Construction In Washington

[Ukridge]

I admit that Heathrow is not the easiest airport in which to get around (or even reach in some cases. However, many airports are making progress in connectivity to the public transport of both rail and bus. I find Frankfurt to be quite good in this area with the new train terminal.

A colleague who had recently been in Washington told me that there is much construction under way. Will there now be a tunnel so that we may disembark from our international flights and not have to be packed cheek to jowl on the 'people mover?' Or, is it the case that the improvements will only serve your inland flights?

No secret here that I have not been in Washington for a few months and I am loath to voice complaint, but I would much rather take the walk (moving walkway?) than pack onto the moving transport. The drivers, instead of providing multiple shuttles, would simply pack as many humans on board and only then set off for the 200 meter jaunt to the passport control building. Please do not tell me that the authorities are still to rely on this outmoded and extraordinarily inconvenient method of passanger processing. Just because our rail system in Britain is a mess does not mean that you former colonialists must replicate our mistakes

Also, are there plans to move the rail system to the airport? Why does the community insist on being held hostage to the taxi? I have seen examples of raw political power before, but the cabal of the people mover and taxi ranks among the most blatant.
Cheers

 

[funguy2]

I think the improvements that you speak of have been in the planning stages for years. I think a tunnel to the concourses (a la ATL or DEN) has been conceptualized since Presidential Airways built the first "Midfield Concourse". I think extended the Orange Line of the Metro has similarly been in the planning stages for years. When (or if) these items are actually built, is probably anybody's guess.

 

[Cosmo]

Ukridge:

Adding to funguy2's "history lesson", you can find more information about the underground train system currently under construction at IAD here. The good news is that it is in process, and some of the contracts have already been awarded. The bad news is that it will be another 4 or 5 years before it is finished. But at least you have something to look forward to.

 

[Cosmo]

And there is similar news with regard to extending Washington's Metro subway system out to IAD and beyond, which you can read about here. Incidentally, the current plan is to call this extension the Silver Line, and it will share current Orange Line tracks from West Falls Church into and through downtown Washington.

At the moment, construction is subject to Congressional authorization (which is expected to be forthcoming) in a pending 6-year highway and transit spending bill that is now in conference committee sessions with House and Senate members and totals upwards of $300 billion for the 6-year period. The good news is that construction is likely to start within a year. The bad news is that the extension to (and beyond) IAD will be built in two phases, with the second phase (which includes a station at IAD) probably not opening before 2014 or 2015.

And literally as I was typing the above comments, I received an email stating that the DOT's Federal Transit Administration (FTA) today approved the start of preliminary engineering for the first phase of rail in the Dulles Corridor (as the route is known around the Washington area), and you can read the FTA press release here. So, Ukridge, there's some light at the far end of a very long tunnel -- but at least the news is positive!

 

[mweiss]

Ukridge,

You simply must try to fly into DCA sometime. Yes, I know, it's not exactly an easy jaunt from LHR. Nonetheless, the connection between airport and railway has to be among the best in the nation at that airport.

Other decent airports for rail connectivity are ORD, ATL (not that there are many places one can go on MARTA), PHL, EWR, SFO, and PDX (same problem as ATL).

 

[RowUnderDCA]

There are some interesting challenges for Metro rail (well, I use the term 'interesting' very loosely). Namely the relationships and ownerships among WMATA (area transit), MWAA (Dulles and National Airport Authority) and the Federal Government (both Congress and the FAA).

The plan to use MWAA property for phases of development that WONT actually reach the airport for years if ever is problematic. The corridor upon which the right of way for the rail lines sits is on MWAA property. They can't give it away for free, unless it serves the airport.

Two more confounding facts:

MWAA actually leases the land from the Federal Government

There may be an argument that land designated (or at least conceptualized) by the Federal Government for use as rail right-of-way has limited use for anything else. So what's it worth anyway?

Not to be morbid, but I seem to remember that someone has already died in an accident in a tunnel for IAD's tramway. So, wouldn't that mean it's already well underconstruction?

 

[Cosmo]

Ukridge:

While mweiss is indeed correct that the connection to the Metrorail station at DCA is superb, I would nonetheless advise you to continue flying LHR-IAD nonstop when you come to the Washington area. By the time you make a connection at an intermediate airport somewhere, your trip into DCA would take at least an additional two hours, and quite possibly a good deal more, enroute. Instead, you could be happily ensconced at your favorite local restaurant or pub, working on your third or fourth pint or cocktail. So forget the aggravation involved in making an intermediate stop. It seems like an easy decision to me! B)

 

[mweiss]

Of course Cosmo's correct. Nonetheless, DCA is my favorite airport in the country for easy business travel. AUS (Mueller) was my favorite for overall access to the CBD, though; ten minutes from gate to downtown! *sigh* I miss that airport.

 

[Cosmo]

RowUnderDCA:

I have two comments in response to your post above.

1.) Although they are definitely not happy about it, MWAA has reportedly come to the realization that Metro service will never get to IAD if they hold out for it being built all at one time, given the current Federal transit funding formulae. Thus, they have reluctantly accepted the two-phase approach to building rail in the Dulles Corridor, with the IAD station being part of the second phase.

