If You Were Me

[cw2usarmy]

After being furloughed from both ORD and AFW as a technician would you recommend riding it out, or accepting an active duty slot after returning from Iraq? I am do back in Jan 05. Any input would be appreciated on the following.

1. What is the latest with the industry projecting a shortage of skilled mechanics due to retirements?

2. Are the retirements happening as predicted?

3. Has the company secured any outside contracts?

4. What is the latest with MCI?

Quite a few questions I know, but only six months left over here than I have to return to my other life.

 

[LaBradford22]

First of all, thank you for your service to our great country. In response to your questions:

1. What is the latest with the industry projecting a shortage of skilled mechanics due to retirements?

I would say that there is not really a shortage right now. AA is not the only major airline with a good chunk of mechanics on furlough. Of course, eventually with retirements and attrition, those furloughs will get back to work, but it's difficult to say exactly when that will be.

2. Are the retirements happening as predicted?

I think AA saw a very high rate of attrition last year from about February through June or so, as the pay cuts were becoming apparent and taking effect. A lot of folks realized that they had already had their highest months of earnings for their pensions. Today, I think it has stabilized somewhat - i.e. back to normal attrition of 5% or less.

3. Has the company secured any outside contracts?

Yes. AA landed a big contract at AFW in their joint venture (TAESL, I believe it is called) with Rolls Royce for engine work. If I recall correctly, the $900 million of guaranteed work over the next five years, with the potential for even more than that. I've also heard from credible sources that AA may very well put some excess capacity at MCI to work by going after more outside work as well.

4. What is the latest with MCI?

There is a big chunk of space that is currently sitting almost vacant (Building Two, I think it's called). The lease on that space is up in about two years. There is a big decision coming on whether to reup that lease or let it expire. The answer to that one will depend a lot on whether or not the company can land some outside work for MCI. Other than that, the company just signed a long-term lease (25 years I believe) with the city for the main hangar, and plans are to keep maintenance of the ex-TWA MD80 fleet there.

Hope this has been at least a little bit helpful. I wish you the best of luck, and I ask that God grant His blessing upon you for a safe return home soon.

 

[MCI transplant]

CW--- First let me echo LaBradfords wishs for a safe return home!!! One Correction though! As to date a.a. has not signed a lease on any of the former TWA base! They have signed a letter of "Agreement" with the City on our main, or newer portion of the base, and it's shops! I know this is splitting hairs, for they tell us that they're just dotting the "I's", and crossing the "T's", but there really is a differance! a.a. has also put in for a 145 Certificate from F.A.A. and it's for the whole base! That is supposed to be ready some time in Aug.! Being an older work force here , we have seen quit a few retirements! I hope this helps !!! Thanks again for your survice! Signed: Another military man of a differant war and time!!!!!

 

[acmech]

Hard choices, and no easy answers. A couple of questions that you must ask yourself. First, what do you really want to do with your career? Second, Is AA ever going to call their mechanics back anytime soon?

I have been laid off since 2001, I got tired of waiting around the house, so I moved to another area for a new job, still in aviation.

 

[jimntx]

To echo the other posters, thank you for your service. My nephew is an AF fighter pilot in that part of the world right now. I think Acmech has it right. If you really want to be an aircraft mechanic, the jobs are there, but maybe not at a particular company. I think a number of the airlines are going to be outsourcing as much maintenance as their union contracts will allow.

Does re-upping require that you give up recall to AA? I know most large companies in this day and age honor military service by holding a job for those on active duty, but I don't know if that applies to furloughees. Does anyone happen to know what AMR's policy is?

 

[MCI transplant]

<_< jimntx-----Has anyone ever thought about the security risk of "Outsourcing" American Aircraft to foreign Maintenance Companies???? Or do'es the love of money overshadow potental risk to our flying public???? :down:

 

[local 12 proud]

does make one wonder if "SAFETY FIRST" is just an empty slogan!

 

[jimntx]

<_< jimntx-----Has anyone ever thought about the security risk of "Outsourcing" American Aircraft to foreign Maintenance Companies???? Or do'es the love of money overshadow potental risk to our flying public???? :down:

I don't have to take a position for or against outsourcing to make a simple statement that it is happening. Whether I approve of the sun rising in the morning or not, does not change the fact that it rises.

