13 replies to this topic

[Buck]

Run the Pension Calculator using 12/01/2011 in the first date box and the date when you will attain age 60 in the second. Make a copy and put it away. Assuming that the full retiement is accepted atage 60, as it was at bankruptcy filing. I have recently seen some statements indicatingthis in the American threads. BTW I am a Tulsa AMT in OH.

[xUT]

Harvey, on 07 December 2011 - 01:01 PM, said:

AA Tulsa Mechanic, on 30 November 2011 - 03:35 PM, said:

First off hello, I am an aircraft mechanic with American Airlines at the overhaul base in Tulsa Oklahoma. I have 20 years in now and am for obvious reasons worried about what will happen during the bankruptcy as I have never been through one before.

I have looked high and low on the internet for answers specifically what happened to United aircraft mechanics during and after the bankruptcy. I hope some of you can help.

How many mechanics lost their jobs and did not return?

How much of a pay cut did you take?

Did you lose your pension?

What happened with your medical benefits?

What kind of work rule changes were implemented?

I really appreciate if anyone can help answer some of my questions.

Thank you.

Just about the pensions the guy who said he only lost about $400.00 a month that might be true for someone that was about to retire with 30 years or longer. Someone with around 20 years the pension frooze so your multiplyer also frooze you didn't reach max so if you were hoping for $3000.00 - $4000.00 a month you lost about two thirds of it and will get around $1200.00 a month... AA numbers will depend on your multiplyers and max out

Sorry Harvey, but you are wrong. I get a little over $1K a month.
I retired at 55 years old so get a huge penalty from the 65 max (My Choice).
My DOH was 10/1985, PBGC took pensions on March 11, 2005.
That gave me less than 19 years retirement eligibility (first year doesn't count).
At plan termination, we had the recent PEB contract that increased retirement but because of the 5 look back clause, I lost about $400 a month.

UAL had 'other optional plans' (Such as income leveling to SS age, etc...) that were recognized by the PBGC "IF" taken prior to termination (still subject to the look back clause). Otherwise, plans defaulted to the 'Book Rate'.
I have no idea where you get your disinformation.
xUT

[xUT]

Buck, on 27 December 2011 - 12:41 PM, said:

Run the Pension Calculator using 12/01/2011 in the first date box and the date when you will attain age 60 in the second. Make a copy and put it away. Assuming that the full retiement is accepted atage 60, as it was at bankruptcy filing. I have recently seen some statements indicatingthis in the American threads. BTW I am a Tulsa AMT in OH.

BK filing has nothing to do with plan termination (other than being the 'tool') the day the PBGC 'accepts' plan determination is the drop dead date (no pun intended).
JMHO,
xUT

[xUT]

(December 15, 2007 ) PBGC Pension Termination: A Worker's Perspective by Terry O'Rourke, United airlines

Excerpt:

Quote

United Airlines (UAL) and the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation (PBGC) made a dirty deal to eliminate our company pensions and replace them with anemic PBGC pensions. The co-conspirators agreed to a pension termination that served them well but dealt a devastating blow to UAL employees. We learned about the self-serving deal from an April 22, 2005 press release issued by the PBGC and the media coverage the press release generated.

The agreement would be confirmed by the bankruptcy court less than one month later, on May 10, 2005.

The PBGC/UAL pension termination agreement provides a clear example of the corporate-run government's attack on workers taking place in this country. The PBGC minimized the damage to its coffers by trading its rights for UAL's money at the expense of the very constituents it claims to serve.

The agency, led by Bush appointees, sided with corporate interests over working people. UAL cut $10 billion of debt off its balance sheet for pennies on the dollar. The courts then completely cooperated, awarding UAL the necessary rulings in bankruptcy and denying all worker legal attempts to mitigate its damages. What options are left to workers?

As a UAL employee and an editor of a mechanics' union publication (Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association Local
9 WayPoints, online at www.amfa9.org/waypoints), I followed and wrote about this story as it happened. This article looks at a pension termination from ground level, from a worker's point of view, and draws some lessons that we've learned from our experiences.

Please read the rest of the article.
xUT

[xUT]

xUT, on 27 December 2011 - 08:17 PM, said:

BK filing has nothing to do with plan termination (other than being the 'tool') the day the PBGC 'accepts' plan determination is the drop dead date (no pun intended).
JMHO,
xUT

I stand corrected:

http://www.pbgc.gov/...d-benefits.html

Quote

If the plan terminated while your employer was in a bankruptcy proceeding that began on or after September 16, 2006, guarantees are determined as of the date your employer’s bankruptcy proceeding began.

xUT

[topDawg]

Not United but here is some info on Delta.

http://www.bizjourna...4.html?page=all