2.) IIRC, the accident you referred to was in a pedestrian tunnel being built to connect the main terminal to Concourse B, similar to the tunnel connecting United's two concourses at ORD. AFAIK, the underground train system will use a different tunnel layout in the shape of a large "U", with the base of the "U" in the main terminal and the two arms of the "U" extending outward to both sides of each midfield concourse (A/B, C/D, and a future E/F). If you check the link to MWAA's website that I posted earlier, it might have a diagram of the IAD train system.

 

[funguy2]

Well, I had no idea that either project was as far along as they are! I am pleasantly surprised. I had heard some grumblings recently (on usaviation.com), so I assumed neither was off the drawing board. I am happy that my information wasa "history lesson" rather than current reality.

Slightly off-topic: DCA is my favorite close-in airport from which I ride the train. But my favorite convenient drive-in/out airport is, by far, John Wayne/Orange County. I have made it from the beach to the ticket counter in 15min, including a stop for gas. The new BART extension to SFO is pretty good too, although a bit on the pricy side for public transit ($5 to dt SF).

 

[Ukridge]

Thanks Cosmo - both sites are quite informative and the prospect of riding a rail car to the main terminal gives hope to the weary and downtrodden denizens of the 'people mover' with the result, as you mentioned, an earlier arrival at where you wish to be and more time to stand a round (get it? 'stand a round' instead of 'stand around' in the people mover - ha ha).

The site had discussed a new terminal 'E.' Will United remain in C or do they plan to switch? Have they even started construction on this building?

Also, I looked at the cost estimates for the Dulles projects. Do they not seem just a wee bit optimistic? Just a guess would seem that the price would be double what was listed. I was surpised at the low figures.

Good info from all. Shows the good side of this forum.
Cheers

 

[DLFlyer31]

Interesting topic and relevant to the success of both UAL and Independence Air.


My big problem with rail to Dulles is that the existing Orange Line is already approaching capacity at rush hour times. Adding the new Silver Line to Dulles will dump all that new traffic onto a line that is already crowded. It gets even worse when you then merge with the Blue Line at Rosslyn. Metro has already warned that the Orange will begin to fail (customers unable to board trains) in 2006.

Before anyone spends a dime on Dulles rail, they'd better come up with a plan to handle this congestion. Otherwise, the bottleneck will be so bad, no one will use the rail to start with.

I also think rail to Dulles from downtown may not be all that popular. The number of stops from DC to Dulles will likely be close to 20. The trip will easily take an hour. Many people don't want to sit on a train that long.

ORD has for years suffered from a similar problem. The Blue Line from the Loop takes too long and many people still drive/taxi.

 

[Ukridge]

DLFLyer31 - You bring up an interesting point about the travel times and number of stops even if there were rail service. As I am a bit unfamiliar with the outlying geography I did not even consider the number of stops a rail sevice would need to make. You may perhaps know that Heathrow (I speak in general here) has two basic rail services to London with the Heathrow Express being the much preffered and faster modus. For some reason this is what I had envisoned for Washington though this may be a totaly false assumption. Though my business and stay may be closer to the downtown, this does not mean that all travelers will be doing the same and would be looking for conncetivity from other areas. With this connectivity comes stops, and with the stops, a time increase.
All this to say that the problem is not as simple as I had imagined and the concept of an 'express' would have to be weighed against other options.
Cheers

 

[funguy2]

Before anyone spends a dime on Dulles rail, they'd better come up with a plan to handle this congestion. Otherwise, the bottleneck will be so bad, no one will use the rail to start with.

I also think rail to Dulles from downtown may not be all that popular. The number of stops from DC to Dulles will likely be close to 20. The trip will easily take an hour. Many people don't want to sit on a train that long.

ORD has for years suffered from a similar problem. The Blue Line from the Loop takes too long and many people still drive/taxi.

DLFlyer31:

You bring up a good point that I was going to mention yesterday... The new Silver Line, in this case, would almost have to be "Express" from Rosalyn to Falls Church. This would be similar to portions of Chicago's El and New York's Subway systems.

I've ridden the El from Evanston to the Loop, and back to O'Hare... A long ride if you have the time.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

RowUnderDCA:

I have two comments in response to your post above.

1.) Although they are definitely not happy about it, MWAA has reportedly come to the realization that Metro service will never get to IAD if they hold out for it being built all at one time, given the current Federal transit funding formulae. Thus, they have reluctantly accepted the two-phase approach to building rail in the Dulles Corridor, with the IAD station being part of the second phase.

2.) IIRC, the accident you referred to was in a pedestrian tunnel being built to connect the main terminal to Concourse B, similar to the tunnel connecting United's two concourses at ORD. AFAIK, the underground train system will use a different tunnel layout in the shape of a large "U", with the base of the "U" in the main terminal and the two arms of the "U" extending outward to both sides of each midfield concourse (A/B, C/D, and a future E/F). If you check the link to MWAA's website that I posted earlier, it might have a diagram of the IAD train system.

who cares what MWAA thinks. It's on Federal land, if congress wants the project, they'll make it happen.