AMTS/AMTA

[PlayTheOdds]

It is no secret the distaste I have for the AMT term, I also find it absurd that you guys think that OSM’s and SRP’s are below AMT’s for they are all one in the same. I have to wonder if the AMTS and AMTA are paid mercenaries hired by the Majors and MRO’s to kill the true aircraft mechanics, the A&P’s. I understand the fact that an A&P is an AMT but that fact is not vice-versa. You can be an AMT without being an A&P, this is where the danger for the A&P lies. This is also where the AMTA and AMTS is failing the A&P and is advancing the decline of the craft. To prove my point I would like to direct you to the April 2010 edition of the Aircraft Maintenance Technology Publication. Please turn to Pg. 36 For the AMTSociety Mx Logs Update. Please read very carefully…

I know that I have read in this publication as well as others the complaints and worries of American registered aircraft being flown overseas for heavy maintenance. All of the articles include the lack of FAA oversight and the quality of work being performed. China is at the top of the list for the alleged pathetic work being performed on our aircraft.


So how is all of this connected? Well let’s leap back in time to March 16 thru the 18 to Las Vegas Nevada where the AMTSociety’s third annual MSC was held. Twenty-five teams showed up for the competition. I take it that twenty-three of these teams where American with, for the fist time, one coming from Australia and one from China. For all the bravado that Overseas MRO’s is the worst possible place for an aircraft to go and the public warnings that overseas maintained aircraft are a danger to the flying public just got shot to hell and back.

The author of the article, Kenneth MacTiernan the AMTSociety Director/Chairman of the MSC clearly states…and I quote from the article.

“This year saw the first international teams enter the MSC. Teams from China and Australia came to Las Vegas which helps emphasize the premise behind the MSC and that is an aircraft does not care about the color of an AMT/AME’s uniform, skin, religion, sex, nationality, or language. All an aircraft cares about is the knowledge, skill, and integrity of the hand holding the wrench doing the repair. And this years MSC had a proud example of these AMT/AME’s! The honor and pride that is evident throughout the AMT/AME craft and profession was apparent when the teams from China and Australia were announced a loud round of applause rang out…”

So everyone is happy to see the Chinese participating in the event, no mention of hack shops here. Lets do continue…

Another quote from the same author…

“…the competitive nature was to be expected but there was also the ever present sense of brotherhood that skilled craftsmen carry amongst themselves such as today’s AMT/AME’s possess.

The brotherhood of skilled craftsmen? Wow is he including the AMT’s coming from the armpit MRO’s and the skilled scabs of NWA?

Lets pay close attention to this one…

“Each of the 25 teams that competed are the epitome of the true “Faces Behind Safety” in aircraft maintenance.”

WOW!!!! The “EPITOME”. China is listed in those ranks. Their very first time ever competing in this event and they walk away with third place in the MRO/OEM category. How many teams competed in this category? Did China beat out 22 other US teams?

There were 125 AMT’s competing in this event, I wonder how many held an A&P? If any did were they even recognized for it?

As the number of A&P’s decline and the number of AMT’s increase and the AMTS/AMTA continue to show the public that overseas AMT’s are actually equivalent to their American counterparts and that A&P’s are no longer needed because cheaper unlicensed AMT’s are just as good as licensed A&P’s this craft is going to be a minimum wage craft.

Thank you AMTS and AMTA and all of you A&P’s that support the AMT term and all the AMT-SRM/OSM folk, that didn’t have it in you to get you A&P, for driving the final nails into the A&P’s coffin.

 

[lineguy43]

It is no secret the distaste I have for the AMT term, I also find it absurd that you guys think that OSM’s and SRP’s are below AMT’s for they are all one in the same. I have to wonder if the AMTS and AMTA are paid mercenaries hired by the Majors and MRO’s to kill the true aircraft mechanics, the A&P’s. I understand the fact that an A&P is an AMT but that fact is not vice-versa. You can be an AMT without being an A&P, this is where the danger for the A&P lies. This is also where the AMTA and AMTS is failing the A&P and is advancing the decline of the craft. To prove my point I would like to direct you to the April 2010 edition of the Aircraft Maintenance Technology Publication. Please turn to Pg. 36 For the AMTSociety Mx Logs Update. Please read very carefully…

I know that I have read in this publication as well as others the complaints and worries of American registered aircraft being flown overseas for heavy maintenance. All of the articles include the lack of FAA oversight and the quality of work being performed. China is at the top of the list for the alleged pathetic work being performed on our aircraft.


