A Noreaster Is Coming Are We Ready?

[tadjr]

Just another fiasco under our belt then. I guess the answer to the original question then was a resounding NO!
The more things supposedly change, the more they stay the same. And who ISNT going to take responsibility for this mess today?

BE ADVISED WINTER HAS ARRIVED SOMEONE BETTER STEP UP QUICK AND GET PHL STRAIGHTENED OUT WITH DEICING OR ITS GOING TO BE A LONG WINTER!!!

 

[PITbull]

Odd though, to hear about the delays in PHL and some in CLT too.....NOT!

In PHL, crew sked stated that they had no snow that layed, during the daylight; just poor visibility. Cancellations in PHL all day with 4 hour delays etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.

PIT on the other hand had no delays on the board all day. Snowed all day.Layed. The only delays in PIT were flights GOING TO PHL Gee, I wonder what thats about?

 

[lindy]

Tadjr..

From what I know, US Airways was prepared.

Clt had 18 of 19 trucks ready when the storm was approaching them. All overtime had been called and three pads were going to be in operation.

BWI/DCA had all trucks operational and manned.

PIT..since US Airways has the contract to de-ice as well as maintain the pads,
the booms had periodic maintenance thoughout the summer. As PITbull so aptly pointed out, it appears PIT had no problem with de-icing.

Did PHL have ATC/Weather related problems this morning? Yes. Was it compounded by the de-icing event? Yes?

I am no apologist for some of the decisions made by CCY. You, though, want to blame them for every hiccup encountered during the operational day.

Lindy

 

[PITbull]

Lindy,

PIT had no problems with anything today. Period.

Problem with management is they made their "crown Jewel" and mainstay PHL, INSPITE OF ALL THE KNOWNS!

For years PHL has had problems. Same problems. If you "spit" on the runway, there is a delay that is major. Of course, PHL use to be the third largest, busiest base with take offs for U. AND WE MADE MONEY THEN with PIT being the major HUB.

You have the new Einsteins in CCY, who made PHL the #1 jewel and decided to downsize THE WRONG BASE! Mangement compacted the problems that already existed in PHL by ADDING more flights without pressuring the city to improve the runways and traffic.

So, there lies the major problem and BLAME with this management and their idiotic decisions that cause PAX that are forced to go through this Hub headache, lost time, inconvenience, and money.

 

[robbedagain]

May be someone can help me out on this: Whatever flow control is, I believe it needs to be fixed. although we had two commuters cancelled, it would have been a nightmare if they were flying because one which would have departed at around 310am and the other around 526am. Their original departures are normally around 625p and the other around 730p. so basically they would have been at least 7 hrs and nearly 8 hrs delays. I also heard the jets were backed up as well.
what a heck of a "nice hub" phl really makes!

 

[tadjr]

Maybe someone can answer this question today then. Did we plan well enough to get thru the first storm of the season or is it going to be a long winter?

.

Tadjr..

From what I know, US Airways was prepared.

Did PHL have ATC/Weather related problems this morning? Yes. Was it compounded by the de-icing event? Yes?

I am no apologist for some of the decisions made by CCY. You, though, want to blame them for every hiccup encountered during the operational day.

Lindy

With this response from Lindy to another poster "For a person who appears to have the inside scoop on a lot of information, I am surprised you did not mention the following regarding PHL:

1. US Airways does not own the de-icing booms in PHL. The City does. As such, the City is responsible for maintenance. It is my understanding the City did little or no preventative maintenance over the summer.

2. In the late summer/early fall, US Airways approached PHL regarding the de-icing contract. PHL said they were going to put it out for bid. We bid a premium price for the contract because it was in our best interests.

3. It was not until the past week that the City allowed US Airways to take possession of the pads and the ice-house. The PHL Maint De-Ice team put in long hours insuring the equipment was functional. As of late Wednesday, problems were encountered with several booms.

If we had problem with PHL today due to equipment, blame the city for not performing routine maintenance. "

