And every other person who feels they must share their wisdom to the poor co-workers who cannot make rational judgment calls. What will be will be no matter how loud you feel the need to scream. If you really think this airline is made of fools, save yourselves, screaming is moot. Let people vote their own God given common sense without your lectures. Simply stop telling people how to act, feel and reason. If you believe in this company and its future, then it goes hand in hand that you believe in the people who run it, and believe these same people will come to reason and vote with rational minds. No need to fill up the boards pleading and begging to grown men and women, you make yourselves look like the fool. Relax and have some faith in your fellow co-workers. You don’t second guess the ground crews’ judgment of a safe aircraft, then don’t judge this matter either, LET IT BE.
TO: The YOU MUST VOTE YES CROWD
- Thread starter cavalier
- Start date
willnotworkforfree
Advanced
- Aug 29, 2002
- 196
- 0
I believe the Pension problem will make the vote a moot point. As far as the vote..just to it, dont set home and say it doesent matter..it matters a lot..and lets hope we get it right the first time. I had to come in on my day off the (last) second time.
oldiebutgoody
Veteran
- Aug 23, 2002
- 2,627
- 945
You're right. Seems pretty simple to me. Vote NO, and you wind up on the street with NOTHING, not even severance or COBRA benefits. Vote yes, and even if you do get the axe, at least you'll get some furlough pay, callback rights (no matter how slim the chance) and some union benefits. I don't see why there is any discussion at all. But I guess voting NO would show those management types a thing or two.
I assume you are not telling us we cannot post our opinions of WHY we feel a yes or no vote would be appropriate. Discussion and opinions are how people make judgements. I have faith that the employees will make their judgements on the vote using ALL means available to them. For some, that would and should include the wisdom or lack thereof on this board. I my OPINION the choice is simple. Yes - the airline survives No - the airline dies. Oh no, I hope I didn't persuade anyone on how to vote.
mr
mr
zonecontroller
Advanced
- Sep 3, 2002
- 176
- 0
I wish we could vote today!
Then I know that my services wouldn't be required on Christmas Day!
Then I know that my services wouldn't be required on Christmas Day!
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #6
I assume you are not telling us we cannot post our opinions of WHY we feel a yes or no vote would be appropriate. Discussion and opinions are how people make judgements. I have faith that the employees will make their judgements on the vote using ALL means available to them. For some, that would and should include the wisdom or lack thereof on this board. I my OPINION the choice is simple. Yes - the airline survives No - the airline dies. Oh no, I hope I didn't persuade anyone on how to vote.
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Certain individuals seem to assume the rank and file are ill equipped to handle any kind of rational decisions, therefore feel threatened because of that belief. I feel as you state, that we ALL have the ability to reason, and will do so without the YOU MUST MANTRA beating until all votes are counted. For the record, I am a yes vote. But I respect and TRULY understand the negative voters as well. What will be will be.
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Certain individuals seem to assume the rank and file are ill equipped to handle any kind of rational decisions, therefore feel threatened because of that belief. I feel as you state, that we ALL have the ability to reason, and will do so without the YOU MUST MANTRA beating until all votes are counted. For the record, I am a yes vote. But I respect and TRULY understand the negative voters as well. What will be will be.
Do_it_for_Dave
Member
- Nov 20, 2002
- 78
- 0
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Certain individuals seem to assume the rank and file are ill equipped to handle any kind of rational decisions,
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Remember..the IAM members were "confused" during the last vote
Certain individuals seem to assume the rank and file are ill equipped to handle any kind of rational decisions,
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Remember..the IAM members were "confused" during the last vote
[blockquote]
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On 12/21/2002 3:08:59 PM skyflyr69 wrote:
Vote no and end up like ol' Charlie bryan. destitute and basically homeless down in miami according to some mia iam types.
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[/blockquote]
You're two rounds of concessions premature. You're not in EAL's situation yet. Wait for your fourth vote.
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On 12/21/2002 3:08:59 PM skyflyr69 wrote:
Vote no and end up like ol' Charlie bryan. destitute and basically homeless down in miami according to some mia iam types.
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[/blockquote]
You're two rounds of concessions premature. You're not in EAL's situation yet. Wait for your fourth vote.
nycbusdriver
Veteran
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[/blockquote]
You act like there is a choice here. The company made employees "an offer they couldn't refuse" (apologies to Mario Puzo).
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[/blockquote]
The choices, or offers, are quite simple. There is 1.) the possibilty of keeping a job with reasonable pay, or 2.) losing a job to a company who can pay you severence to keep you afloat while you look for another decent job, or 3.) vote it down and EVERYBODY hits the street with NOTHING simultaneously and immediately.
[/blockquote]
You act like there is a choice here. The company made employees "an offer they couldn't refuse" (apologies to Mario Puzo).
----------------
[/blockquote]
The choices, or offers, are quite simple. There is 1.) the possibilty of keeping a job with reasonable pay, or 2.) losing a job to a company who can pay you severence to keep you afloat while you look for another decent job, or 3.) vote it down and EVERYBODY hits the street with NOTHING simultaneously and immediately.
oldiebutgoody
Veteran
- Aug 23, 2002
- 2,627
- 945
[blockquote]
----------------
On 12/21/2002 7
23 PM Steiner wrote:
[blockquote]
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On 12/21/2002 3:08:59 PM skyflyr69 wrote:
Vote no and end up like ol' Charlie bryan. destitute and basically homeless down in miami according to some mia iam types.