So how is all of this connected? Well let’s leap back in time to March 16 thru the 18 to Las Vegas Nevada where the AMTSociety’s third annual MSC was held. Twenty-five teams showed up for the competition. I take it that twenty-three of these teams where American with, for the fist time, one coming from Australia and one from China. For all the bravado that Overseas MRO’s is the worst possible place for an aircraft to go and the public warnings that overseas maintained aircraft are a danger to the flying public just got shot to hell and back.

The author of the article, Kenneth MacTiernan the AMTSociety Director/Chairman of the MSC clearly states…and I quote from the article.

“This year saw the first international teams enter the MSC. Teams from China and Australia came to Las Vegas which helps emphasize the premise behind the MSC and that is an aircraft does not care about the color of an AMT/AME’s uniform, skin, religion, sex, nationality, or language. All an aircraft cares about is the knowledge, skill, and integrity of the hand holding the wrench doing the repair. And this years MSC had a proud example of these AMT/AME’s! The honor and pride that is evident throughout the AMT/AME craft and profession was apparent when the teams from China and Australia were announced a loud round of applause rang out…”

So everyone is happy to see the Chinese participating in the event, no mention of hack shops here. Lets do continue…

Another quote from the same author…

“…the competitive nature was to be expected but there was also the ever present sense of brotherhood that skilled craftsmen carry amongst themselves such as today’s AMT/AME’s possess.

The brotherhood of skilled craftsmen? Wow is he including the AMT’s coming from the armpit MRO’s and the skilled scabs of NWA?

Lets pay close attention to this one…

“Each of the 25 teams that competed are the epitome of the true “Faces Behind Safety” in aircraft maintenance.”

WOW!!!! The “EPITOME”. China is listed in those ranks. Their very first time ever competing in this event and they walk away with third place in the MRO/OEM category. How many teams competed in this category? Did China beat out 22 other US teams?

There were 125 AMT’s competing in this event, I wonder how many held an A&P? If any did were they even recognized for it?

As the number of A&P’s decline and the number of AMT’s increase and the AMTS/AMTA continue to show the public that overseas AMT’s are actually equivalent to their American counterparts and that A&P’s are no longer needed because cheaper unlicensed AMT’s are just as good as licensed A&P’s this craft is going to be a minimum wage craft.

Thank you AMTS and AMTA and all of you A&P’s that support the AMT term and all the AMT-SRM/OSM folk, that didn’t have it in you to get you A&P, for driving the final nails into the A&P’s coffin.

PTO,
While I agree with a lot of your points and I know the AMT is a sore spot with you. YOU personally did not help the A&P in their quest for better salaries and working conditions when you crossed an active picket line to help NW bust the one union who actually succeeded in getting substantally better wages and retirement for A@P's which raised the bar for other airlines as well ,atleast for a little while then thanks to people like yourself it was a race to the bottom again for the A@P except for a few companies. Thankfully I happen to work for one of them that still pays very good wages and make a better salary now than I ever did but it was no thanks to any effort YOU or any other of your brothern who crossed my line did.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

PTO,
While I agree with a lot of your points and I know the AMT is a sore spot with you. YOU personally did not help the A&P in their quest for better salaries and working conditions when you crossed an active picket line...