So there is a mixed message here. We were ready, but we werent. Which is it? I didnt know if it was a CCY thing, a PHL thing or an IAM thing, that is what I was trying to find out. If we are going to have PHL as our premiere hub, then it is up to CCY to be sure that everything is in working order. Was it or wasnt it today? Are you in a position to make sure things run smoothly? I know I'm not, that is why we have someone in charge, who just happens to be in CCY, so yes if things such as this go wrong I do blame CCY if it was something that they should have done something about and didnt. If it was a city or airport thing, then CCY needs to make sure it gets corrected so it doesnt happen again (much like the security fiasco in Terminal A). Isnt that what we're paying them for? To make sure the operation runs as smoothly as possible? I am not going to blame CCY for every hiccup in the operational day, as you stated, but something as major as deicing at our premiere hub better be something that they are concerned about. Do you know how many flights were cancelled or delayed today because of the extreme delays taken this morning? This is the difference between a good airline and one thats just getting by. Unfortunately, I dont think that we have the luxury of just getting by right now so yes I will hold CCY accountable when something like this happens until they can show me that is wasnt within their control. Winter wasnt unexpected and I'm just tired of the same old excuses for poor planning each year be it summer thunderstorms, hurricanes or snow. Enough of the excuses. Time to start being proactive in making sure that US can operate when things happen and in my opinion that didnt happen today in PHL. The employees on the front line are busting their butts to keep things running smoothly and if we dont have the support (or foresight) by management to make sure things run as smoothly as possible, then they need to be called on it just like the front liners are called on the things they are responsible for.

PS-Congrats on the rest of the system for being prepared.

 

[Art at ISP]

As I write this from my hotel in Rochester, one of the many affected by the weather today, I'd like to add a word of thanks and appreciation for the agents and the people on the front line.

I was on the 3PM to PHL connecting to the 6PM ISP. I checked in at 1:15, the agent told me of a delay, which at the time was about 40 minutes. My connection was still okay, but he protected me anyway on the 10PM.

I got to the club, and the ladies kept an eye on the situation, keeping me informed of every update. When the 6PM ISP cancelled, followed by the cancellation of the 10PM, they grabbed me a seat on an LGA flight with GT to ISP. After the false hope (a call from ops to load up and get going), both remaining LGA's cancelled as LGA shut down. When I got back to the club, the young lady who had helped me all along told me not to wait on the line, she had already protected me on the 8AM to LGA. As I was leaving, the club ladies were efficiently rebooking all the customers in there, and as I left the gate area I saw an orderly line at Gate A4, as the agents were efficiently helping customers, and adding their sincere apologies for the inconvenience.

Although one can go on and on about the operational issues especially in PHL, (you know I have been the victim of a few), I think it is equally important to recognize the outstanding people on the front lines. Just imagine how much worse it would be without you. As I always say, US people are the best in the industry.

For what it's worth, my friend in CA called to check on me and I passed along the praise. To you I extend my thanks. To management, PLEASE get with it.

Now if only I could get home tomorrow in time to leave again Monday......

Good luck to you all....

 

[N628AU]

As for PHL flow control, PHL is in the ugly position of being wedged between NY and Washington. So if you have weather moving through either of those areas, you are going to get hammered. In the summer especially, Washington Center is known for putting people 20 miles in trail. Add low ground vis, and you have a recipe for disaster.

If PHL has not lived up to their end of the bargain of maintaining deicing equipment in the summer, CCY should send them a bill for money lost in revenues and paid out in customer accomodations.

 

[usairways85]

i aggree with N628AU. You cannot really blame US for the traffic flow problems of PHL, disregarding the deicing issue. US has just picked a premier hub that is situated between DC and NYC and, like N628AU said, PHL is hammered whenever there is any type of bad weather in the Northeast, thunderstorms or snow. PHL may only see light rain or just some poor visability, but the 3 DC airports might be experiencing heavy delays and fly into PHL's airspace thus creating delays at PHL.

 

[tadjr]

I agree that US cant be blamed when flow goes into effect, they dont control the weather, however they do control a large amount of the planes they schedule into PHL at certain times in banks that make things worse and given the constraints of the airport location and layout this must be taken into account if we are going to try to run any kind of decent operation on a continual basis in all kinds of weather. This is once again where the rolling hub concept is viable and would improve the overall operations of not just PHL, but everywhere else those planes are scheduled to fly later in the day. There are going to be days where its not going to work in PHL due to the weather no matter how many planes are scheduled into there and thats not the kind of situation I have problems with. I noticed that today the flow got worse as the day went on and that ISNT what my original post was in regards to. They are two totally separate issues.

 

[MarkMyWords]

USA85 -

I agree that the rolling hub will be a tremendous benefit for events like this. If you are the last guy in the conga line for deicing it is possible that you will be there for hours. If you have a steady flow of traffice then perhaps the deice pad would have a chance to keep up and not get as bogged down.

Lindy -

While I agree that the city should share some blame for the late turnover of the booms and lack of maintenance this summer, the bottom line still falls to our people. If we were not prepared for a full deicing operation, then either a contingency plan using the trucks should have been arranged. If PHL was not prepared for a full deicing operation, then on the MTC briefing and the Severe Weather Telecon this information should hve been relayed so steps could have been taken to reduce the burden on an already stressed system. The word on the MTC briefing was "we are good to go for deicing." The Severe Weather Telecon was the same thing. Obviously they were not ready.

