...from under the bus

[UALIADCS]

This is from someone under the bus, and a warning to all you NOT under the bus!

1. There's a petition at change.org; subject: Smisek asking that benefits be returned to retirees. (seniority being determining factor on all NRSA). Retiree benefits have been in place for generations. Some were incentives, some were compensation for reduced salary, vacation, increased insurance premiums, etc.

2. There's a Facebook Page - Protect United Airlines Retirees Boarding and Seniority which is also addressing disparity in the vacation pass issue, companion passes, surviving spousal privileges, etc. The spin doctors are reporting that there's been little push back.... NOT SO.

3. If they do this to retirees, who's next? A company allowed to throw one unprotected group under the bus will move on to other groups....

Be watchful, it's your job, insurance, retirement on the line. Retirees are just the beginning, they were an "easy mark." Communication is non-existent outside Skynet and what they want you to know.

Most retirees are not tech savvy and have a hard time navigating the pc, so they have no idea what's happening. Downright disrespectful!

 

[29palms]

Retirees should have never been flying above the active employees. No other airline I think does this.

 

[UALIADCS]

Retirees should have never been flying above the active employees. No other airline I think does this.

Point is, for more years than you've been alive UA actives and retirees have boarded their flights by seniority, not status, and those benefits were waiting for them at retirement.

The BP6 came at a point where the company needed to hold on to quality employees, promising them an extra benefit at 25 years + retirement. They stayed because of that promise.

So, a company's commitment to its employees has no value?

When you retire, (which you will one day) will you expect to receive the benefits package you were promised for many years?
When the company says they want your salary back, and that they will compensate you with travel benefits are you readily going to give it to them?

CO employees pay for travel for 10 years, they didn't at UA; that UA benefit was shared to CO employees. I know of no UA employee unhappy with that. All UA employees are asking is for is the equality equality they've had for 50+ years. Oh, and there are CO retirees unhappy with the CO policy.

 

[xUT]

Retirees should have never been flying above the active employees. No other airline I think does this.

CO did prior to their three BK's , PAN AM did, EAL did, TWA did, USAir did, do you remember?
B) xUT

 

[700UW]

US Airways did until after the first bankruptcy.

 

[UALIADCS]

Retirees should have never been flying above the active employees. No other airline I think does this.

 

[UALIADCS]

CO did prior to their three BK's , PAN AM did, EAL did, TWA did, USAir did, do you remember?
B) xUT

 

[UALIADCS]

Thank you for that info. I am way too "young" to remember that!

 

[29palms]

Honestly my dear friends. I'm not trying to stir the pot, but I highly disagree with your take. Do you think RETIRED MILITARY flies on military aircraft before military with orders or active military? NOT! Why do you think that is? Do you think that it may have something to do with the criticalness of the mission of the military? How is it different with the airlines? I don't know what was promised to UAL retirees. I was promised a defined pension plan when I joined up CO, but then again, where is the promise in writing? Truth is, companies can do whatever they see fit to do if its in the scope of a legal dealings. Can you show me proof of your "PROMISE" from UAL for retirees that they deserve flying benefits above active employees for life?
Look, I'm a tech just like you and struggle daily like you to survive in this industry. I don't disagree with how you feel or got shorthanded here, however, I feel that it should be ACTIVE employees and family members first while ACCOMPANIED, followed by RETIREES, then UNACCOMPANIED family members, and buddy passes last of course.
A merger happens to throw alot of monkey wrenches into formulas. Same with new political presidents and polititians. Medicare probably won't be the same when I get to it.
So lets agree to disagree here. I won't toot this horn any further, but I layed out what I think about it, and hopefully, I won't be character assissinated for it. So whatever you do, good luck with your petition, and your future either as an employee or retiree. In either case, there will be winners and losers on each end. Hopefully, we will all be winners in keeping employed, and be able to achieve our goals with the industry.
Lastly, I don't know that previous examples of flight priveledges given as examples above, such as PANAM, TWA, USAIR, CO before bk's, are good examples to bring up, maybe this was part of the problem with these styles of culture.

 

[29palms]

Get a load of this. Retirees for military travel go on CATEGOREY 6. I know this is not military however, pretty fair guidelines to me. Even military doesn't agree with military retirees going first. Kind of a wash don't you think?