Wow, what a decent and corrigble post from a unionist with a differing opinion. There used to be more like you here but they are MIA. They would at least address the issues at hand unlike some people here that have their head stuck in the sand or try to sweep the truth under the rug or bury it. Take the Director of the AMTA for example, this is what he is promoting. AMT at work,and thinks he is saving the craft. There is not a doubt in my mind that he is an intelligent man but I be damned if he is not wearing blinders as to what the AMTA is truly doing to this craft. Each and every one of those guys are AMT’s. An A&P has to be able to speak, read and understand the English language. Apparently that is not the case for an AMT.
You can point the finger at me all you want and say that it is my fault or all the scabs fault that AMFA lost that strike and you can also say that we caused a race to the bottom for that craft as well, but do you really believe that. I say that it is not so. The influence of the AMFA strike on the A&P craft is probably around .001 percent. So what is the true culprit? I’ll tell you that it is every union that had anything to do with it and every union that represents A&P’s and the worthless AMT term. Oh yes and lets not forget that when you say that you were trying to save half of your jobs do keep in mind that about half of that half were cleaners. Tell me Linguy, how many unioized A&P/AMT’s are there out there? Let me take a guess and say 40 to 60 thousand. How does 1,800 scabs mop the floor with 40 thousand union members? Do you know what the flight attendans did for you guys? Well let me tell you, they flew scab maintained aircraft, most of them with a smile on their face. There were some that was a bit bitter that would write up 5 to 10 cabin items that usually wasn’t even bothered with under normal circumstances. Some even stepped it up a notch by putting ashtrays in the Lavs or dumping coffee grounds in the sinks. The pilots? Well we know that story, “Throttles at full.” The ground crews? Hell it wouldn’t surprise me if the IAM paid kickbacks to NWA fo the opportunity to steal the pushbacks from you guys. AND lets not forget the fabulous AMTA whose director cheered you guys on from the sidelines and at the same time is promoting a term that is sending our aircraft overseas and making it all to easy for immigrant workers to come to the US legally and illegally to pickup a wrench and work your job at a fraction of the cost. Instead of buying bust and promoting the absolutely useless AMT term, that says any idiot can work on aircraft, maybe they should be lobbying the FAA and congress for legislation that will protect the craft and keep American registered aircraft in American shops being maintained by American A&P’s. All your beloved unions that run around screaming, “An Injury To One Is An Injury To All”, but actually can’t wait to stab each other or even their own members in the back, well just maybe thy should jump on the same program.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

Today we will be looking at the July 2010 issue of AMT, the "official publication for AMTSociety. Check out the article Hours on page six written by Nick Sergi. Nick says "...So to is the aviation Maintenance profession, and, make no mistake, it is a profession. So to ask young people to invest upward of $20,000 plus to earn an A&P certificate and not provide them with the current educational opportunities and tools they need to begin regaining their investment, a secure way of life and professional satisfaction, is wrong."

Nick seems to think the current A&P curriculum is a bit dated. Well I must disagree with him for in the GA world it is just fine the way it is. It covers just about everything required to maintain the current GA fleet. This is why there is not going to be any changes in the "high beams of the foreseeable future". Just look at the way things are moving right now for commercial aviation maintenance. The commercial mechanics along with the help of their unions and societies like the AMTS and the AMTA has coined a counterfeit name that is effectively destroying the need for A&P's in the commercial aviation industry, the coveted AMT. The wave of the future is to get rid of the A&P's and open the doors for the AMT. This is why no one is interested in changing the A&P curriculum, A&P’s simply won’t be needed. With the global economy demanding uniform standardization of commercial industries, just think about how easy it is going to be to sell the public on Aircraft Maintenance Technicians working on commercial airliners around the world.

I would like the AMTS to do a survey and compare the number of AMTs in the US to the number of A&P's. Then I would like them to do the same on a global scale. If I were to call up Strom or Planetechs right now they could send me to a number of MRO's to work where I would be a minority because I hold an A&P. The kicker here is I would be making the same money as my non-certified AMT counter part. Lets take that a step further and jump over to Taiwan where you would be working next to thousands of non-certified non-english speaking AMT's. How about that one?

So Nick thinks a performance based system is the way to go. That really sounds anti-union to me, I wonder if he is a unionist? That is a good idea to some degree. As a matter of fact he does mention the work-related path which isn't a bad idea for getting an A&P. Think about it, instead of blowing 20 grand on an outdated school you can work in a MRO for about three years as an AMT making the same money as an A&P, get signed off and take the test. Then you can be an AMT A&P with no student loans to pay back and not even know what a magneto is.

Keep up the good work AMTA and AMTS, you re making the AMT’s of the world proud. As for us A&P’s, well we will manage.