You also mentioned that Tad is to quick to blame CCY for every hiccup during the operational day. I think he is placing blame for this type of event right where it belongs and let me tell you why. On a normal day in PHL, the first departure bank can take close to 45 min from the time the last aircraft pushes until they are in the air. Let's say there are 75 airplanes in that push. Now we have known for 48 hours that we were going to have a significant snow event in PHL on Friday. Why did we not reduce our flight schedule to ensure that the hub operates smoothly. There is no way that you are going to get 75 airplanes through deice and not take huge delays, especially if you are the last man out. Why did we not reduce the flying schedule ahead of time, knowing this event was coming?

Going along that same line, Saturday BOS is projected to get from 14-20 inches of snow. What do you think our operational plan is? Run everything. Zero cancellations. Why would we do that? Anyone with an ounce of common sense knows that the BOS operation will be horrendous on Sat. Instead we will try to run everything and end up canceling flights after the customers are at the airport. As a customer, what would make you feel better? To have us cancel a flight before you get to the airport and stand in line after line, or to do it in advance and WE contact you and work with you for reaccomodation from the comfort of your home? Bottomline, we knew it was coming and we did nothing to pre-plan for it. Thank you Uncle Al, for another great operating day. The blame lies directly in CCY and at the feet of VP - Uncle Al.

PitBull -

As usual PIT rises to the challenge of a severe weather event like the true professionals they are. CLT ran an impressive operation Thursday when they were deicing.

Art -

As usual, your respect and kind words for the employees are wonderful. It is great that someone recognizes the tremndous job that those employees do in the face of any and all situations. Hope you make it home safely and don't have to spend to much time digging out yor car. 🙂

 

[PITbull]

MMW,

Only thing is if management cancells flights in anticipation of this storm in PHL, who makes the calls? Is there enough staffing in Res. and agents to make those calls in addition to handling the regular operation of the day?

How about getting the VP to make calls? I have a sister who is a VP and she helps out her Res. center when its needed. She oversees a 550 staffed call center.

I just think that one of the great problems management has created is they have cut too many jobs in certain departments. You know, the Kiosk machines cannot anticipate weather, delays or changing itinararies. How does management anticipate irregualr operations without the staffing to get them there. Management has not left themselves any room for remedy and its just sprirals down everytime we have these kinds of days.

Now what?

 

[tadjr]

Well if they had cancelled the originators tonight, rez could have had all night to call people and reaccom them or when they tried to checkin online at home it would have showed that the flight wasnt going. Now, rez gets to do the work tomorrow on top of all the other things that will be going on during the day, plus calling people at downline flights that are delayed because the planes will be delayed out of BOS probably in the am. Even if they didnt want to cancel ALL the flights, 10-14 inches is going to be a mess and it will ripple thru the system tomorrow. Even if the storm doesnt hit like its expected to, its better to cancel some flights in preparation for tomorrow to try to get back on track with the rest of the system as soon as possible. We will still be playing catch up tomorrow from today and its got to get worked out sometime. Better sooner rather than later.

 

[MarkMyWords]

PitBulll -

We do have an automated system in RES to contact customers in bulk. They are given a message alerting them to a flight delay / cancellation. They are then instructed to contact reservations for reaccomodation.

As a customer, wouldn't you prefer to know that your flight is canceled PRIOR to leaving for the airport, or would you prefer to show up and be surprised and then cattled into the queue for the 2-3 agents to be rerouted? Kiosks are able to offer alternatives and rebooking for canceled flights, but again, as a customer are you going to believe that that Kiosk is providing you with all available options, or would you prefer to talk to a human being? So as the cancellations rack up, so does the long lines. And what if you are a customer on a flight that is operating on-time, but need a ticket change. You are now stuck in this long line behind everyone that is on the cancelled flights.

It just makes more sense in these situations to have a plan of attack. You and I aren't surprised to know that PHL was taking delays, and neither should anyone in CCY. We should have a plan....other then a wait and see approach that ends up with CHAOS 🙂 system wide. Why would you wait to react to a problem you know is coming?

I am not sure the VP's know how the phone works, except to dial into a conference call. You mean those things can take incoming calls too? LOL

 

[ringmaruf]

usairways.com lists the affected airports for Dec. 5/6 as BWI, IAD, MDT, ISP, EWR, SWF, LGA, PHL, DCA, HPA. The affected airports for Dec. 5/6/7 are listed as AUG, BGR, BHB, BED, BOS, BDL, HYA, MHT, MVY, ACK, RKD, PWM, PVD.

I just thought it was a little interesting, seeing as how US no longer serves MVY.