Category I - Emergency travel on a round-trip basis in connection with serious illness, death, or impending death of a member of the immediate family of the following:


United States citizen civilian employees of the DoD stationed overseas.
Full-time, paid personnel of the American Red Cross serving with United States military Services overseas.
Uniformed Service family members whose sponsors are stationed within the continental United States (CONUS) and the emergency exists overseas.
Family members of United States citizen civilian employees of the DoD when both sponsor and dependents are stationed overseas at the same location.
Uniformed Service family members when accompanied by their sponsor may travel within the continental United States (CONUS) if the emergency exists in the CONUS.

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Category II - Environmental Morale Leave (EML):


Sponsors on environmental and morale leave (EML) and accompanied family members. Military personnel must also be on ordinary leave. Any other type leave such as convalescent or overseas tour extension incentive program (OTEIP) with EML is not authorized.
DoD Dependent School (DoDDS) teachers and their accompanied family members in EML status during school year holiday, vacation periods or employer-approved training during recess periods.

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Category III - Ordinary leave:


Members of the uniformed services in an ordinary or reenlistment leave status and uniformed Services patients on convalescent leave. Members on convalescent leave may not travel overseas unless their leave form is so annotated.
Military personnel traveling on permissive temporary duty (TDY) orders for house hunting.
If the permissive TDY is for the purpose of permanent change of station house hunting, the member travels in Category III, may travel within the continental United States (CONUS) as well as international travel, and may be accompanied by one family member.
Bona fide family members (with a valid identification card) of a Service member of the uniformed Services when accompanied by their sponsor who is in an ordinary leave status within overseas areas between overseas stations and air terminals in the CONUS.
This privilege does not apply to travel of dependents to or from a sponsor's restricted or unaccompanied tour location or to travel in a leave status to or from TDY locations. It applies only to round-trip travel to an overseas area or the CONUS with the sponsor. DoD 4515.13-R restricts use of these privileges to establish a home for family members in an overseas area or the CONUS.
Foreign exchange service members on permanent duty with the DoD, when in a leave status.

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Category IV - Unaccompanied dependents on EML:


Unaccompanied family members (18 years or older) traveling on EML orders. Family members under 18 must be accompanied by an adult family member who is traveling EML.
DoDDS teachers or family members (accompanied or unaccompanied) in an EML status year round.

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Category V - Permissive Temporary Duty and students:


Students whose sponsor is stationed in Alaska or Hawaii.
Military personnel traveling on permissive TDY orders for other than house hunting.
Command sponsored dependents (18 years of age) of Uniformed Services members who are stationed overseas may travel unaccompanied from the sponsor's PCS duty location to the CONUS and return. Travel is also authorized within the overseas theater. Travel cannot be between two overseas theaters (i.e., from Germany to Panama or from Japan to England). Dependents must have command sponsored documentation signed by the Commander verifying command sponsorship.

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Category VI - Retirees:


National Guard/Reserve components/members of the Ready Reserve and members of the Standby Reserve who are on the Active Status List.
Retired military members who are issued DD Form 2 and eligible to receive retired or retainer pay.
Family members (with a valid identification card) of retired members when accompanied by a sponsor.

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To qualify for the new Military Family Space "A" travel policy the following conditions apply:

Family members must be legal dependents - spouses and children - of military personnel (including National Guard and Reserve members).
Servicemember is activated and deployed for at least 120 consecutive days or more, according to officials at the Air Force's Air Mobility Command.
There is no limit on the number of times family members of deployed troops can travel on Space-A flights.
Those eligible may sign up for Space-A travel before the sponsor's deployment, but no earlier than 10 days beforehand.
Dependents can start travel on the first day of the member's deployment and must complete their travel by the last day of the deployment.
Family members must have a letter from the sponsor's commander verifying the deployment, and it must be in the dependents' possession. The letter is good for the duration of the member's deployment. If the letter is lost, destroyed or no longer legible, the family member must get a new one.
Children under age 18 must be accompanied by an eligible parent or legal guardian. Family members in these circumstances are classified as Category 4, which means they have a higher priority for getting Space-A seats than retirees and their family members, who have the lowest priority, Category 6.
Officials remind family members that flying Space-A on military or military-contracted flights is a privilege, not a guarantee. Passengers should be prepared to purchase commercial transportation at any point.
Space-A passengers may be required to pay certain federal fees when entering or leaving the continental U.S. on commercial contract aircraft.
Travel for Dependents of Deployed Military Members Memorandum. (requires PDF Reader)
If you are unsure of which category you fit in, please refer to DoD 4515.13-R, Chapter 6, Table 6.1 for a complete explanation of each category.