----------------
[/blockquote]
You're two rounds of concessions premature. You're not in EAL's situation yet. Wait for your fourth vote.
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[/blockquote]
You act like there is a choice here. The company made employees "an offer they couldn't refuse" (apologies to Mario Puzo).
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On 12/21/2002 7
23 PM Steiner wrote: [blockquote]
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On 12/21/2002 3:08:59 PM skyflyr69 wrote:
Vote no and end up like ol' Charlie bryan. destitute and basically homeless down in miami according to some mia iam types.
----------------
[/blockquote]
You're two rounds of concessions premature. You're not in EAL's situation yet. Wait for your fourth vote.
----------------
[/blockquote]
You act like there is a choice here. The company made employees "an offer they couldn't refuse" (apologies to Mario Puzo).
oldiebutgoody
Veteran
- Aug 23, 2002
- 2,627
- 945
[blockquote]
----------------
On 12/21/2002 7:41:23 PM nycbusdriver wrote:
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[/blockquote]
You act like there is a choice here. The company made employees "an offer they couldn't refuse" (apologies to Mario Puzo).
----------------
[/blockquote]
The choices, or offers, are quite simple. There is 1.) the possibilty of keeping a job with reasonable pay, or 2.) losing a job to a company who can pay you severence to keep you afloat while you look for another decent job, or 3.) vote it down and EVERYBODY hits the street with NOTHING simultaneously and immediately.
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[/blockquote]
That's the way I see it!
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On 12/21/2002 7:41:23 PM nycbusdriver wrote:
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[/blockquote]
You act like there is a choice here. The company made employees "an offer they couldn't refuse" (apologies to Mario Puzo).
----------------
[/blockquote]
The choices, or offers, are quite simple. There is 1.) the possibilty of keeping a job with reasonable pay, or 2.) losing a job to a company who can pay you severence to keep you afloat while you look for another decent job, or 3.) vote it down and EVERYBODY hits the street with NOTHING simultaneously and immediately.
----------------
[/blockquote]
That's the way I see it!
C
chipmunn
Guest
The purpose of this message board is for people to gain information and to debate the issues. If somebody does not want to read a post they do not have to log on.
Message Boards are a wonderful way for a large group of people to learn and express their opinions, which is an important communication option.
Separately, Nycbusdrivr, your comments are succinct and accurate.
Chip
Message Boards are a wonderful way for a large group of people to learn and express their opinions, which is an important communication option.
Separately, Nycbusdrivr, your comments are succinct and accurate.
Chip
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #15
The purpose of this message board is for people to gain information and to debate the issues. If somebody does not want to read a post they do not have to log on.
Message Boards are a wonderful way for a large group of people to learn and express their opinions, which is an important communication option.
Separately, Nycbusdrivr, your comments are succinct and accurate.
Chip
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wait a minute Chip;
You are implying that anyone who reads this board doesn't have a clue therefore you must post every single detail the company has already stated. At work for 1/3 of our life we all hear what doom and gloom will fall on us if we refuse to submit. Then we come home turn on the computer and see it yet again from a pilot, the very group that some mechanics are not in love with, for various reasons. I get the idea that some pilots have an attitude of superiority. Ask ANY line mechanic. So, you come on here and fuel the fire by beating the drum spewing old dried out information of MUST do or else scenarios. What good does that do? All I can think of is it makes some people angry, maybe to the point of changing their minds. Why would they do something you may think is suicide? This company has people working who are on the edge, people who have lost hope, people who out of self preservation have simply given up with a I DON'T CARE ATTITUDE. It amazes me how far people can be pushed and still function, U is a case study for this. If you were hired at this company you are smart enough to figure out what a YES vote means and what a NO vote means. There is not one soul who needs their hand held and pointed to which level to pull. This was my point of this thread.
Message Boards are a wonderful way for a large group of people to learn and express their opinions, which is an important communication option.
Separately, Nycbusdrivr, your comments are succinct and accurate.
Chip
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wait a minute Chip;
You are implying that anyone who reads this board doesn't have a clue therefore you must post every single detail the company has already stated. At work for 1/3 of our life we all hear what doom and gloom will fall on us if we refuse to submit. Then we come home turn on the computer and see it yet again from a pilot, the very group that some mechanics are not in love with, for various reasons. I get the idea that some pilots have an attitude of superiority. Ask ANY line mechanic. So, you come on here and fuel the fire by beating the drum spewing old dried out information of MUST do or else scenarios. What good does that do? All I can think of is it makes some people angry, maybe to the point of changing their minds. Why would they do something you may think is suicide? This company has people working who are on the edge, people who have lost hope, people who out of self preservation have simply given up with a I DON'T CARE ATTITUDE. It amazes me how far people can be pushed and still function, U is a case study for this. If you were hired at this company you are smart enough to figure out what a YES vote means and what a NO vote means. There is not one soul who needs their hand held and pointed to which level to pull. This was my point of this thread.