 

[MCI transplant]

Sorry jimntx!!! I wasn't trying to aquess you of anything!!! I was just trying to make a point !!!! It just seems the barn door is wide open on this one!!! And the only reason for it is greed!!!! I hope and pray this one don't come back and haunt us someday!!!! :unsure:

 

[jimntx]

Sorry jimntx!!! I wasn't trying to aquess you of anything!!! I was just trying to make a point !!!! It just seems the barn door is wide open on this one!!! And the only reason for it is greed!!!! I hope and pray this one don't come back and haunt us someday!!!! :unsure:

I know, but it is not the question that our original poster was asking. I don't have an answer for him--if I did, I'd have an answer for me, probably--I was just trying to give him some info to help him make the best decision for him.

 

[Wretched Wrench]

cw2, stay safe over there.

As to whether to return to AA or not, the future is bleak for airline mechanics. It is supply and demand. There are many many laid off mechs seeking employment in the field, and this forces wages down, both at the airlines as well as at the outsource chop shops. The use of untrained, unskilled, unlicensed employees in the chop shops doing more and more maintenance on airline aircraft is another downward force. As United and US Air cut wages and benefits, AA will follow, to "remain competitive", or simply because they can. Heck sometimes AA/TWU lead the industry in concessions. If you get laid off again, jobs will be tough to find. If you don't get laid off again, you will find yourself working for lower and lower wages, with a diminished or defaulted retirement. However, you could return and aggressively pursue training and alternate employment while you wait and see how bad things are going to get.

If you do decide to return, or if you re-up, I would suggest exploring another field. A line mechanic has been exposed to many different areas, and should have some idea what he would be good at. I believe your AFQT test scores should tell you something, also. Is your training officer any good? A good line mech can pick up a lot of things. Explore military and trade school options. I believe the Army will let you choose a new school for a new MOS if you re-up. Whether you stay in or come back to AA, work diligently toward leaving the airline industry.

Again, stay as safe as you can.

 

[fix_airplanes]

Hi;

Lots of things already written for you to think about.

A couple of late developments.

1. Looks like United will now have to "water down" their pension. And this will spead to the other airlines. A future consideration for you.

2. AAR (major outsourcer) is setting up business in old United hanger in Indy. There are currently 1,000 ex-United mechanics in Indy that did not elect to bump and move when United switched to outsource. Now AAR has got to have some customers lined up to signe up for those hangers.

3. In a couple of years union contracts at AA will open up again. The negotiations will be the roughest ever. Many even require strike activity.

4. The management of most airlines are now "non-aviation" folks and are the root cause of problems at the major carriers. And no change in sight. Work environment is no longer at professional level.

If you absolutely love aviation, be prepared to pay an economical price for it while working for stupid people.

I was laid off in the 80's and hung around for the recall. In hindsight, I wish I had not. In hindsight, I should have kept aviation as a hobby. Should have started my own business.

Good Luck.

 

[RDU Jetblast]

CW,

Thank you for your sacrifices.

I was an aicraft technician up until '94 when my airline asked for volunteers to take a furlough and the golden handshake. I took it and changed industries. You, however, have to decide on waiting for an airline to pick you back up or re-enlist. Both choices suck if you ask me. I have an aversion to sand in my shorts.

What scared me most at the time was watching the old timers be forced into retirement (lower income) earlier than they had planned. It was hard to watch 55 year old men wonder what they can do to keep their families' under a roof and fed when all they have ever done was work on airplanes. Transferring job skills is hard and gets harder with age.

I didn't want to be in the same predicament at 55 so at 30 I transferred my skills to another industry. Ten years and two companies later, I'm making more than I did in '94 but not nearly as much as my friends who stayed with the airline. And, I am happy. I have newer skills and can negotiate my salary whereas negotiating salary in aviation is rare. Regardless of experience, you usually start at bottom of scale on 3rd shift with wierd days off. Day shift with weekends off don't mean much when you are young but they gain importance as you grow older.

I am happy for my friends who hung tough by staying in aviation but I don't envy them.

Good luck with your decision. I am sure it will work out for the best no matter what you choose to do.