A330 Pitot Tubes

[ussnark]

I had read that the same Air France flight had been the subject of a bomb scare five weeks earlier. The only reason I mention that is the fact that this aircraft was lost outside of the range of any radar and any VHF communication. **If** a flight were to be so targeted then the timing would be optimal when it is so located.

It won't make any difference to the victims what the cause was, but for the rest of us I hope that it can be attributed to weather or some other mechanical fault. Heck, even pilot error would be a preferable cause compared to a bombing.

The truth would be nice.

 

[nycbusdriver]

I had read that the same Air France flight had been the subject of a bomb scare five weeks earlier. The only reason I mention that is the fact that this aircraft was lost outside of the range of any radar and any VHF communication. **If** a flight were to be so targeted then the timing would be optimal when it is so located.

It won't make any difference to the victims what the cause was, but for the rest of us I hope that it can be attributed to weather or some other mechanical fault. Heck, even pilot error would be a preferable cause compared to a bombing.

I tend to discount terrorism, i.e. a bomb, because no one has claimed credit. It would be impossible for a terrorist organization to refrain from boasting about any "victory" over their perceived oppressors. Terrorism is mostly about the publicity meant to instill fear.

 

[A320 Driver]

I tend to discount terrorism, i.e. a bomb, because no one has claimed credit. It would be impossible for a terrorist organization to refrain from boasting about any "victory" over their perceived oppressors. Terrorism is mostly about the publicity meant to instill fear.

Agreed

 

[28L_or_10R?]

I have a grand idea that I should patent. In addition to black boxes, flight data should be sent digitally via satellite and/or HF radio to a centralized data storage location. In Switzerland, perhaps. That way, they would not have to find a black box which may be 15,000 feet into Davy Jones' locker. The data they need would be right there where they can access it from anywhere in the world. Is this a new idea or has it been thunk up already?

 

[hp_fa]

I wonder how much bandwidth that would require? Also I suspect that they would use that as an alternate way instead of the primary since losing the transmitter would cause all the data to be lost. But, it is an interesting idea.

 

[28L_or_10R?]

I wonder how much bandwidth that would require? Also I suspect that they would use that as an alternate way instead of the primary since losing the transmitter would cause all the data to be lost. But, it is an interesting idea.

There's no video so the bandwidth shouldn't be a big problem with satellite. We transmitted low-speed digital data and teletype with HF in the service but things have probably improved much since then. IIRC, the space shuttles use a system like this. Don't think they even have a flight data recorder.

 

[Dog Wonder]

Do you want to save lives, or make money?

 

[28L_or_10R?]

Do you want to save lives, or make money?

Both.

 

[OTslave]

From Bloomberg.com

US Airways, Aer Lingus Replace Airbus A330 Sensors (Update1)
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By Mary Schlangenstein and Laurence Frost

June 8 (Bloomberg) -- US Airways Group Inc., the smallest U.S. full-fare carrier, and Aer Lingus Group Plc are replacing air-speed sensors on Airbus SAS A330s similar to equipment on an Air France jet that crashed off the coast of Brazil.

US Airways began changing out the sensors made by Thales SA “out of an abundance of cautionâ€￾ on the nine A330s it flies, Morgan Durrant, a spokesman for the Tempe, Arizona-based airline, said yesterday in an e-mail.

 

[nycbusdriver]

I have a grand idea that I should patent. In addition to black boxes, flight data should be sent digitally via satellite and/or HF radio to a centralized data storage location. In Switzerland, perhaps. That way, they would not have to find a black box which may be 15,000 feet into Davy Jones' locker. The data they need would be right there where they can access it from anywhere in the world. Is this a new idea or has it been thunk up already?

That is a good idea. The satellite feed would suit the purpose, but HF feed of the data is a joke. The HF ACARS on the few ETOPS 757s is a joke. The "HF Datalink Lost" on the ECAM might as well be etched into the glass. It's almost always there. It is 99.5% unreliable. It only works when you don't need it.

 

[hp_fa]

There's no video so the bandwidth shouldn't be a big problem with satellite. We transmitted low-speed digital data and teletype with HF in the service but things have probably improved much since then. IIRC, the space shuttles use a system like this. Don't think they even have a flight data recorder.

The space shuttle uses TDRSS, the Tracking and Data Relay Satellite System, which is a dedicated solution to shuttle communications. So the shuttle analogy isn't fully applicable as of now, although the idea is fine.

Is there a way that such a system, as proposed, could rely exclusively on satcoms? If HF is the same beast that I knew when I was in the military years ago it is, as NYCBusdriver observes, unreliable for the job.

As Dog Wonder correctly points out, the objective is safety. However it needs to be a system that doesn't cause bean counters in some cubicle to suggest dumping it as a way to save money. Such thinking would, of course, lead to Piney Bob's premise of "penny smart, pound foolish."

 

[N965VJ]

The bandwidth cost would be prohibitive to stream CVR/FDR data on a continuous basis to a ground station.

 

[hp_fa]

I imagine ALPA, APA, USAPA and any other pilots' unions would have real issues with the idea of a constantly monitored FDR. I was thinking only in terms of the CVR, but that alone is probably post prohibitive correct?

 

[nycbusdriver]

The bandwidth cost would be prohibitive to stream CVR/FDR data on a continuous basis to a ground station.

That's probably true, but it might certainly be worthwhile to send packet updates of the primary information every 5 or 10 seconds, with a continuous stream whenever the first parameter goes outside normal.

As far as hp_fa's concern about the bean counters: This would only work if it was a mandated regulatory requirement. Companies would attached engines with bailing wire if the regulations did not require them to do otherwise. Few carriers (maybe Singapore, Emirates, or other top tier) would take on something like this voluntarily. The industry would comply, kicking and screaming, only under mandatory order.

 

[28L_or_10R?]

I imagine ALPA, APA, USAPA and any other pilots' unions would have real issues with the idea of a constantly monitored FDR. I was thinking only in terms of the CVR, but that alone is probably post prohibitive correct?

My opinion should be that the data would be stored by a neutral institution in Switzerland. The data could only be accessed if there is a crash or incident. When does a flight recorder erase its data? Every flight? The storage institution would do the same.