Attention All Apl Pilots !

[U 737 PILOT]

Beware to any APL pilot thinking of coming over to Mid Atlantic. The company has inserted into their latest proposal with ALPA a training contract for the Embraer 170 with NO $ dollar amount shown !!! You are commited to MAA for TWO YEARS and if you leave prior to that you owe the company the money or you lose your seniority number and recall rights back to mainline. How much is the training contract ? Could be 10, 20 , or even $30,000. It's a BAD deal. Think twice before coming over to MAA !

 

[nycbusdriver]

Beware to any APL pilot thinking of coming over to Mid Atlantic. The company has inserted into their latest proposal with ALPA a training contract for the Embraer 170 with NO $ dollar amount shown !!! You are commited to MAA for TWO YEARS and if you leave prior to that you owe the company the money or you lose your seniority number and recall rights back to mainline. How much is the training contract ? Could be 10, 20 , or even $30,000. It's a BAD deal. Think twice before coming over to MAA !

[post="175808"][/post]​

The company is freaking out over what will likely be a mass exodus of EMB pilots from MidAtlantic to JetBlue when the JB EMB190's start getting delivered next year. This is their answer.

I still vote NO.

 

[oldbscaler]

Training contracts are a hard sell. I have signed two of them. One at Jetstream and one at AA, both for $10,000. They both evaporated very quickly.
Don't be scared by them. Worst case scenario is that you will get a better job with your experience and have a small legal battle on your hands. It may even be out of state.

 

[dfw79]

Why should US Airways pay for your training when your intentions are to go to Jetblue? The airline has a right to protect their investment in you...unless you want to go to a PFT format. If your intention is to use the company...then prepare to have to repay them.

 

[Bud8EE]

Why should US Airways pay for your training when your intentions are to go to Jetblue? The airline has a right to protect their investment in you...unless you want to go to a PFT format. If your intention is to use the company...then prepare to have to repay them.

[post="175846"][/post]​

Maybe if their longevity was intact and they made a competive wage they wouldn't go to JetBlue.

 

[AP Tech]

Many of the MDA mechs are waiting in the wings for the delivery of the EMB 190's to Jet Blue. For $13.01 hr there is little or no loyality!!!!!

Jet Blue managment has to be licking their chops at the number of pre-trained Airbus and EMB 190 mechanics soon to become avaliable.

 

[javaboy]

We had contractually pay rates----company didnt honor those
We had contractually parity +1% (forced on us by company..which they wanted until UAL/DAL/AMR got huge raises)--still not honoring those
we had 3 yes 3 different NO FURLOUGH clauses (bought and paid for 3 times) and still over 1800 on the street
We had contractually 25% ownership in company (1st ESOP plan)... where is that
We had contractually17% ownership in the "new" company (1st set of options)
We had contractually options to replace options netting about 18% of company (current options you know the ones priced at 7.34)
We had contractually pension obligations that they wont even honor (after they honor their own of course) (even though they could have BY mutual agreement terminated the plan (not under duress) and that money 7.0 BILLION would have to have been distributed to THE PILOTS. avearging 65% of what was owed instead of PBGC amount (if that ....if UAL and now CAL terminates under duress the likely hood of PBGC collapsing is greatly increased then and only then will congress move on this)

what makes you think that they (mgmt) could ever collect from a lowly pilot? why just because it is written in a contract?

now you have "a mass exodus" to the LCCs for HIGHER PAY and BETTER benefits???? Ironic isnt it?

sorry in the past 24 years i have seen pay for training from supplementals, 135s, regionals (in my day they were call commuters) even AMR had one in the mid to late 80s (of course ruled uneforcable as a condition of employment).....

just my 1cent(s) (actually is 2cents but after the pay cut....i gotta cut costs somewhere)........

 

[U 737 PILOT]

Heads up APL'ers ............ as of today (Sat 4th) latest company proposal still has the 2 year training contract in it with the dollar amount BLANK !!! Might be a good idea to delay coming to MAA until all this gets sorted out !!!

 

[luvn737s]

It is very likely that the next round of industry concessions will include some sort of "Pay for Initial" and "Pay for Upgrade" training. It is not too hard to imagine the airline subcontracting out their initial and upgrade training to a single-source vendor such as Flight Safety. The FAA may wake up and see that most of the airlines use very similar procedures and could mandate a transistion to a uniform training syllabus that could be provided by a Flight Safety-type outfit. The FAA could save money by merely having to supervise one or two vendors rather than every airline. Those that have the money will be able to afford the type-specific training. If there are too few willing to pay for the upgrade they will hire off the street for captains. The airline execs know that there will be something pilots value enough (like duty rigs, maybe) that they would be willing to allow this in order to preserve something else (for a little while until the next round of concessions).

However, if there are enough pilots like the RC4 at all airlines that are willing to stand firm and force the airlines to do business differently rather than shake down their employees, maybe this will remain only an execs dream.

 

[Rico]

So far...

PSA, nor any of the other JFJ options require (nor have proposed to require) any "training contract"

Not sure why this is the case. CRJ training is not cheap either. But, that is the way it has been proposed, and is something to condsider.

PSA also differs from the "contract" carrier JFJ options as there is an agreement in place that allows for "blended senority" (not longevity) on that property (with the current PSA pilots), while that is not the case at places like Mesa, CHQ, or TSA.

Each of the JFJ options obviously has it's pitfalls, unique to that specific company. If anyone is to consider going this route they would be smart to talk to APL pilots already at that property for a "heads up".