285 replies to this topic

[Hopeful]

john john, on 15 December 2011 - 07:43 AM, said:

I agree 110%
I lived it No need to explain to me.Try to explain it to the rest of your hire union busting machine

I meant to respond to 737....Just used your post as agreeing with it.

[john john]

Here is a little CWA agent history in bankrupisty court with the passenger service group


http://web.archive.o...t/PDFs/CWA2.pdf
http://web.archive.o...DFs/BKORDER.pdf
http://web.archive.o...t/PDFs/CWA1.pdf
http://web.archive.o...pdate 4 103.pdf
http://web.archive.o...ate 2 27 03.pdf
Stay informed good luck

[john john]

eolesen, on 15 December 2011 - 12:26 AM, said:

I could care less if they go union, but it's not going to gain them anything they don't already have. It might wind up costing a few things. Agents have a pretty liberal TL policy right now, and it has helped avoided seasonal layoffs. Put a CBA in place, and AA will probably furlough instead of bothering to look for TL. Home-based Res would probably go away in a heartbeat.

http://apsa6001.org/?p=115
Questions from Agents
I was recently told by my supervisor that we could lose our flexibility with a union. Is this true?

A. Only if you decide to negotiate your flexibility away. Let’s look at the facts. You will elect your negotiating team that will consist of agents from reservations. They will negotiate everything that pertains to wages, working conditions, and benefits. TL, Flex Time, and CS’s are items that would fall under working conditions. Most airline contracts expand on these items when negotiated and they have proven to be items that have saved the company money. If these save the company money why would the company insist you give them up when you already have them without a contract? In addition, would you vote for a contract that limits your flexibility? A contract will only pass once it has been voted favorable by more than 50% of the work force.

Fact: The company gave us many of these flexible items during our last union campaign to get us to not vote in the last election. Then later many restrictions were placed on them without a union. Everything that was taken away from us would have had to been negotiated if we had a union.

[damajagua]

Deleted

[john john]

damajagua, on 15 December 2011 - 02:08 PM, said:

Deleted

FACT: Union dues will not be collected until the first contract is negotiated and voted on by a majority. If the first contract is not voted in by the bargaining unit you go back to negotiations. Dues will not start until the bargaining unit votes yes . Would you vote for a contract that doesn’t improve working conditions, wages, and benefits?

[eolesen]

john john, on 15 December 2011 - 02:03 PM, said:

Let’s look at the facts. You will elect your negotiating team that will consist of agents from reservations. They will negotiate everything that pertains to wages, working conditions, and benefits. TL, Flex Time, and CS’s are items that would fall under working conditions. Most airline contracts expand on these items when negotiated and they have proven to be items that have saved the company money. If these save the company money why would the company insist you give them up when you already have them without a contract?

One sided facts always sound great.

What I know after 25 years of watching airlines is that whatever flexibility exists today due to "local policy" will evaporate once you have shop stewards trying to enforce a contract that has to be followed at every station.

Quote

Fact: The company gave us many of these flexible items during our last union campaign to get us to not vote in the last election. Then later many restrictions were placed on them without a union. Everything that was taken away from us would have had to been negotiated if we had a union.

Lie. I was an agent, and we had CS, Flex, TL, etc. long before the CWA tried it's first failed attempt at a card drive.

Oh, and for the record, CS has never been contractual for the TWU, so don't hold your breath on making it negotiable.

Still didn't answer how many times you guys have tried and failed...

[700UW]

john john, on 15 December 2011 - 06:35 AM, said:

The agents if certified will have a seat at the bargaining table with management and will be able to negotiate a contract like every other employee group at AA. It well be interresting to see how the bankrupisty courts will handle status quo if the agents certify CWA. The creditors committee is not were the contracts would be negotiate with labor.
What is a TL?

Better educate yourself, there is no status quo obligation for a newly certified group.

Better go check AMFA vs Atlantic Coast Airlines, Lee Seeham lost a case and now there is no status quo for a newly unionized group without a CBA.

Case Law

[eolesen]

john john, on 15 December 2011 - 09:18 AM, said:

Here is a little CWA agent history in bankrupisty court with the passenger service group


http://web.archive.o...t/PDFs/CWA2.pdf
http://web.archive.o...DFs/BKORDER.pdf
http://web.archive.o...t/PDFs/CWA1.pdf
http://web.archive.o...pdate 4 103.pdf
http://web.archive.o...ate 2 27 03.pdf
Stay informed good luck

I finally had time to look at those links... two are briefs submitted by the CWA's attorney, two are newsletters, and one is the order allowing US to impose pay cuts and new working conditions.

The only thing they show is that the CWA couldn't prevent a 21% pay cut being imposed by the court.

It's the agents' right to organize if they choose to, but I think it would be a huge mistake to do so. I'm sure the outsourcing flag will be waved, but to me it's a red herring.

AA stopped functional outsourcing at airports when Don O'Hare retired, which was some time in the 1990's. The only functions still outsourced that I recall are baggage service in the hubs. The trend of outsourcing call centers jobs to India & Asia seems to have reversed in just about every sector, so I also wouldn't expect that to happen with the existing res offices. Where exactly is the threat?