
767
757
727
737-200
737-300
737-400
F100
F28
A320 series
E190
Same A/C, but not for fun but to earn a living in:
A320 series
767
757
737-400
737-300
727
737-200
E190
F100/F28(toss up-F28 was more reliable, F100 better cockpit)
BoeingBoy
Veteran
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Either you don't know your airplane or you've been in a very bad situation if you got down to direct law.
You know the answer to that - nope, and never wanted to. I don't like the thought of a software engineer telling me what I can or can't do if push comes to shove. Foolish me - I consider a bent airplane that doesn't produce a crater better than an airworthy airplane that makes a big hole.
Jim
Reed Richards
Veteran
- Sep 2, 2009
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Good logic on the distinction between fun and going to work every day. Common thread for most of us is the overall love for the 75/76..I could go on and on. But as to the best office in the sky, so to speak, I never want to leave the AB. Just a very nice place to go to work every week, day in and day out. I have nothing remarkable to say about the 737 of any type of the three I have flown, and would put it at the bottom of both lists. And at the top of a third list..the aircraft I never want to spend another summer in is indeed a US Airways 737 of any kind.
Jim, there is no way to change your thought process about "flying" the Boeing vs. "not flying" the AB since you already seem to have flown both. But quite honestly, after a few years, they differ only slightly. I especially like the escape maneuver in the AB..just pull back and let the plane do its best (and not starting an argument here, I understand there are parameters that might let you do more in a Boeing..just not as consistently in a time of trouble.)
My favorite will always be the 757, the only aircraft that looked like it was already flying on the ground, and impressed daily as it could fly and stop with the best of them.
Good discussion. To all those senior to me, the AB sucks, and the school is hell..don't do it!
RR
lynyrdskynyrd
Veteran
- Apr 22, 2005
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My thoughts exactly. My background is AWA, and so far LCC is no different. A crisis every couple years. A brief window of tranquility followed by all hell breaking loose.
BoeingBoy
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I'd never even attempt to argue that the 737 was as/more comfortable than the Airbus. But if comfort was my career selection criteria I'd have chosen a 9-5 job in a corner office. I'm strictly talking about being a pilot instead of a programmer. I like being a pilot. The pleasure of doing it right, not watching the airplane do it right. And like I said, if push comes to shove I don't want any "Sorry Dave, I can't let you do that"...
Actually, I think that this might be the difference:
From the time I got in the right seat to the day I flew my last flight, the flying was fun. I always looked forward to the flying, usually more the worse conditions got. Whether landing at BUF with the winds gusting to 55 kts or at DCA with 2" of snow on the runway or working out a continuous idle descent from cruise to 1000' on final - the more challenging the better.
I guess some just look at it differently - just another job to slog through to reach the payoff every other week. If the job can be offloaded to a computer so much the better...
Jim
Actually, I think that this might be the difference:
From the time I got in the right seat to the day I flew my last flight, the flying was fun. I always looked forward to the flying, usually more the worse conditions got. Whether landing at BUF with the winds gusting to 55 kts or at DCA with 2" of snow on the runway or working out a continuous idle descent from cruise to 1000' on final - the more challenging the better.
I guess some just look at it differently - just another job to slog through to reach the payoff every other week. If the job can be offloaded to a computer so much the better...
Jim
Believe it or not, the Airbus Autopilot and Autothrust CAN be disconnected. In normal law, you do basically have CWS (control wheel steering), but you
can still get some enjoyment from flying the airplane. Most modern aircraft are "fly by fluid" anyway with hydraulics, you are not actually moving the control surface through the yoke. Unless you are in a DC-9 or MD-80, two other very fun airplanes not mentioned on the lists.
can still get some enjoyment from flying the airplane. Most modern aircraft are "fly by fluid" anyway with hydraulics, you are not actually moving the control surface through the yoke. Unless you are in a DC-9 or MD-80, two other very fun airplanes not mentioned on the lists.
yoyodyne
Veteran
yup, like airbii can do this:
or this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GyCy__CGUP4
and..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEoDW6t0SWE
or this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GyCy__CGUP4
and..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEoDW6t0SWE
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- #29
BoeingBoy
Veteran
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True, but the control surface movement is still controlled by the yoke movement (up to the stops) with non-fly-by-wire planes (or Boeing fly-by-wire). You may be porting a hydraulic valve but you decide how much. Unlike the Airbus, which even in the scenario you present still has the computers taking your commands and deciding 1 - whether they are in the limits provided by the software and 2 - what is needed to implement them. It's the computers deciding whether you should be allowed to do something that is the difference.
It's a philosophical difference between Airbus and Boeing. Airbus designs an airplane's controls to protect the plane from the pilots, Boeing lets the pilots have the final say (even in their fly-by-wire planes). So in a worst case, an Airbus won't have overstressed wings or whatever when it crashes while Boeing lets the pilots do whatever they want - bend the wings, whatever - in a last ditch effort to prevent the crash.
Jim
